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A naive view, at best. You're forgetting all about politics and special interests. > We can't leave it to intuitions of the masses. Precisely the mindset of t

A naive view, at best. You're forgetting all about politics and special interests. > We can't leave it to intuitions of the masses. Precisely the mindset of the power elite that gets us into so much trouble.

enlightenedfool 11y ago
Well, take vaccinations for example. Would you better leave it to the people to decide? I'm sure half won't take them. EDIT: I do understand the corporate influence, but we could find a way to build unbiased scientific institutions if with collective global will.
- lackbeard 11y ago
  Letting people choose to not vaccinate their children will self correct. We'll lose herd immunity, a lot of people will die, and then everyone will know how awesome vaccines are, just like they did in the 60s. Then the cycle will begin anew. I lean toward valuing individual rights over all else, but this scenario does present a serious challenge to that worldview. Another contributor to the problem is that people trust science a lot less today than 2 generations ago. They've seen the negative results of a lot of fraud that has been perpetuated under the banner of "science". (E.g. "scientific socialism", the food pyramid, most of psychology, etc...)
- chrisan 11y ago
  Or insurance. "I don't need that, I will never ____!"
toolz 11y ago
What do you mean 'so much trouble'? We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives, hurting each other lessand doing better by just about all metrics. The only thing that seems to be going downhill is our mental health, and I would argue that's simply because we have more diagnosis recorded, rather than those things simply not existing in the past. Could we be getting better at a faster rate, as a species? Most likely, but it's not like we've halted progress or something.
- clarkmoody 11y ago
  > We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives, hurting each other lessand doing better by just about all metrics. Totally agree. But are those improvements due to the decisions of central planners? > What do you mean 'so much trouble'? Things that come to mind: abysmal outcomes for many in the public school system; skyrocketing prices in healthcare; urban families almost completely destroyed by paternalistic welfare programs; massive suffering and death caused by the warfare state; shredding of the Bill of Rights by the TSA; economic calamity caused by Fed-fueled booms and busts; etc. Look at the places with the worst outcomes and you will find the most government involvement.
  - kbenson 11y ago
    > Look at the places with the worst outcomes and you will find the most government involvement. Of course. That doesn't mean they are the problem. It's entirely plausible they are involved because there's a problem. In a system with honey, bees and bears, just because you often see bears involved with honey doesn't mean they are responsible for its creation.
- ekianjo 11y ago
  > We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives LOL, really ? There are more and more obese people in the US, does that count as getting healthier ? What are your metrics exactly ? As for living longer lives, that's already clearly proven most of the life expectancy gains happened since we reduced infant mortality to minimum levels, raising therefore lifetime for all individuals on average.

enlightenedfool 11y ago

Well, take vaccinations for example. Would you better leave it to the people to decide? I'm sure half won't take them. EDIT: I do understand the corporate influence, but we could find a way to build unbiased scientific institutions if with collective global will.

lackbeard 11y ago
Letting people choose to not vaccinate their children will self correct. We'll lose herd immunity, a lot of people will die, and then everyone will know how awesome vaccines are, just like they did in the 60s. Then the cycle will begin anew. I lean toward valuing individual rights over all else, but this scenario does present a serious challenge to that worldview. Another contributor to the problem is that people trust science a lot less today than 2 generations ago. They've seen the negative results of a lot of fraud that has been perpetuated under the banner of "science". (E.g. "scientific socialism", the food pyramid, most of psychology, etc...)
chrisan 11y ago
Or insurance. "I don't need that, I will never ____!"

toolz 11y ago

What do you mean 'so much trouble'? We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives, hurting each other lessand doing better by just about all metrics. The only thing that seems to be going downhill is our mental health, and I would argue that's simply because we have more diagnosis recorded, rather than those things simply not existing in the past. Could we be getting better at a faster rate, as a species? Most likely, but it's not like we've halted progress or something.

clarkmoody 11y ago
> We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives, hurting each other lessand doing better by just about all metrics. Totally agree. But are those improvements due to the decisions of central planners? > What do you mean 'so much trouble'? Things that come to mind: abysmal outcomes for many in the public school system; skyrocketing prices in healthcare; urban families almost completely destroyed by paternalistic welfare programs; massive suffering and death caused by the warfare state; shredding of the Bill of Rights by the TSA; economic calamity caused by Fed-fueled booms and busts; etc. Look at the places with the worst outcomes and you will find the most government involvement.
- kbenson 11y ago
  > Look at the places with the worst outcomes and you will find the most government involvement. Of course. That doesn't mean they are the problem. It's entirely plausible they are involved because there's a problem. In a system with honey, bees and bears, just because you often see bears involved with honey doesn't mean they are responsible for its creation.
ekianjo 11y ago
> We're constantly getting healthier, living longer lives LOL, really ? There are more and more obese people in the US, does that count as getting healthier ? What are your metrics exactly ? As for living longer lives, that's already clearly proven most of the life expectancy gains happened since we reduced infant mortality to minimum levels, raising therefore lifetime for all individuals on average.