4 ms·

Except that it's not rubbish. Most people do spend large amounts of their paycheck on things they don't need. Just because he makes good money doesn't mean his

by kdamken 11y ago

Except that it's not rubbish. Most people do spend large amounts of their paycheck on things they don't need. Just because he makes good money doesn't mean his concepts of saving a large percentage of what you earn aren't sound. They apply to all income levels, even more so for the lower ones. Following his advice and sticking to a budget has gotten me from saving nothing every month to saving at least half of my take home on the same salary. Most people spend their money without thinking and then look for external sources to blame when they run out.

branchless 11y ago
He's not playing it straight. He's deriving income as a rentier but saying we can all live like him. We can't because rentier income by definition is income with zero value added. These guys hiding in the grey area are very damaging. Maybe you were a total fool with your money, but for most people they are on the breadline not because houses are expensive to construct, not because fuel is expensive but because they have to pay a significant portion of their labour to rentiers. People like this put the blame on the individual. No - it rests with the rentier.
- Elepsis 11y ago
  You are starting from the inexplicable premise that these properties he rents out were somehow ill-gotten, and not the direct consequence of him saving significant amounts of his income while he worked a totally normal job and investing them intelligently in property. And of course landlords (since you're obviously using rentier as a pejorative) DO provide a valuable service: housing to people who either value the flexibility of renting or don't have the finances to buy housing where they live. Your apparent disagreement with the entire system of rental property around the world is certainly principled, but singling out Mr. Money Mustache as some kind of hypocrite for earning money off his investments is absurd on its face. Are you also opposed to people buying dividend-issuing stocks?
lmm 11y ago
> Most people do spend large amounts of their paycheck on things they don't need. Maybe. Or maybe they're spending their paycheck on things that they do need because they have to work for a living, they can't live by renting out their assets like MMM can. Example from the other branch: MMM can say "buy a bike instead of a new car" because he had the privilege of putting his "job" (rental properties) as close as he liked to his house. Most people don't have that option.
- kdamken 11y ago
  Yes, we all have bills that need to be paid. But many people (especially those who aren't making great money) continually and stupidly buy stuff they don't need, not even realizing they can't afford it. You make 35k a year? Then you really shouldn't be buying a brand new iPhone with a large data plan, or a new car with monthly payments that eat away at your already limited income. Or maybe instead of going out for lunch everyday for work, you should pack something. People love to complain about not having money without taking any responsibility for their spending habits. Also, if you've read more of his stuff you'd know he worked for a decade before he retired, saving up a significant portion of his income by staying frugal. He didn't just magically have two houses to rent out. I'm not sure where the insane hatred towards renting out a property is coming from. A lot of the time the landlord doesn't actually make much money off of it. Even if the rent covers their mortgage payment (which it often doesn't), if something serious breaks or needs to be repaired, they're on the hook for that and may end up losing money on it that year.
  - ghaff 11y ago
    I'm really not sure how this thread turned into a honeypot for "Kill the landlord" types. Especially given how things turned out the last time public policy decided to make it relatively easy to get mortgages even for people who were a bit shaky on being able to make regular payments and cover upkeep.
    - branchless 11y ago
      Again this is totally the wrong end of the stick. We have loose credit, that's what rentiers love. Credit is a claim on your labour and they can issue it with zero effort. Sub-prime hurt the poor, since 2008 with QE we've seen the gap widen as more banker credit is created and flows into land prices.

by kdamken 11y ago

branchless 11y ago

He's not playing it straight. He's deriving income as a rentier but saying we can all live like him. We can't because rentier income by definition is income with zero value added. These guys hiding in the grey area are very damaging. Maybe you were a total fool with your money, but for most people they are on the breadline not because houses are expensive to construct, not because fuel is expensive but because they have to pay a significant portion of their labour to rentiers. People like this put the blame on the individual. No - it rests with the rentier.

Elepsis 11y ago
You are starting from the inexplicable premise that these properties he rents out were somehow ill-gotten, and not the direct consequence of him saving significant amounts of his income while he worked a totally normal job and investing them intelligently in property. And of course landlords (since you're obviously using rentier as a pejorative) DO provide a valuable service: housing to people who either value the flexibility of renting or don't have the finances to buy housing where they live. Your apparent disagreement with the entire system of rental property around the world is certainly principled, but singling out Mr. Money Mustache as some kind of hypocrite for earning money off his investments is absurd on its face. Are you also opposed to people buying dividend-issuing stocks?

lmm 11y ago

> Most people do spend large amounts of their paycheck on things they don't need. Maybe. Or maybe they're spending their paycheck on things that they do need because they have to work for a living, they can't live by renting out their assets like MMM can. Example from the other branch: MMM can say "buy a bike instead of a new car" because he had the privilege of putting his "job" (rental properties) as close as he liked to his house. Most people don't have that option.

kdamken 11y ago
Yes, we all have bills that need to be paid. But many people (especially those who aren't making great money) continually and stupidly buy stuff they don't need, not even realizing they can't afford it. You make 35k a year? Then you really shouldn't be buying a brand new iPhone with a large data plan, or a new car with monthly payments that eat away at your already limited income. Or maybe instead of going out for lunch everyday for work, you should pack something. People love to complain about not having money without taking any responsibility for their spending habits. Also, if you've read more of his stuff you'd know he worked for a decade before he retired, saving up a significant portion of his income by staying frugal. He didn't just magically have two houses to rent out. I'm not sure where the insane hatred towards renting out a property is coming from. A lot of the time the landlord doesn't actually make much money off of it. Even if the rent covers their mortgage payment (which it often doesn't), if something serious breaks or needs to be repaired, they're on the hook for that and may end up losing money on it that year.
- ghaff 11y ago
  I'm really not sure how this thread turned into a honeypot for "Kill the landlord" types. Especially given how things turned out the last time public policy decided to make it relatively easy to get mortgages even for people who were a bit shaky on being able to make regular payments and cover upkeep.
  - branchless 11y ago
    Again this is totally the wrong end of the stick. We have loose credit, that's what rentiers love. Credit is a claim on your labour and they can issue it with zero effort. Sub-prime hurt the poor, since 2008 with QE we've seen the gap widen as more banker credit is created and flows into land prices.