5 ms·

I don't get it. Is the article exaggerating things? How can you function without feeling emotions? What is your motivation for getting married? Getting a job? P

by _nedR 11y ago

I don't get it. Is the article exaggerating things? How can you function without feeling emotions? What is your motivation for getting married? Getting a job? Playing a game or watching a movie? Succeeding at any task? What is your reward mechanism? For example "All week he had been struggling to produce the right sound effects," How would you even know you hit the right sound effect? What is your judgement for good or bad on something that is subjective?

dingaling 11y ago
I think most of those examples have a rational basis and the non-emotional person could probably make better decisions than the rest of us e.g. choosing a job offer on the basis of benefits and prospects rather than because the office looked cool. Such a person would make an astounding diplomat. The reward mechanism would probably be in maximizing physical comfort in return for minimal physical effort.
- mikeash 11y ago
  Without emotions, what would cause a person to prefer physical comfort over physical discomfort?
  - StavrosK 11y ago
    Comfort and discomfort aren't emotions. Pain isn't an emotion, and the absence of pain is desirable by people who don't have emotions.
    - _nedR 11y ago
      Pain, hunger, sexual urges, etc. can't be classified by emotions. Maybe we can include fear of injury or death in this as well. Even a baby can feel these things (except of course sexual urges). But beyond that everything else is an emotion - happiness, sadness, anger, annoyance, loneliness. Beyond the most basic tasks everything requires emotions to drive you. Why do you study for an upcoming exam? Because you are anxious about getting a good grade? Why are you anxious? Because you may not want to upset your parents? Why does that bother you? You love them or fear their displeasure. Why do you fear your parent's displeasure? Ignoring corporal punishment (which could be an avoidance of pain/injury), other reasons include wanting to avoid stress, or being upset when they confront you about it. And so on. You cannot get through life except the most basic functions (like avoiding pain, eating, sleeping, etc) without emotions. The article seems to equate the reduced perception of emotions to a total absence of them.
      - StavrosK 11y ago
        No, I study for an exam so I can get a degree so I can get a good job so I'll find it easier to have a more comfortable life. It's a purely rational choice.
  - jerf 11y ago
    This is one of those times that I'd remind everybody that words are labels that have no power on their own. "No emotions" does not necessarily mean "never experiences anything that could possibly be covered by any of the senses of the English word 'emotion'". When it really gets down to it, we don't have a great ability to distinguish between "comfort", "happiness", "satisfaction", or any of a dozen other related concepts in our own mental lives, let alone start getting really precise about analyzing somebody else's, let alone doing so to someone whose mental qualia appear to be substantially different than ours.
InclinedPlane 11y ago
One can still appreciate things on an intellectual level. A lot of people with depression experience something similar during depressive episodes. It's like someone dialed down a knob on the intensity of the world. In the absolute worst case you decide life isn't worth living and follow through on that, it happens hundreds of thousands of times a year around the world. In better cases you don't give up and you do the best with the muted world you've been given to live in and you try to figure out ways to dial it back up (through CBT, exercise, drugs (legal and not), etc.)
coldtea 11y ago
>What is your motivation for getting married? "Other people are getting married. I guess I should go on with the program (shrug). Hmm, this person took an interest in me (or my friends/mother/etc hooked me up with this person), I could marry them maybe.". >Getting a job? Hmm, I feel physical hunger. Maybe I need to get a job. Hmm, here's a sign for help wanted. Maybe I can apply there. >Playing a game or watching a movie? I'm physically tired. Maybe I'll sit in front of the TV for a little while. People do that. >How would you even know you hit the right sound effect? - Jack, we need thunderstorm sounds and dogs barking in the distance. - OK, I know what those sound like. I'll try to replicate them. Let me find some thunderstorm recordings etc. (No emotions needed -- at best you just need to consider them "faithful reproductions" not to feel enthusiastic or whatever about them. Good, in this case, is quantifiable -- "sounds a lot like the real thing").
- ThomPete 11y ago
  Other people getting married is not something you would care about since you have not emotions. With regards to the thunderstorm thats not how it works. It's not the rational request thats the problem but the intuition around when it feels right. Emotions are fundamental to making any kind of creative decisions.
  - coldtea 11y ago
    >Other people getting married is not something you would care about since you have not emotions. They don't. They just copy what other people do because it's the default thing to do (everyone does it), and because they want to stop that annoyance (annoyance like we feel annoyance from a crappy seat belt or uncomfortamble shows, not emotional misery) and distraction (the nagging from other people, etc). No emotion mostly means that they aren't enthusiastic about getting married, and they are not miserable because they are not married either. You can conform to something just by thinking about it, you don't have to have any emotions on the matter. Same way people used to have arranged marriages back in the day (and still in some cultures). They didn't necessarily have any affection to the other person, not they had any great urge to get married. >With regards to the thunderstorm thats not how it works. It's not the rational request thats the problem but the intuition around when it feels right. You don't need to feel emotion-based intuition for when it "feels right". "Feels" is just a word we use to describe our selection process but it doesn't mean there have to be "feelings" involved. You just need to check that your sound effect sound as you remember those things to sound. No need to be dissapointed when they don't, or feel creative or elated when they do.
rightnow321 11y ago
It is really weird to be honest, I wouldn't say the other replies on this comment at the moment cover it so thought I would try and add something. On one had you're right those are genuine issues, there's little motivation to do anything really. I guess it is a spectrum but I still feel that if someone asks me to do something that I'm being a nice person if I do it, I guess others might be devoid of that. So if invited to do something I normally go, but I only originate plans if I feel I'm doing it for others e.g. if someone is visiting I'll setup a dinner for us all. At the end of a week when I've been busy I cab be annoyed at how much of my life is spent doing things for others, but I do know that's because I don't do anything at all for myself. I'm married and I wouldn't say I am because it's something expected of me. I think I want to be healthy mentally later in life and I know I can put the work in to give my wife a happy life, also that I didn't hide the way I am from her. If I didn't do these things it would be equivalent to just kind of giving up and I guess I haven't done that so I do these kind of things for future me who I want to be in a good place. I do love, I don't think it's quite the feeling love is to others but love/loss are recognisable. I work to succeed and for financial security basically, I can't fathom a job I "enjoy" but in my mind besides paying bills it's like a game and I win if I'm successful. A good way to think about it is when a big project finishes it's a bit weird for me because I don't really get happiness or pleasure or a sense of achievement from it, it's kind of like a vaccum. The day a system goes live is no different from day 1 on the project. Within the vaccum I just get hyper-critical of my performance I think my brain is thinking it's important to improve for next time and just immediately focusses on what it needs to do to make that happen. I do watch films/games, although not that much, but I like being distracted and having something to do. I watch twitch and sport where I do find it easy to support teams. I would never be upset after a result in sport or anything, I don't get nervous before or excited after a win but I like the pattern, which players are good/bad, analysing tactics, following the story etc. Reward mechanism - I don't think there's anything in my life like that I could google it but not sure what it means. I don't do anything to reward myself at all.
- skybrian 11y ago
  Are there decisions you have trouble making?
gress 11y ago
Punishment and reward are very limited mechanisms for learning behavior. Mimicry is one of the others and is much more powerful.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

by _nedR 11y ago

dingaling 11y ago

I think most of those examples have a rational basis and the non-emotional person could probably make better decisions than the rest of us e.g. choosing a job offer on the basis of benefits and prospects rather than because the office looked cool. Such a person would make an astounding diplomat. The reward mechanism would probably be in maximizing physical comfort in return for minimal physical effort.

mikeash 11y ago
Without emotions, what would cause a person to prefer physical comfort over physical discomfort?
- StavrosK 11y ago
  Comfort and discomfort aren't emotions. Pain isn't an emotion, and the absence of pain is desirable by people who don't have emotions.
  - _nedR 11y ago
    Pain, hunger, sexual urges, etc. can't be classified by emotions. Maybe we can include fear of injury or death in this as well. Even a baby can feel these things (except of course sexual urges). But beyond that everything else is an emotion - happiness, sadness, anger, annoyance, loneliness. Beyond the most basic tasks everything requires emotions to drive you. Why do you study for an upcoming exam? Because you are anxious about getting a good grade? Why are you anxious? Because you may not want to upset your parents? Why does that bother you? You love them or fear their displeasure. Why do you fear your parent's displeasure? Ignoring corporal punishment (which could be an avoidance of pain/injury), other reasons include wanting to avoid stress, or being upset when they confront you about it. And so on. You cannot get through life except the most basic functions (like avoiding pain, eating, sleeping, etc) without emotions. The article seems to equate the reduced perception of emotions to a total absence of them.
    - StavrosK 11y ago
      No, I study for an exam so I can get a degree so I can get a good job so I'll find it easier to have a more comfortable life. It's a purely rational choice.
- jerf 11y ago
  This is one of those times that I'd remind everybody that words are labels that have no power on their own. "No emotions" does not necessarily mean "never experiences anything that could possibly be covered by any of the senses of the English word 'emotion'". When it really gets down to it, we don't have a great ability to distinguish between "comfort", "happiness", "satisfaction", or any of a dozen other related concepts in our own mental lives, let alone start getting really precise about analyzing somebody else's, let alone doing so to someone whose mental qualia appear to be substantially different than ours.

InclinedPlane 11y ago

One can still appreciate things on an intellectual level. A lot of people with depression experience something similar during depressive episodes. It's like someone dialed down a knob on the intensity of the world. In the absolute worst case you decide life isn't worth living and follow through on that, it happens hundreds of thousands of times a year around the world. In better cases you don't give up and you do the best with the muted world you've been given to live in and you try to figure out ways to dial it back up (through CBT, exercise, drugs (legal and not), etc.)

coldtea 11y ago

>What is your motivation for getting married? "Other people are getting married. I guess I should go on with the program (shrug). Hmm, this person took an interest in me (or my friends/mother/etc hooked me up with this person), I could marry them maybe.". >Getting a job? Hmm, I feel physical hunger. Maybe I need to get a job. Hmm, here's a sign for help wanted. Maybe I can apply there. >Playing a game or watching a movie? I'm physically tired. Maybe I'll sit in front of the TV for a little while. People do that. >How would you even know you hit the right sound effect? - Jack, we need thunderstorm sounds and dogs barking in the distance. - OK, I know what those sound like. I'll try to replicate them. Let me find some thunderstorm recordings etc. (No emotions needed -- at best you just need to consider them "faithful reproductions" not to feel enthusiastic or whatever about them. Good, in this case, is quantifiable -- "sounds a lot like the real thing").

ThomPete 11y ago
Other people getting married is not something you would care about since you have not emotions. With regards to the thunderstorm thats not how it works. It's not the rational request thats the problem but the intuition around when it feels right. Emotions are fundamental to making any kind of creative decisions.
- coldtea 11y ago
  >Other people getting married is not something you would care about since you have not emotions. They don't. They just copy what other people do because it's the default thing to do (everyone does it), and because they want to stop that annoyance (annoyance like we feel annoyance from a crappy seat belt or uncomfortamble shows, not emotional misery) and distraction (the nagging from other people, etc). No emotion mostly means that they aren't enthusiastic about getting married, and they are not miserable because they are not married either. You can conform to something just by thinking about it, you don't have to have any emotions on the matter. Same way people used to have arranged marriages back in the day (and still in some cultures). They didn't necessarily have any affection to the other person, not they had any great urge to get married. >With regards to the thunderstorm thats not how it works. It's not the rational request thats the problem but the intuition around when it feels right. You don't need to feel emotion-based intuition for when it "feels right". "Feels" is just a word we use to describe our selection process but it doesn't mean there have to be "feelings" involved. You just need to check that your sound effect sound as you remember those things to sound. No need to be dissapointed when they don't, or feel creative or elated when they do.

rightnow321 11y ago

It is really weird to be honest, I wouldn't say the other replies on this comment at the moment cover it so thought I would try and add something. On one had you're right those are genuine issues, there's little motivation to do anything really. I guess it is a spectrum but I still feel that if someone asks me to do something that I'm being a nice person if I do it, I guess others might be devoid of that. So if invited to do something I normally go, but I only originate plans if I feel I'm doing it for others e.g. if someone is visiting I'll setup a dinner for us all. At the end of a week when I've been busy I cab be annoyed at how much of my life is spent doing things for others, but I do know that's because I don't do anything at all for myself. I'm married and I wouldn't say I am because it's something expected of me. I think I want to be healthy mentally later in life and I know I can put the work in to give my wife a happy life, also that I didn't hide the way I am from her. If I didn't do these things it would be equivalent to just kind of giving up and I guess I haven't done that so I do these kind of things for future me who I want to be in a good place. I do love, I don't think it's quite the feeling love is to others but love/loss are recognisable. I work to succeed and for financial security basically, I can't fathom a job I "enjoy" but in my mind besides paying bills it's like a game and I win if I'm successful. A good way to think about it is when a big project finishes it's a bit weird for me because I don't really get happiness or pleasure or a sense of achievement from it, it's kind of like a vaccum. The day a system goes live is no different from day 1 on the project. Within the vaccum I just get hyper-critical of my performance I think my brain is thinking it's important to improve for next time and just immediately focusses on what it needs to do to make that happen. I do watch films/games, although not that much, but I like being distracted and having something to do. I watch twitch and sport where I do find it easy to support teams. I would never be upset after a result in sport or anything, I don't get nervous before or excited after a win but I like the pattern, which players are good/bad, analysing tactics, following the story etc. Reward mechanism - I don't think there's anything in my life like that I could google it but not sure what it means. I don't do anything to reward myself at all.

skybrian 11y ago
Are there decisions you have trouble making?

gress 11y ago

Punishment and reward are very limited mechanisms for learning behavior. Mimicry is one of the others and is much more powerful.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]