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Walk into a store, and the salesclerks will know your name. - they already do once you scan your store card The store’s cameras and computers will have figure

Walk into a store, and the salesclerks will know your name. - they already do once you scan your store card The store’s cameras and computers will have figured out your identity, - store card and looked you up in both their store database and a commercial marketing database they’ve subscribed to. - store card again. They’ll know your name, - store card salary, - if you entered it and if you didn't lie when you filled out your store card form interests, - if you entered them and your didn't lie when you filled out your store card form what sort of sales pitches you’re most vulnerable to, - if the "deep data" / AI is actually correct and how profitable a customer you are. - store card Maybe they’ll have read a profile based on your tweets and know what sort of mood you’re in. - MAYBE. assuming the AI is anywhere near correct. Maybe they’ll know your political affiliation or sexual identity, - MAYBE, probably wrong. both predictable by your social media activity. - PROVE THIS. And they’re going to engage with you accordingly, perhaps by making sure you’re well taken care of or possibly by trying to make you so uncomfortable that you’ll leave.

tjr 11y ago
RMS has been advocating against using store cards for years. I guess in-store facial recognition could thwart the privacy efforts of people like him? (To some degree?)
- 15155 11y ago
  Unless he's using cash, make no mistake, his purchases are being tracked in some capacity. Why do you need a store card when a credit/debit card track has more than enough information to identify? - Card number (useful on its own as an identifier) - Name (not perfect, decent secondary info) Granted, these don't generally make for a super-continuous history on someone, but they're pretty decent for the average person for a year or two. Also, if you make any returns at one of these stores that you've previously used a CC, your real state-issued ID will be correlated with your purchases (via your CC). Also, if you do any online shopping with a retailer and use the same cards in the store: instant correlation. Checks? Necessarily correlated with DL and account numbers, even better than CCs. Outside of cash: there're just too many ways to establish purchase histories for most individuals.
  - tjr 11y ago
    Unless he's using cash He is.
mjquinn 11y ago
This is true, but I think it's an important distinction that store cards are typically opt-in (I haven't come across a store that requires such a card to shop there, except maybe Costco). A facial recognition system would, presumably, be automatic.
- jessaustin 11y ago
  The cellphone trackers that stores already have are automatic, too. Sure, one could leave it in the car, but does anyone do that?
NhanH 11y ago
If for no other reason, video is a much more ubiquitous format. And due to our social norm if an agency was to ask for video record for "some reasons" it would be far easier both technically and politically than asking Walmart to extract all customer data from date X to Y. Besides, your face is (for all practical purposes) all the data needed to identify exactly who you are, you name is just a few bit (albeit extremely discriminating one) of info and can have collisions. Being able to efficiently do thing that was possible but inefficient is a huge deal. Especially since the government was designed with inefficiency in mind as a check of power. Removing them means increasing their power, and absolute power corrupt absolutely.
swsieber 11y ago
Considering that Target can tell whether you're pregnant or not before you do based on your purchases, I'd assume that online habits encode your preferences a lot more strongly that one would like to think. More info on that weird pregnancy story: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1 http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.h...
- maxerickson 11y ago
  You've over stated things, Target makes the pregnancy prediction based on pregnancy related purchases, someone making those purchases is going to be aware they are pregnant. In the article, a father is outraged that his teenaged daughter received an ad for baby clothes and complained to a store manager, he didn't know his daughter was pregnant.
- vonmoltke 11y ago
  They can't tell "before you do". They can tell before you tell people, but the woman needs to know she's pregnant before her habits change.
  - IanCal 11y ago
    That's definitely true in this story, but is this general statement true? > the woman needs to know she's pregnant before her habits change. There are always stories of people who don't realise they're pregnant, do their habits change in a reasonably identifiable way? This wasn't particularly relevant to the point, I just wondered and thought it was an interesting question.
YeGoblynQueenne 11y ago
>> Maybe they’ll know your political affiliation or sexual identity, >> - MAYBE, probably wrong. >> both predictable by your social media activity. >> - PROVE THIS. There's plenty of work on that, google "link mining" or "entity resolution". Or have a look at this video for an introduction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn91Jbc5UV0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn91Jbc5UV0 But the point is really not whether your sexuality or political affiliation, or whatever characteristic is _really_ predictable. What is important is that people will _think_ they can predict it and then act accordingly- and treat you unfairly based on the knowledge they think they have. The technology is certainly advanced enough and complex enough that a good salesperson can sell it to people who can't ever hope to understand it. In other words: it's consumer-ready as Google might say.

tjr 11y ago

RMS has been advocating against using store cards for years. I guess in-store facial recognition could thwart the privacy efforts of people like him? (To some degree?)

15155 11y ago
Unless he's using cash, make no mistake, his purchases are being tracked in some capacity. Why do you need a store card when a credit/debit card track has more than enough information to identify? - Card number (useful on its own as an identifier) - Name (not perfect, decent secondary info) Granted, these don't generally make for a super-continuous history on someone, but they're pretty decent for the average person for a year or two. Also, if you make any returns at one of these stores that you've previously used a CC, your real state-issued ID will be correlated with your purchases (via your CC). Also, if you do any online shopping with a retailer and use the same cards in the store: instant correlation. Checks? Necessarily correlated with DL and account numbers, even better than CCs. Outside of cash: there're just too many ways to establish purchase histories for most individuals.
- tjr 11y ago
  Unless he's using cash He is.

mjquinn 11y ago

This is true, but I think it's an important distinction that store cards are typically opt-in (I haven't come across a store that requires such a card to shop there, except maybe Costco). A facial recognition system would, presumably, be automatic.

jessaustin 11y ago
The cellphone trackers that stores already have are automatic, too. Sure, one could leave it in the car, but does anyone do that?

NhanH 11y ago

If for no other reason, video is a much more ubiquitous format. And due to our social norm if an agency was to ask for video record for "some reasons" it would be far easier both technically and politically than asking Walmart to extract all customer data from date X to Y. Besides, your face is (for all practical purposes) all the data needed to identify exactly who you are, you name is just a few bit (albeit extremely discriminating one) of info and can have collisions. Being able to efficiently do thing that was possible but inefficient is a huge deal. Especially since the government was designed with inefficiency in mind as a check of power. Removing them means increasing their power, and absolute power corrupt absolutely.

swsieber 11y ago

Considering that Target can tell whether you're pregnant or not before you do based on your purchases, I'd assume that online habits encode your preferences a lot more strongly that one would like to think. More info on that weird pregnancy story: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1 http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.h...

maxerickson 11y ago
You've over stated things, Target makes the pregnancy prediction based on pregnancy related purchases, someone making those purchases is going to be aware they are pregnant. In the article, a father is outraged that his teenaged daughter received an ad for baby clothes and complained to a store manager, he didn't know his daughter was pregnant.
vonmoltke 11y ago
They can't tell "before you do". They can tell before you tell people, but the woman needs to know she's pregnant before her habits change.
- IanCal 11y ago
  That's definitely true in this story, but is this general statement true? > the woman needs to know she's pregnant before her habits change. There are always stories of people who don't realise they're pregnant, do their habits change in a reasonably identifiable way? This wasn't particularly relevant to the point, I just wondered and thought it was an interesting question.

YeGoblynQueenne 11y ago

>> Maybe they’ll know your political affiliation or sexual identity, >> - MAYBE, probably wrong. >> both predictable by your social media activity. >> - PROVE THIS. There's plenty of work on that, google "link mining" or "entity resolution". Or have a look at this video for an introduction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn91Jbc5UV0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn91Jbc5UV0 But the point is really not whether your sexuality or political affiliation, or whatever characteristic is _really_ predictable. What is important is that people will _think_ they can predict it and then act accordingly- and treat you unfairly based on the knowledge they think they have. The technology is certainly advanced enough and complex enough that a good salesperson can sell it to people who can't ever hope to understand it. In other words: it's consumer-ready as Google might say.