6 ms·

People who are not rich don't want to live in Russia (forever, together with all their family) either. Some might say they do, but don't believe them just yet,

People who are not rich don't want to live in Russia (forever, together with all their family) either. Some might say they do, but don't believe them just yet, watch them a bit when some opportunity will present itself. And I also doubt that "most other countries" do that on Russian scale. British and Swiss schools have just so many places, and those are already occupied by ruskies. Surely there are some. Kims study in Switzerland I've read.

coldtea 11y ago
>Some might say they do, but don't believe them just yet, watch them a bit when some opportunity will present itself. If there's an "opportunity" then it doesn't really count in the same way. Would a Walmart worker living in some US state go elsewhere if "an opportunity presented itself" (e.g. new job, make more money there etc)? I'd say a lot, or most, would. That's not because Russia is some unique hell, but because of shared characteristics in lots of other places, unemployment, poverty, etc. People might see Russia strangely as some "superpower" (owing to Cold War BS mythologies), but in fact they are a developing country first and foremost. >And I also doubt that "most other countries" do that on Russian scale. British and Swiss schools have just so many places, and those are already occupied by ruskies. Indian and Eastern Asian (Korean, Japanese, Chinese, Taiwanese, Indonesian, etc) elites have for ages sent their kids abroad. British and Swiss schools are choke full of them. Same for rich upper class kids from Eastern Europe and places like Portugal, Greece, etc.
- guard-of-terra 11y ago
  Russia is a pretty unique kind of hell. People who are not affected by unemployment and poverty are leaving. If you're successful, leaving is a logical choice that you have to consider. Russian emigration is white collar contrary to most of other "developing countries'" emigration. Russia is not a developing country. Russia is a crumbling country with a long history of failures and no clear future prospects. While it is true that people leave e.g. India, there's more people in India who get richer and happier staying in India, and there's still a lot of people who come to stay in India because weather is nice, food is tasty, accomodation is cheap and culture is interesting. Neither of that is much true for Russia. Only people who come is uncontrolled muslim work migrants from Central Asia, and even those are now leaving.
  - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
    Agreed. Successful Indian immigrants that I know, usually return to India. So something about India is attractive in itself. Russia has an epidemic of suicide-by-misadventure, which is a strong indicator of hopelessness among the young.
    - coldtea 11y ago
      >So something about India is attractive in itself. Just that they are accustomed to that culture (on an everyday-life basis). It's pretty unique and far less western that Russia's culture (which is mostly shared with European and Eastern European culture) is, so those traditionally inclined feel a better cultural fit there than in the West. Beyond that, India is way worse of than Russia in quality of life for hundrends of millions of its population.
      - guard-of-terra 11y ago
        As you can see there's no place for Russia: People who can live in Russia culturally also can live in Europe/USA, and it's just better. Thus only thing preventing Russia from becoming hollow place is laziness. Quality of life is tricky. Russia combines African life expectancy with Japanese birth rate. If you are aged 5 and onwards (skipped child mortality) you perhaps have longer life expectancy in India than in Russia, and that's been true for decades. Quality of life should get a heavy discount for surviving Russian winter. Yes, compared to hundred million of Indians, you sometimes lay your hands on some money. Which also fuels emigration.
  - coldtea 11y ago
    Don't know where you got those ideas about Russia, but asking people that immigrated out of the country or who don't like it, is not exactly representative. A common mistake of people in the West is to only talk to think-alike westernized versions of themselves from other countries (found in tech, social media etc), creating an echo chamber that's as representative of the other country as talking to some Williamsburg hipster is for somebody in Kentucky or Idaho.
- guard-of-terra 11y ago
  Also, I have to say, sending kids to school abroad is one thing. But relocating your whole family to another country with no plans for them to ever return is quite another thing. They have plan to earn (or steal) just enough money for them and their offspring to continue living in "normal country" when the time comes.

coldtea 11y ago

>Some might say they do, but don't believe them just yet, watch them a bit when some opportunity will present itself. If there's an "opportunity" then it doesn't really count in the same way. Would a Walmart worker living in some US state go elsewhere if "an opportunity presented itself" (e.g. new job, make more money there etc)? I'd say a lot, or most, would. That's not because Russia is some unique hell, but because of shared characteristics in lots of other places, unemployment, poverty, etc. People might see Russia strangely as some "superpower" (owing to Cold War BS mythologies), but in fact they are a developing country first and foremost. >And I also doubt that "most other countries" do that on Russian scale. British and Swiss schools have just so many places, and those are already occupied by ruskies. Indian and Eastern Asian (Korean, Japanese, Chinese, Taiwanese, Indonesian, etc) elites have for ages sent their kids abroad. British and Swiss schools are choke full of them. Same for rich upper class kids from Eastern Europe and places like Portugal, Greece, etc.

guard-of-terra 11y ago
Russia is a pretty unique kind of hell. People who are not affected by unemployment and poverty are leaving. If you're successful, leaving is a logical choice that you have to consider. Russian emigration is white collar contrary to most of other "developing countries'" emigration. Russia is not a developing country. Russia is a crumbling country with a long history of failures and no clear future prospects. While it is true that people leave e.g. India, there's more people in India who get richer and happier staying in India, and there's still a lot of people who come to stay in India because weather is nice, food is tasty, accomodation is cheap and culture is interesting. Neither of that is much true for Russia. Only people who come is uncontrolled muslim work migrants from Central Asia, and even those are now leaving.
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  Agreed. Successful Indian immigrants that I know, usually return to India. So something about India is attractive in itself. Russia has an epidemic of suicide-by-misadventure, which is a strong indicator of hopelessness among the young.
  - coldtea 11y ago
    >So something about India is attractive in itself. Just that they are accustomed to that culture (on an everyday-life basis). It's pretty unique and far less western that Russia's culture (which is mostly shared with European and Eastern European culture) is, so those traditionally inclined feel a better cultural fit there than in the West. Beyond that, India is way worse of than Russia in quality of life for hundrends of millions of its population.
    - guard-of-terra 11y ago
      As you can see there's no place for Russia: People who can live in Russia culturally also can live in Europe/USA, and it's just better. Thus only thing preventing Russia from becoming hollow place is laziness. Quality of life is tricky. Russia combines African life expectancy with Japanese birth rate. If you are aged 5 and onwards (skipped child mortality) you perhaps have longer life expectancy in India than in Russia, and that's been true for decades. Quality of life should get a heavy discount for surviving Russian winter. Yes, compared to hundred million of Indians, you sometimes lay your hands on some money. Which also fuels emigration.
- coldtea 11y ago
  Don't know where you got those ideas about Russia, but asking people that immigrated out of the country or who don't like it, is not exactly representative. A common mistake of people in the West is to only talk to think-alike westernized versions of themselves from other countries (found in tech, social media etc), creating an echo chamber that's as representative of the other country as talking to some Williamsburg hipster is for somebody in Kentucky or Idaho.
guard-of-terra 11y ago
Also, I have to say, sending kids to school abroad is one thing. But relocating your whole family to another country with no plans for them to ever return is quite another thing. They have plan to earn (or steal) just enough money for them and their offspring to continue living in "normal country" when the time comes.