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>* Implicitly accepting the idea that SAT or ACT scores are the only metric on which students ought to be judged for making admissions decisions. (Okay they men

>* Implicitly accepting the idea that SAT or ACT scores are the only metric on which students ought to be judged for making admissions decisions. (Okay they mentioned "extracurriculars" and I was amused by the Northwestern person who said recruiters were looking for people who played lacrosse and rowed crew. But all the data mentioned were based on test scores alone.) What other metrics are you referring to besides academic performance? The color of the skin? Obviously not. But this sentence implies something else. It admits that asians deliver superior performance in terms of test scores but that there must be some other metric that causes Ivy leagues to dismiss them. I would like to know what that metric is. What is the supposed metric that asians are inferior to other races at that causes their superior test scores to be completely dismissed? Do you know the answer? Can anyone else answer it?

wozniacki 11y ago
From the horse's mouth: “We could fill our class twice over with valedictorians,” Harvard President Drew Gilpin Faust told an audience at the Aspen Ideas Festival, sponsored by the Aspen Institute and The Atlantic, on Monday. That means admissions officers rely on intangibles like interesting essays or particularly unusual recommendations to decide who comprises the 5.9 percent of applicants who get in. Faust's top tip for raising a Harvard man or woman: “Make your children interesting!” For parents and students alike, that’s both good news and bad news. The bad news is that of course it’s much easier to say that than to actually make it happen, though Faust recommended encouraging children to follow their passions as a way to develop an interesting personality. It’s much easier to complete a checklist, however daunting, than to actually be interesting.[1] [1] How to Get Into Harvard http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/ http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-...
- pointeroffact 11y ago
  in other words, use unclear and vague criteria to judge admissions that just happen to massively disadvantage asian americans. it's strange that Faust is not condemned for her absurd and racist suggestion that asian american applicants are on average much less "interesting" people.
  - puredemo 11y ago
    "All these Asian applicants look the same..." Seems to be her meta-message.
    - mildbow 11y ago
      "All these Asians look the same..." Another win for casual racism. College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria. Because yeah, obviously human foibles always creep in.
      - FlannelPancake 11y ago
        > College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria Like GPA and SAT/ACT scores? Because they tried that. Secondary education is too easy and variable in the US, and Harvard can't really do much about that.
        duncanawoods 11y ago
        How about Harvard specific entrance exams? I did extra exams for Cambridge.
    - wozniacki 11y ago
      Not to put too fine a point on it, but 20% of those admitted were Asian American, for the class of 2019, in a country where less than 5%, self-identify as Asian-American.[1][2] https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics [1] http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/#comment-1462718053 http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-... [2] http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/#comment-1462720720 http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-...
      - jerrickhoang 11y ago
        Yeah, but that doesn't mean there couldn't be more.
xname 11y ago
Exactly, those people want to imply asians are ONLY good at tests, but they have no data to back it up. The only thing they can say is: well, you know, there must be something wrong with aisans, ... The easiest solution: use anonymous review process in college admission.
superuser2 11y ago
Admissions offices curate the incoming class. In doing so, they have multiple objectives: maintain a high standard of intellectual ability and engagement, admit a heterogeneous student body so that people are exposed to others who are not like them, and preserve the particular character of the institution (a specific brandy of nerdy at Columbia/Chicago, the hacker ethos at MIT, etc). An admitted class that's mostly homogeneous (in race, interests, gender, whatever) is just as much of a failure as an admitted class that's stupid. The purpose of an elite college's admissions office is not to admit the top N students on some metrics, nor is elite college your "just reward" for being in the top N percent of your year on some metrics. As with tech employment, there is an element of having the specialization an employer wants, an element of "culture fit," and an element of being able to do the song-and-dance that appeases the gatekeepers (the SAT is a lot like a coding interview). As with dating, it's not "academic performance in, admissions out." The college has a personality too, and it has to like you.

wozniacki 11y ago

From the horse's mouth: “We could fill our class twice over with valedictorians,” Harvard President Drew Gilpin Faust told an audience at the Aspen Ideas Festival, sponsored by the Aspen Institute and The Atlantic, on Monday. That means admissions officers rely on intangibles like interesting essays or particularly unusual recommendations to decide who comprises the 5.9 percent of applicants who get in. Faust's top tip for raising a Harvard man or woman: “Make your children interesting!” For parents and students alike, that’s both good news and bad news. The bad news is that of course it’s much easier to say that than to actually make it happen, though Faust recommended encouraging children to follow their passions as a way to develop an interesting personality. It’s much easier to complete a checklist, however daunting, than to actually be interesting.[1] [1] How to Get Into Harvard http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/ http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-...

pointeroffact 11y ago
in other words, use unclear and vague criteria to judge admissions that just happen to massively disadvantage asian americans. it's strange that Faust is not condemned for her absurd and racist suggestion that asian american applicants are on average much less "interesting" people.
- puredemo 11y ago
  "All these Asian applicants look the same..." Seems to be her meta-message.
  - mildbow 11y ago
    "All these Asians look the same..." Another win for casual racism. College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria. Because yeah, obviously human foibles always creep in.
    - FlannelPancake 11y ago
      > College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria Like GPA and SAT/ACT scores? Because they tried that. Secondary education is too easy and variable in the US, and Harvard can't really do much about that.
      - duncanawoods 11y ago
        How about Harvard specific entrance exams? I did extra exams for Cambridge.
  - wozniacki 11y ago
    Not to put too fine a point on it, but 20% of those admitted were Asian American, for the class of 2019, in a country where less than 5%, self-identify as Asian-American.[1][2] https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics [1] http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/#comment-1462718053 http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-... [2] http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-get-into-harvard/373726/#comment-1462720720 http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/06/how-to-...
    - jerrickhoang 11y ago
      Yeah, but that doesn't mean there couldn't be more.

xname 11y ago

Exactly, those people want to imply asians are ONLY good at tests, but they have no data to back it up. The only thing they can say is: well, you know, there must be something wrong with aisans, ... The easiest solution: use anonymous review process in college admission.

superuser2 11y ago

Admissions offices curate the incoming class. In doing so, they have multiple objectives: maintain a high standard of intellectual ability and engagement, admit a heterogeneous student body so that people are exposed to others who are not like them, and preserve the particular character of the institution (a specific brandy of nerdy at Columbia/Chicago, the hacker ethos at MIT, etc). An admitted class that's mostly homogeneous (in race, interests, gender, whatever) is just as much of a failure as an admitted class that's stupid. The purpose of an elite college's admissions office is not to admit the top N students on some metrics, nor is elite college your "just reward" for being in the top N percent of your year on some metrics. As with tech employment, there is an element of having the specialization an employer wants, an element of "culture fit," and an element of being able to do the song-and-dance that appeases the gatekeepers (the SAT is a lot like a coding interview). As with dating, it's not "academic performance in, admissions out." The college has a personality too, and it has to like you.