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The white-man effect: How foreigner presence affects behavior in experiments
- jessaustin 11y agoWould "white-person" be more accurate here? Do the authors intend to suggest that gender contributes to the effect they claim? [edit: removed silly question]
- fein 11y agoI think we all understand what the author meant by "white-man". There has to be some term for this... The making of unneeded comments on an article that have nothing to do with the study; PC Pedantry perhaps. At least one of the authors is a woman.
- rakoo 11y agoGood ol' bikeshedding here.
- forrestthewoods 11y agoI'd be pretty happy if we had upvotes, downvotes, and a bikeshed button. If bikeshed comments could be filtered that'd be great.
- seiji 11y agoPerhaps something like a lateral vote meaning "the comment may have a point, but they are derailing the conversation." Then we could have a "sort by interesting (relevant)" and "sort by interesting (diverging)". (lol this is hn, you get no sorting or filtering or on-site messaging)
- everyone 11y agoah, good old HN comments section. Nonsense is not tolerated.
- eru 11y agoYou know that `man' used to be gender neutral? (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_(word) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_(word))
- pygy_ 11y agoAnd "white man" is used here in the context of post-colonial Africa, where the phrase is loaded in a way that's relevant to the study.
- dalke 11y agoTake up the White Man's burden, Send forth the best ye breed Go bind your sons to exile, to serve your captives' need; To wait in heavy harness, On fluttered folk and wild— Your new-caught, sullen peoples, Half-devil and half-child.
- codahale 11y agoAnd that 'nice' used to mean 'foolish'? http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=nice http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=nice And that 'fizzle' used to mean 'fart quietly'? http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=fizzle http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=fizzle And that 'wench' used to mean 'child'? http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=wench http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=wench And that 'meat' used to mean 'food'? http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=meat http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=meat Etymology is fascinating (a word which itself may be related to the Latin 'fascinum', or penis).
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- Sexagesimal 11y agoThis is nothing new. This relic of the British Empire is found in Silicon Valley today. It connects to misperceptions around genetics. I'm screenshotting this comment btw as proof.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- Sexagesimal 11y agoThis is nothing new. This relic of the British Empire is found in Silicon Valley today. It connects to misperceptions around genetics. I'm screenshotting this comment btw as proof as I'm sure the group removing it will deny this. Good story for the press.
- swampthinker 11y ago> This relic of the British Empire is found in Silicon Valley today Care to elaborate?
- Sexagesimal 11y agoColonization e.g. of India, Africa or the Caribbean led to undue emphasis and esteem of Anglos aside from being from a wealthy land. The psychology of a kidnapped or enslaved victim came into play aka Stockholm Syndrome. More importantly, hitleresque superior race, eugenics and a bunch of other stuff wound up in the mix which still pervades thinking today. Some of it even started right here in the Bay Area aka Silicon Valley > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics We used to think technology was the great leveler but it ebbs and flows. The only firm I know that has a clue about any of this is a16z.
- cafard 11y agoWilliam Shockley was pretty late to the eugenics thing. He made a lot of noise, but was many decades too late to have started it.
- notNow 11y agoDid they run the same experiment but with people from different backgrounds and ethnicities excluding Europeans and then compare the respective results and come up with a conclusion? Otherwise, it's just a hasty conclusion with unsound methodologies employed in the process.
- sp332 11y agoWell I guess you could click through and find out?
- noobermin 11y agoWell, I did the reading for you, and the answer is no. The control was a Sierra Leonean and the test was a white American. Page 8 on the paper (click one of the links above).
- sp332 11y agoHowever, they did not come to the "conclusion" that notNow accused them of coming to. "Behavioral measures are increasingly used to infer cross-national differences in social preferences or to assess aid effectiveness — our results suggest that we should be cautious in these uses."
- nailer 11y agoWhat are 'dictator games'?
- alwaysmetara 11y agoOne player, the 'dictator', decides how to split a cash prize between themselves and the other player, the recipient. The recipient has no input into how the prize is split.
- dalke 11y agoThe non-paywalled version of the paper is at http://media.withtank.com/1b58f0becf/white_man.pdf http://media.withtank.com/1b58f0becf/white_man.pdf .
- mafribe 11y agoFull text here http://odube.net/papers/White_man.pdf http://odube.net/papers/White_man.pdf TL;DR: Sierra Leoneans' behaviour is influenced by how they want to be seen by others, with an aim towards maximising their own benefits.
- josu 11y agoThank you! I'd be nice if the mods could change the link.
- IllusoryReverb 11y agoMaking an anecdotal contribution. Kenyan here. I have observed that white people are given preferential treatment and have (strangely) experienced racism against black people in my own country. I have, more than once heard people, mostly uneducated people, saying how much better things would be if we were still colonized. Examples of preferential treatment/racism include, faster service for white people at restaurants and clubs, being denied entry to a club because 'it is full' and seconds later a couple of white people walk right in, and in one memorable instance a security guard had the gall to try and deny me an open parking spot so that a white person could have it instead. The latter got a stern talking to by me. All is not positive for the white man though. There is the 'white tax' where prices are instantly increased when a white person is the one shopping and people are always hitting them up for money because white people are perceived to be wealthy.
- klipt 11y agoSorry to hear that. I imagine the 'white tax' and better 'white service' are both caused by the belief that white people are wealthier. The club might expect a wealthier person to spend more, or a security guard might expect them to tip better. So it's somewhat rational (if unfortunate) to give wealthier people preferential service. I guess the long term solution is to reduce economic inequality between racial groups.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- ardit33 11y agoI hate to say it, but it doesn't have to do much with race, but more of the perception of "status" of the person. I have been in Sweden few times (I am white), and when people hear me talk, and know that I am visiting from NYC, I get a bit of more friendlier service. Including getting in a club as a single guy, because I had a california ID, while some Swedish guys were being left outside. Swedes have a high affinity for America in general, and are extra friendly if they hear you are from the States, and often (with some small talk) you will get preferential treatment. In NYC you will notice this "differential" treatment according to your status every day. A simple experiment you can run: Go to a good cocktail place/bar with normal t-shirt/jeans clothes, and go to the same place dressed sharp. You will get a lot better and faster service if you are dressed really well (and your perceived status is higher), while if you are dressed like a schlub, you might not even get in the place. I think it is not just about race, but more of the perceived status of the person. It happens that most countries in Africa have very low GDPs, while most countries in Europe, and north america (US and Canada), have very high GDP. If you are an average person from those countries, your purchasing power is higher, and hence you will be given the preferential treatment.
- chubalub 11y agoPsychology is a tribe pseudoscience.