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"I could have done all of that on the iPhone except the part about running multiple apps the same time. Which is a big deal by the way." ...other than being ab

"I could have done all of that on the iPhone except the part about running multiple apps the same time. Which is a big deal by the way." ...other than being able to play last.fm in the background there isn't anything about this that requires background third-party apps (seems like everyone ignores the fact that Apple's apps can run in the background). So I'm not sure why this is "a big deal by the way", other than maybe because the google phone comes with only 4GB of storage so you can't take a lot of your own music with you.

edd 17y ago
I think this would be much less of a 'big deal' if you could 'suspend' more apps. Getting a txt during a game leaving the game to reply to it and then coming back and not being able to pick up where you left of does suck. If it could effectively sleep the app and pick it up again properly this would essentially remove any need for background apps for me. I do know Tweetie 2 has implemented this and it rocks.
- jasongullickson 17y ago
  Agreed. As you mentioned some apps do this, the necessary tools are there (apps are notified when they are about to be closed and allowed to save data, suspend state, etc.) to allow apps to suspend gracefully however it's up to the developer to use them and that is pretty hit-or-miss.
- tewks 17y ago
  The developer of whichever game you are referring to hasn't written the application properly: it should offer to resume state when the application is next launched. The Apple model, one app at a time, makes a lot of sense, particularly in this use case: on a device with a four inch screen, there's no need to have a game, or most other applications, running in the background!
  - tshtf 17y ago
    I would have to disagree. Consider this case: 1) I am on IRC on my mobile device and my coworker says there's a problem with something on server-x 2) With IRC in the background I open an SSH client to login to server-x and check on the issue. Seeing a service is down I switch back to IRC. 3) I tell my coworker on IRC the service appears to be down down. 4) I bring up a browser window to verify that the web server on server-x is not responding. ... etc This type of workflow will not work on single tasking mobile devices, and it's not an unreasonable use case at all.
    - tewks 17y ago
      That type of workflow will not work on today's multitasking devices for very long; the battery will die pretty quickly. I can testify to this having done it on the G1. For the meantime (next year or two), until batteries get better and hardware more efficient, push notifications are a pretty good way to solve this. Why does the handset need to keep these connections open when a remote server can do this more efficiently, not draining the battery, and then push a notification when an event happens? There is a fundamental limit to the amount of information that can be conveyed on a 4" screen. Everything else "running" in the background, in a single tasking environment, can be taken care of by well written apps and services. More of a pain for the developer, yes, but a godsend for one's battery and CPU time.
- eelco 17y ago
  It's indeed mostly a burden on the iPhone devs side to support good 'suspension' behavior, and there are some frameworks (like Three20) which more or less offer it 'out of the box'. I used an Android phone for a while before switching to the iPhone and in most of the cases where I missed running multiple apps only _one_ background app would be enough (e.g., Last.fm and other music (streaming) apps, a GPS tracker, some games).
jonknee 17y ago
IM is another good reason to have background apps. I'm still amazed that Apple hasn't bundled IM into the iPhone. The third party apps suck as they require the push notifications.
- pclark 17y ago
  why do they suck? Haven't had any problems with Beejive.
  - jonknee 17y ago
    You have to pay for them, you count on third party servers staying up, screen names aren't managed in the phone's central address book, messages get separated out into different areas, etc. On my Mac Mail already knows if who I'm emailing is on IM--that's the kind of functionality that I expect on the phone.
    - pclark 17y ago
      You do have to rely on 3rd party servers staying up with Beejive - but you get a push message when you're disconnected. Beejive also recently integrated with Address Book - so you can connect your buddies with their address cards. Just thought you might not be aware. It's no blackberry, but it isn't half bad.
      - jonknee 17y ago
        Good to hear about Address Book integration. It still feels awkward to me though, the way the Pre does it seems to be what I'm looking for. I want be able to start an IM or an SMS from a contact in the Address Book (or right in Messages) and see both in the same place. I don't want to go back and have to remember if it was an IM or SMS when I want to re-visit a conversation. They're all messages.
jcnnghm 17y ago
I'm actually very glad it doesn't support background apps. The biggest problem I had with the Windows Mobile smartphone I had before the iPhone was with the background apps. The phone was already underpowered, which was a problem. When Apps were launched, they would automatically run in the background if you switched contexts, further starving the phone of resources. It was also difficult to tell what was running. This would inevitably cause the phone to run out of memory, and either perform so slowly that you would miss calls, or lockup and reboot whenever new calls came in.
- dminor 17y ago
  Android limits the available CPU time of background tasks, and will kill them if it needs memory for the foreground task. It also has stats on which applications have used the battery (and how much) since you last recharged.
mtinkerhess 17y ago
4GB, expandable to 32GB.
mikeryan 17y ago
I actually wonder why Apple can't provide an opt-in mechanism for background apps. They do this already for location services. Some little popup that says "Would you like to allow this application to run in the background? This can severely affect battery life and performance"
elai 17y ago
If the iPhone added an alarm/scheduled notification API and location trigger API, and functionality to start an app up automatically w/ user permission and then quit itself and restart the previous open application. This would replace most apps that need backgrounding for various tasks. Apps like locale, sweet dreams, im apps and calendaring apps could all be implemented with this kind of functionality (some of them not as well with android), yet avoid backgrounding applications.

edd 17y ago

I think this would be much less of a 'big deal' if you could 'suspend' more apps. Getting a txt during a game leaving the game to reply to it and then coming back and not being able to pick up where you left of does suck. If it could effectively sleep the app and pick it up again properly this would essentially remove any need for background apps for me. I do know Tweetie 2 has implemented this and it rocks.

jasongullickson 17y ago
Agreed. As you mentioned some apps do this, the necessary tools are there (apps are notified when they are about to be closed and allowed to save data, suspend state, etc.) to allow apps to suspend gracefully however it's up to the developer to use them and that is pretty hit-or-miss.
tewks 17y ago
The developer of whichever game you are referring to hasn't written the application properly: it should offer to resume state when the application is next launched. The Apple model, one app at a time, makes a lot of sense, particularly in this use case: on a device with a four inch screen, there's no need to have a game, or most other applications, running in the background!
- tshtf 17y ago
  I would have to disagree. Consider this case: 1) I am on IRC on my mobile device and my coworker says there's a problem with something on server-x 2) With IRC in the background I open an SSH client to login to server-x and check on the issue. Seeing a service is down I switch back to IRC. 3) I tell my coworker on IRC the service appears to be down down. 4) I bring up a browser window to verify that the web server on server-x is not responding. ... etc This type of workflow will not work on single tasking mobile devices, and it's not an unreasonable use case at all.
  - tewks 17y ago
    That type of workflow will not work on today's multitasking devices for very long; the battery will die pretty quickly. I can testify to this having done it on the G1. For the meantime (next year or two), until batteries get better and hardware more efficient, push notifications are a pretty good way to solve this. Why does the handset need to keep these connections open when a remote server can do this more efficiently, not draining the battery, and then push a notification when an event happens? There is a fundamental limit to the amount of information that can be conveyed on a 4" screen. Everything else "running" in the background, in a single tasking environment, can be taken care of by well written apps and services. More of a pain for the developer, yes, but a godsend for one's battery and CPU time.
eelco 17y ago
It's indeed mostly a burden on the iPhone devs side to support good 'suspension' behavior, and there are some frameworks (like Three20) which more or less offer it 'out of the box'. I used an Android phone for a while before switching to the iPhone and in most of the cases where I missed running multiple apps only _one_ background app would be enough (e.g., Last.fm and other music (streaming) apps, a GPS tracker, some games).

jonknee 17y ago

IM is another good reason to have background apps. I'm still amazed that Apple hasn't bundled IM into the iPhone. The third party apps suck as they require the push notifications.

pclark 17y ago
why do they suck? Haven't had any problems with Beejive.
- jonknee 17y ago
  You have to pay for them, you count on third party servers staying up, screen names aren't managed in the phone's central address book, messages get separated out into different areas, etc. On my Mac Mail already knows if who I'm emailing is on IM--that's the kind of functionality that I expect on the phone.
  - pclark 17y ago
    You do have to rely on 3rd party servers staying up with Beejive - but you get a push message when you're disconnected. Beejive also recently integrated with Address Book - so you can connect your buddies with their address cards. Just thought you might not be aware. It's no blackberry, but it isn't half bad.
    - jonknee 17y ago
      Good to hear about Address Book integration. It still feels awkward to me though, the way the Pre does it seems to be what I'm looking for. I want be able to start an IM or an SMS from a contact in the Address Book (or right in Messages) and see both in the same place. I don't want to go back and have to remember if it was an IM or SMS when I want to re-visit a conversation. They're all messages.

jcnnghm 17y ago

I'm actually very glad it doesn't support background apps. The biggest problem I had with the Windows Mobile smartphone I had before the iPhone was with the background apps. The phone was already underpowered, which was a problem. When Apps were launched, they would automatically run in the background if you switched contexts, further starving the phone of resources. It was also difficult to tell what was running. This would inevitably cause the phone to run out of memory, and either perform so slowly that you would miss calls, or lockup and reboot whenever new calls came in.

dminor 17y ago
Android limits the available CPU time of background tasks, and will kill them if it needs memory for the foreground task. It also has stats on which applications have used the battery (and how much) since you last recharged.

mtinkerhess 17y ago

4GB, expandable to 32GB.

mikeryan 17y ago

I actually wonder why Apple can't provide an opt-in mechanism for background apps. They do this already for location services. Some little popup that says "Would you like to allow this application to run in the background? This can severely affect battery life and performance"

elai 17y ago

If the iPhone added an alarm/scheduled notification API and location trigger API, and functionality to start an app up automatically w/ user permission and then quit itself and restart the previous open application. This would replace most apps that need backgrounding for various tasks. Apps like locale, sweet dreams, im apps and calendaring apps could all be implemented with this kind of functionality (some of them not as well with android), yet avoid backgrounding applications.