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Funny to think that China was reforged under communist ideals only 50 years ago, and that the hatred of the poor rural folk for the wealthy, corrupt royals and

Funny to think that China was reforged under communist ideals only 50 years ago, and that the hatred of the poor rural folk for the wealthy, corrupt royals and warlords was strong enough to unite allow the country to expel the Japanese, the British, and the KMT. It's my view that the standard of living for the poor and lower classes has improved enough that there would not be enough hatred to fuel a revolution. Disgust and indignation, maybe, but it seems like a quaint notion that a leader could unite peasants and farmworkers, outfit them with weapons and train well enough to fight against the PLA and its allies. Anyone from China/living in China travel to any rural areas and have any insights they're willing to share?

cafard 11y ago
a. Only 50 years ago? The Japanese surrender was 70 years ago, and the civil war between the PLA and the KMT was all over but the shouting 65 years ago. b. The British? The corrupt royals? The royalty was gone except from the puppet state in Manchuria well before that. c. The expulsion of the Japanese had a good deal to do with the Japanese losing a war to certain Western powers, not to mention, in at the end, the USSR. d. It is not at all clear to me (I am no historian) that the revolution per se would have sufficed without the losses suffered from 1938-1945.
- roymurdock 11y ago
  You're right - for some reason I thought we were still in the year 2000. The main brunt of the revolution occurred 70-80 years ago from 1930-1945. I also agree that the huge macroeconomic instability of WWII was helpful in allowing the communist party to organize a successful campaign as the KMT had to deal with multiple enemies on multiple fronts, and the communists were also receiving aid from the US to fight the Japanese post Pearl Harbor. I think we would need to see another period of large-scale war in order to see any kind of revolution in China.
douche 11y ago
It really only takes a single spark and semi-charismatic leadership to start a revolution if there is widespread hostility to the ruling party. The Taiping nearly overthrew the Qing dynasty, and they were led by a deranged religious fanatic who had a breakdown after failing repeatedly to get into civil service and claimed to be the second coming of Jesus. This came at a time when the expansion and prosperity of the Qianlong emperor was well in the rear-view, and population pressures, corruption, monetary shifts (the massive influx of Spanish silver in exchange for tea, silk, china, etc, was replaced by opium, which threw off the rates of exchange between gold, silver and cash) and other factors were resulting in a real decline in standard of living. Today, any rebellion would probably need to involve a dissatisfied faction of the PLA, because China is so disarmed - the Communists arose at a time when the supply of firearms within China was probably at it its all-time high, between the decades of warlord control, the war with Japan, and military aid arriving from all sides in WW2. And quite frankly, the KMT armies were not particularly professional or formidable adversaries, compared even with the rank-and-file of the PLA today.
- ISL 11y ago
  A rebellion can take more peaceful forms. In the United States, we have the opportunity to change the government entirely every six years (House, President, and Senate). China's single-party system is, of course, different on the surface, but competing factions within the party provide the opportunity for change. Today's Chinese Communist Party's policies are substantially different from those of Mao. History won't end, even if outright violence is tempered.
SEJeff 11y ago
Look what happened when one upset street vendor in Tunisia self imolated (hint: the beginning of the entire Arab Spring). Mohamed Bouazizi might not have realized it, but his actions, even if fatal to himself, changed the entire course of history in the middle east.
guelo 11y ago
With the advent of consumerism, high-tech mass surveillance, and control of mass communication channels I think China has reached what political scientists refer to as "the end of history". Meaning that society will stay stable and no revolutions will be possible. At least for a few hundred years.
- Sven7 11y ago
  Agree. What's interesting is the number of comments around here expecting the sky to fall.
FooBarWidget 11y ago
At least my grandparents-in-law, who are retired and live at a farm, don't seem to particularly care. They have a comfortable amount of wealth nowadays and are living decently.

cafard 11y ago

a. Only 50 years ago? The Japanese surrender was 70 years ago, and the civil war between the PLA and the KMT was all over but the shouting 65 years ago. b. The British? The corrupt royals? The royalty was gone except from the puppet state in Manchuria well before that. c. The expulsion of the Japanese had a good deal to do with the Japanese losing a war to certain Western powers, not to mention, in at the end, the USSR. d. It is not at all clear to me (I am no historian) that the revolution per se would have sufficed without the losses suffered from 1938-1945.

roymurdock 11y ago
You're right - for some reason I thought we were still in the year 2000. The main brunt of the revolution occurred 70-80 years ago from 1930-1945. I also agree that the huge macroeconomic instability of WWII was helpful in allowing the communist party to organize a successful campaign as the KMT had to deal with multiple enemies on multiple fronts, and the communists were also receiving aid from the US to fight the Japanese post Pearl Harbor. I think we would need to see another period of large-scale war in order to see any kind of revolution in China.

douche 11y ago

It really only takes a single spark and semi-charismatic leadership to start a revolution if there is widespread hostility to the ruling party. The Taiping nearly overthrew the Qing dynasty, and they were led by a deranged religious fanatic who had a breakdown after failing repeatedly to get into civil service and claimed to be the second coming of Jesus. This came at a time when the expansion and prosperity of the Qianlong emperor was well in the rear-view, and population pressures, corruption, monetary shifts (the massive influx of Spanish silver in exchange for tea, silk, china, etc, was replaced by opium, which threw off the rates of exchange between gold, silver and cash) and other factors were resulting in a real decline in standard of living. Today, any rebellion would probably need to involve a dissatisfied faction of the PLA, because China is so disarmed - the Communists arose at a time when the supply of firearms within China was probably at it its all-time high, between the decades of warlord control, the war with Japan, and military aid arriving from all sides in WW2. And quite frankly, the KMT armies were not particularly professional or formidable adversaries, compared even with the rank-and-file of the PLA today.

ISL 11y ago
A rebellion can take more peaceful forms. In the United States, we have the opportunity to change the government entirely every six years (House, President, and Senate). China's single-party system is, of course, different on the surface, but competing factions within the party provide the opportunity for change. Today's Chinese Communist Party's policies are substantially different from those of Mao. History won't end, even if outright violence is tempered.

SEJeff 11y ago

Look what happened when one upset street vendor in Tunisia self imolated (hint: the beginning of the entire Arab Spring). Mohamed Bouazizi might not have realized it, but his actions, even if fatal to himself, changed the entire course of history in the middle east.

guelo 11y ago

With the advent of consumerism, high-tech mass surveillance, and control of mass communication channels I think China has reached what political scientists refer to as "the end of history". Meaning that society will stay stable and no revolutions will be possible. At least for a few hundred years.

Sven7 11y ago
Agree. What's interesting is the number of comments around here expecting the sky to fall.

FooBarWidget 11y ago

At least my grandparents-in-law, who are retired and live at a farm, don't seem to particularly care. They have a comfortable amount of wealth nowadays and are living decently.