6 ms·

Well, part of "real world usage" should also include whether any sensible user would want to use that feature, or if people turn it off because it looks funny.

Well, part of "real world usage" should also include whether any sensible user would want to use that feature, or if people turn it off because it looks funny. From their short description of "motion lighting", it isn't obvious to me why this is a feature in the first place.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
dogma1138 11y ago
Dynamic lighting is quite common in most TV's to adjust for ambient light. In this case they also adjust the lighting in scenes with less motion as it has less effect on the contrast of the image. In general all of these tests will "cheat" because there is no way around it, you can measure the TV usage while playing content from the built-in antenna with 50% brightness and 10% audio, and you can test it while streaming 4K video over wifi while recording a show from you setup box using the HDMI in to a USB attached storage at full brightness, in 3D 120hz mode. The difference in the power usage in that case will be quite insane. The problem begins with the whole grading system, people want to see the green A on anything they buy because they assume it will be of higher quality, this plus moronic testing and standards is what will push any manufacturer to cheat under any circumstances. But when you brand TV's with AC's, Fridges, Washing Machines, Heaters etc. with exactly the same A++ to G when A it self isn't even green don't expect manufacturers to not cheat, it's a quite a big hit to get a yellow/orange/red marker on your product and it's not some minor detail that is hidden in small text it's marked very clearly usually it's bigger or as big as the image of the product on that details page/sticker they have by it on the shelf. The power consumption of TV's is pretty much meaningless the powered consumption shouldn't be tested at all just the standby power which in some cases is quite insane even for A rated TV's, this isn't a multi KW device like an air conditioning or heating which has quite a bit of impact. Oh and just to make it clearer they actually do not measure the standby power consumption of TV's at all for this rating which is actually probably several orders of magnitude more important because my Sony Bravia which is rated A+ barely powers down in standby mode vs lowest brightness since even in standby it's connected to the network and does some voodoo while it should be well off and it like probably every other TV out there is probably on only 10% of the time at most.
- Domenic_S 11y ago
  > people want to see the green A on anything they buy because they assume it will be of higher quality I almost always assume the opposite. I assume the product was designed in one of two ways: 1. Designed fully-featured and then hamstrung to meet arbitrary energy goals, or 2. Designed with energy goals as the first priority in either case, other useful qualities (performance, longevity, etc) are second-class. I think my mindset started with low-flow toilets being introduced, those things could barely flush an empty bowl of water. To me, energy-efficient means crap performance. I had a Prius for a while and it was clear that a lot of things were sacrificed so they could spend the budget on energy efficiency. Compare the interior or ride quality of a Prius with anything else in its price range and you'll see what I mean.
  - dogma1138 11y ago
    Well i don't assume the opposite i just don't care about the energy rating that much. The only thing i would care for is for heating/AC because those tend to be on for very very long duration. I bought a C rated fridge because I've read the testing procedure, it involves quite a bit of stuff like how long it takes it to cool down when the door is opened for 2 minutes, how much power it needs to cool down some volume of water etc, how much does it take to freeze X amount of what ever beef. And i really don't care about that, I live with my GF, no kids, no one else, the fridge is opened maybe 5 times a day for no longer than 10 seconds. Dinner is cooked daily with "fresh" from the store ingredients or take away/delivery is used. So the fridge is used to cool fruits/soda/water milk, and and some toppings for snaks. The freezer will have some emergency ground beef for the shit it's too late to order pasta, some hot dogs when you really get lazy, some bread, and vodka. If i had 3 kids and would stick a half eaten turkey into the fridge 3 times a week i would probably care more about how much power it yanks to cool it down, but with the use i have i don't need to care because while it's less efficient in cooling it's just as efficient at doing nothing for most of the day because the insulation is still the same. But the majority of the public doesn't do it, almost no one is doing research before buying something, they might get some reviews of CNET at best but more likely got to Curry's or Fry's or Best Buy and buy something they think is good. And since everyone has been conditioned to see green as good and everyone is conditioned to think of a higher grade is better when you have for the most part a meaningless grading system people will still buy what has huge Grade A+++ green sticker on rather than a orange/red B or C.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

dogma1138 11y ago

Dynamic lighting is quite common in most TV's to adjust for ambient light. In this case they also adjust the lighting in scenes with less motion as it has less effect on the contrast of the image. In general all of these tests will "cheat" because there is no way around it, you can measure the TV usage while playing content from the built-in antenna with 50% brightness and 10% audio, and you can test it while streaming 4K video over wifi while recording a show from you setup box using the HDMI in to a USB attached storage at full brightness, in 3D 120hz mode. The difference in the power usage in that case will be quite insane. The problem begins with the whole grading system, people want to see the green A on anything they buy because they assume it will be of higher quality, this plus moronic testing and standards is what will push any manufacturer to cheat under any circumstances. But when you brand TV's with AC's, Fridges, Washing Machines, Heaters etc. with exactly the same A++ to G when A it self isn't even green don't expect manufacturers to not cheat, it's a quite a big hit to get a yellow/orange/red marker on your product and it's not some minor detail that is hidden in small text it's marked very clearly usually it's bigger or as big as the image of the product on that details page/sticker they have by it on the shelf. The power consumption of TV's is pretty much meaningless the powered consumption shouldn't be tested at all just the standby power which in some cases is quite insane even for A rated TV's, this isn't a multi KW device like an air conditioning or heating which has quite a bit of impact. Oh and just to make it clearer they actually do not measure the standby power consumption of TV's at all for this rating which is actually probably several orders of magnitude more important because my Sony Bravia which is rated A+ barely powers down in standby mode vs lowest brightness since even in standby it's connected to the network and does some voodoo while it should be well off and it like probably every other TV out there is probably on only 10% of the time at most.

Domenic_S 11y ago
> people want to see the green A on anything they buy because they assume it will be of higher quality I almost always assume the opposite. I assume the product was designed in one of two ways: 1. Designed fully-featured and then hamstrung to meet arbitrary energy goals, or 2. Designed with energy goals as the first priority in either case, other useful qualities (performance, longevity, etc) are second-class. I think my mindset started with low-flow toilets being introduced, those things could barely flush an empty bowl of water. To me, energy-efficient means crap performance. I had a Prius for a while and it was clear that a lot of things were sacrificed so they could spend the budget on energy efficiency. Compare the interior or ride quality of a Prius with anything else in its price range and you'll see what I mean.
- dogma1138 11y ago
  Well i don't assume the opposite i just don't care about the energy rating that much. The only thing i would care for is for heating/AC because those tend to be on for very very long duration. I bought a C rated fridge because I've read the testing procedure, it involves quite a bit of stuff like how long it takes it to cool down when the door is opened for 2 minutes, how much power it needs to cool down some volume of water etc, how much does it take to freeze X amount of what ever beef. And i really don't care about that, I live with my GF, no kids, no one else, the fridge is opened maybe 5 times a day for no longer than 10 seconds. Dinner is cooked daily with "fresh" from the store ingredients or take away/delivery is used. So the fridge is used to cool fruits/soda/water milk, and and some toppings for snaks. The freezer will have some emergency ground beef for the shit it's too late to order pasta, some hot dogs when you really get lazy, some bread, and vodka. If i had 3 kids and would stick a half eaten turkey into the fridge 3 times a week i would probably care more about how much power it yanks to cool it down, but with the use i have i don't need to care because while it's less efficient in cooling it's just as efficient at doing nothing for most of the day because the insulation is still the same. But the majority of the public doesn't do it, almost no one is doing research before buying something, they might get some reviews of CNET at best but more likely got to Curry's or Fry's or Best Buy and buy something they think is good. And since everyone has been conditioned to see green as good and everyone is conditioned to think of a higher grade is better when you have for the most part a meaningless grading system people will still buy what has huge Grade A+++ green sticker on rather than a orange/red B or C.