4 ms·

Grails, I really like Groovy as a language. Grails provides a lot out of the box and is good enough performance wize for small to medium sites with no tuning.

by jareds 11y ago

sandGorgon 11y ago
this is a comment posted yesterday criticizing the management of Groovy - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10293508 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10293508
- mindcrime 11y ago
  Meh... vorg posts on nearly every thread that mentions Groovy and rants about all the perceived wrong-doings in the Groovy community. Some of his points have some merit, but he seems to tend to make mountains out of mole-hills.
  - vorg 11y ago
    You didn't comment on any of the specifics mentioned in that linked-to comment, instead you attacked my behavior, just like one replier to that comment. You mentioned Groovy moving to the ASF in another comment above, but if only two people control the DNS name and physical access to that server in Germany hosting the websites, receiving the Nabble mail archive and Apache website redirects, creating the phantom downloads from Maven and Bintray, etc, then the list of committers and mentors at ASF for Groovy is meaningless. Because Groovy isn't really protected by the ASF guidelines, its future is uncertain. As for Grails you also mentioned, Grails 3 also has an uncertain future, what with so few people upgrading from version 2, just like with Python version 3. Grails 3 bundles all of Gradle, and its business case seems less about modernizing Grails 2 than about its founder wanting to muscle in on the Gradle consulting market, just like he did with Spring in Grails 1, until SpringSource bought his company to protect their cashflow. He's trying the same with Gradleware.
    - mindcrime 11y ago
      instead you attacked my behavior, just like one replier to that comment. Have you considered that your behavior might be at issue then? Seriously man, you seem to go out of your way to find any and every thread that mentions Groovy in any way, and then launch into your rant about all the evils of the Groovy community. The thing is, I said that you have some merit in what you say. But the repetitiveness and the vitriolic presentation make you look like somebody who has an axe to grind or something, instead of a dispassionate observer. You mentioned Groovy moving to the ASF in another comment above, but if only two people control the DNS name and physical access to that server in Germany hosting the websites, receiving the Nabble mail archive and Apache website redirects, creating the phantom downloads from Maven and Bintray, etc, then the list of committers and mentors at ASF for Groovy is meaningless. When existing, long-established projects move to the ASF, they always deal with shit like this. It takes time to sort this stuff out, that's why there's an incubator. And if it doesn't work out, then so be it. At that point, I'd reconsider my position of advocating for Groovy. But I'm not going to rush to judgment and focus on all the negatives, which is what you seem to do.
      - vorg 11y ago
        > you seem to go out of your way to find any and every thread that mentions Groovy in any way, and then launch into your rant The most significant thing you've really said here is that I generally post comments under my own name, as I suspect you also do, given how active your "mindcrime" user is and the implicit assumption in your above comment that you're seeing the entire picture by looking at who's posting comments. Have you considered that other "entrepreneurs" involved with Groovy keep hundreds of HN logins each to obfuscate their mischief here and engage in illicit surveillance of people whose comments they don't like? This I don't say in my comments, instead I keep what I say seemly and do it in my own name. It's because I use my own name that I "seem to go out of my way to find any and every thread ..."
        mindcrime 11y ago
        Have you considered that other "entrepreneurs" involved with Groovy keep hundreds of HN logins each to obfuscate their mischief here and engage in illicit surveillance of people whose comments they don't like? Honestly? No, the thought never crossed my mind. And now that you mention it, it doesn't sound terribly likely to me. Not "hundreds* of such people anyway. Maybe two or three. Why do I say that? Simply because Groovy just doesn't come up that often to begin with. And a decent percentage of the time, when it does, I'm the one bringing it up, and know where I stand. And while "mindcrime" clearly isn't my birth name, my HN account is clearly linked to my real world identity, so no one can really claim that I'm trying to hide anything here. One other person here to mentions Groovy / Grails occasionally is @mgkimsal, and I also know him in the Real World, and have no suspicion that he's up to anything nefarious. That said, people never cease to surprise me and clearly some people post on HN largely for commercial gain. I don't think anyone questions that. I just don't see what you seem to see, in terms of large numbers of users here trying to manipulate the discourse around Groovy in particular.

Grails, I really like Groovy as a language. Grails provides a lot out of the box and is good enough performance wize for small to medium sites with no tuning.

by jareds 11y ago

Grails, I really like Groovy as a language. Grails provides a lot out of the box and is good enough performance wize for small to medium sites with no tuning.

sandGorgon 11y ago

this is a comment posted yesterday criticizing the management of Groovy - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10293508 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10293508

mindcrime 11y ago
Meh... vorg posts on nearly every thread that mentions Groovy and rants about all the perceived wrong-doings in the Groovy community. Some of his points have some merit, but he seems to tend to make mountains out of mole-hills.
- vorg 11y ago
  You didn't comment on any of the specifics mentioned in that linked-to comment, instead you attacked my behavior, just like one replier to that comment. You mentioned Groovy moving to the ASF in another comment above, but if only two people control the DNS name and physical access to that server in Germany hosting the websites, receiving the Nabble mail archive and Apache website redirects, creating the phantom downloads from Maven and Bintray, etc, then the list of committers and mentors at ASF for Groovy is meaningless. Because Groovy isn't really protected by the ASF guidelines, its future is uncertain. As for Grails you also mentioned, Grails 3 also has an uncertain future, what with so few people upgrading from version 2, just like with Python version 3. Grails 3 bundles all of Gradle, and its business case seems less about modernizing Grails 2 than about its founder wanting to muscle in on the Gradle consulting market, just like he did with Spring in Grails 1, until SpringSource bought his company to protect their cashflow. He's trying the same with Gradleware.
  - mindcrime 11y ago
    instead you attacked my behavior, just like one replier to that comment. Have you considered that your behavior might be at issue then? Seriously man, you seem to go out of your way to find any and every thread that mentions Groovy in any way, and then launch into your rant about all the evils of the Groovy community. The thing is, I said that you have some merit in what you say. But the repetitiveness and the vitriolic presentation make you look like somebody who has an axe to grind or something, instead of a dispassionate observer. You mentioned Groovy moving to the ASF in another comment above, but if only two people control the DNS name and physical access to that server in Germany hosting the websites, receiving the Nabble mail archive and Apache website redirects, creating the phantom downloads from Maven and Bintray, etc, then the list of committers and mentors at ASF for Groovy is meaningless. When existing, long-established projects move to the ASF, they always deal with shit like this. It takes time to sort this stuff out, that's why there's an incubator. And if it doesn't work out, then so be it. At that point, I'd reconsider my position of advocating for Groovy. But I'm not going to rush to judgment and focus on all the negatives, which is what you seem to do.
    - vorg 11y ago
      > you seem to go out of your way to find any and every thread that mentions Groovy in any way, and then launch into your rant The most significant thing you've really said here is that I generally post comments under my own name, as I suspect you also do, given how active your "mindcrime" user is and the implicit assumption in your above comment that you're seeing the entire picture by looking at who's posting comments. Have you considered that other "entrepreneurs" involved with Groovy keep hundreds of HN logins each to obfuscate their mischief here and engage in illicit surveillance of people whose comments they don't like? This I don't say in my comments, instead I keep what I say seemly and do it in my own name. It's because I use my own name that I "seem to go out of my way to find any and every thread ..."
      - mindcrime 11y ago
        Have you considered that other "entrepreneurs" involved with Groovy keep hundreds of HN logins each to obfuscate their mischief here and engage in illicit surveillance of people whose comments they don't like? Honestly? No, the thought never crossed my mind. And now that you mention it, it doesn't sound terribly likely to me. Not "hundreds* of such people anyway. Maybe two or three. Why do I say that? Simply because Groovy just doesn't come up that often to begin with. And a decent percentage of the time, when it does, I'm the one bringing it up, and know where I stand. And while "mindcrime" clearly isn't my birth name, my HN account is clearly linked to my real world identity, so no one can really claim that I'm trying to hide anything here. One other person here to mentions Groovy / Grails occasionally is @mgkimsal, and I also know him in the Real World, and have no suspicion that he's up to anything nefarious. That said, people never cease to surprise me and clearly some people post on HN largely for commercial gain. I don't think anyone questions that. I just don't see what you seem to see, in terms of large numbers of users here trying to manipulate the discourse around Groovy in particular.