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Along these lines, do people here think porting Clojure to use the Go VM a worthwhile endeavor? Or, to the contrary, if one just wants to avoid the JVM, would

Along these lines, do people here think porting Clojure to use the Go VM a worthwhile endeavor? Or, to the contrary, if one just wants to avoid the JVM, would it just be better to write Clojurescript? That being said, having one binary to distribute and install is a very strong argument for Go VM languages.

wtetzner 11y ago
I wasn't aware there was a Go VM.
- tptacek 11y ago
  There isn't, of course, but if you mentally substitute "runtime" for "VM", the question is perfectly valid.
  - anjanb 11y ago
    In this context, what's the difference between a "runtime" and a "VM" ? What does a "VM" have in addition to a "runtime" ?
    - wolf550e 11y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runtime_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runtime_system libc is a runtime, but not a VM.
      - tptacek 11y ago
        Also compiler calling conventions, the memory map, program initialization, the GC subsystem...
kimi 11y ago
That's what I thought. Clojure is a "parasitic" language, meaning that it is meant to work with a host, so it should not be too hard to make it work with a Go environment. Plus, the fact that there is a very well working ClojureScript means that any "hard" deps on the JVM's original implementation should be gone. Clojure is a sweet language to work in, but you just cannot create a small executable out of it.
kimi 11y ago
To clarify: I have been looking for something along these lines because my company is looking to invest heavily into Clojure. We come from a Java/JVM environment, and we are very happy with it, but we have to ship a "beacon" to appliances. This means: Java on the server, GWT or JavaScript on the browser, and perl/C on the beacon. With Clojure / ClojureScript / ClojureGo we could have the same programmers moving between the three environments, and it would be a major win for us. Clojure might not be perfect, but we still would be able to write any critical code in the host language.

wtetzner 11y ago

I wasn't aware there was a Go VM.

tptacek 11y ago
There isn't, of course, but if you mentally substitute "runtime" for "VM", the question is perfectly valid.
- anjanb 11y ago
  In this context, what's the difference between a "runtime" and a "VM" ? What does a "VM" have in addition to a "runtime" ?
  - wolf550e 11y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runtime_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runtime_system libc is a runtime, but not a VM.
    - tptacek 11y ago
      Also compiler calling conventions, the memory map, program initialization, the GC subsystem...

kimi 11y ago

That's what I thought. Clojure is a "parasitic" language, meaning that it is meant to work with a host, so it should not be too hard to make it work with a Go environment. Plus, the fact that there is a very well working ClojureScript means that any "hard" deps on the JVM's original implementation should be gone. Clojure is a sweet language to work in, but you just cannot create a small executable out of it.

kimi 11y ago

To clarify: I have been looking for something along these lines because my company is looking to invest heavily into Clojure. We come from a Java/JVM environment, and we are very happy with it, but we have to ship a "beacon" to appliances. This means: Java on the server, GWT or JavaScript on the browser, and perl/C on the beacon. With Clojure / ClojureScript / ClojureGo we could have the same programmers moving between the three environments, and it would be a major win for us. Clojure might not be perfect, but we still would be able to write any critical code in the host language.