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I stopped using groupon because of the near-universal resentment I felt from the employees of the stores selling the groupons. Clearly, these businesses weren'

by hnal943 11y ago

I stopped using groupon because of the near-universal resentment I felt from the employees of the stores selling the groupons. Clearly, these businesses weren't getting the value they thought they would get, but I wonder how much of that was the way they treated the new customers that the groupon generated.

toomuchtodo 11y ago
I think it was a feedback loop. More often then not, Groupon's provided no return business, so you'd continue to lower you expectations about the people who were buying them. I'd compare it to how hotels will sometimes give you the worst rooms if you booked through an online site that gets heavily discounted inventory.
- mindcrime 11y ago
  I think it was a feedback loop. More often then not, Groupon's provided no return business, so you'd continue to lower you expectations about the people who were buying them. How much of that is because the business owner made no attempt to establish a direct relationship with the customer while they were present? If you use a groupon to get me in your restaurant, great. But even better if you do some "permission marketing" and get me to add my name to your newsletter list, or "like" your Facebook page, or something that lets you keep in contact with me. It's amazing how few restaurants and hotels and what-not seem to even try to do this kind of customer relationship / one-to-one marketing stuff, in 2015. I get regular emails from Petterino's in Chicago, letting me know about specials on Mother's Day, Father's Day, etc., or other special events. I don't live in Chicago so I don't visit their restaurant very often, but they keep themselves on my mind, and you can bet that next time I'm in Chicago, I'm more predisposed to visit them than most of the other restaurants I vaguely remember from my last time there. OK, to be fair, it helps that the product is really good as well. Their "Midwest Corn Chowder" is to die for. But still, it boggles the mind that none of the other places even seem to try.
  - toomuchtodo 11y ago
    Anecdotally, the people I've talked to who bought and used a Groupon have no intention of a continuing business relationship. They got a steal, they know it, and they'll move on to the next Groupon, whatever it is. There's something to be said for the type of audience you cater to. (TL;DR Market to those who know what the idea of "value" is compared to "cheap".)
loco5niner 11y ago
I got a groupon(or similar) for a straight-blade shave. The guy was using replaceable blades, was obviously using and old blade, and absolutely tore my face up. Nicks and blood everywhere. When I didn't give him a tip, I could tell he was upset.
- todd3834 11y ago
  You are very brave! When it comes to a razor on my throat, I'm not sure I would want a steep discount.
- paulcole 11y ago
  I believe the vast majority of barbers use a replaceable blade shaver. It's called a shavette and just makes more sense for professional use. If you're not familiar with that, not sure how you could know the blade was old. How often and by what method do you shave/get a straight razor shave? Both of those could affect the quality of the shave more than the age of the blade. http://theshaveden.com/forums/threads/shavettes-the-truth-about-disposable-straight-razors.29942/ http://theshaveden.com/forums/threads/shavettes-the-truth-ab...
  - loco5niner 11y ago
    You're right, it was a shavette. This was the one and only time I've gotten a straight blade shave, but at the time, I was often shaving with a double edge razor at home. The blade in the shavette appeared very similar, and I can definitely tell the difference between new blade and old. To me it was a clear case of "penny wise, pound foolish". *I just noticed from your link that the type of blade used was the DE blade, about which the author says "I cannot, in good conscience, recommend any shavette style razor that uses DE blades."
- bsder 11y ago
  Where did you even find a barber who does straight-blade shaves? Let alone a Groupon?
  - jschwartzi 11y ago
deepanchor 11y ago
My experiences with Groupon mirror your own. Whenever my friends and I would show up to a business with a Groupon, we would be treated with bad attitudes, worse service and just general reluctance when the exact opposite should have been true. I mean, that is the entire point of Groupon right? To promote a business -to spread the word on the street about how great your restaurant/bowling alley/pub is. Sadly, it has been my experience that a lot of the businesses that sign up for Groupon don't know what they are getting themselves into and as a result, take out their frustrations on customers when they can't break even for the month... which is, I think, a fatal flaw in the human psychology aspect of the business model. I'd rather just pay the sticker price and enjoy better service than have to deal with all that.
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  I thought that before even trying Groupon. I can't imagine how coming in as a 2nd-class customer will improve my experience. Rather pay well, tip big and enjoy the best service they have to offer. Also, as an Engineer with a 1st-world salary, its socially responsible for me to spread it around.
  - zck 11y ago
    But shouldn't Groupon just be a marketing expense? I'm not saying that the company should be ok losing money all the time, but it's common for companies to spend money to acquire customers. Do you avoid all "new customer" deals? It seems like companies on Groupon, for whatever reason, often offer way more of a discount than they're comfortable with. I wonder why that is.
    - RyanZAG 11y ago
      It's not always the company. In the case of the USA and their insane tipping customs, a customer coming in with groupon specials is going to end up tipping less. Since the whole service at USA restaurants is based around tipping, the employees know they won't really get tipped well so they're very customer hostile.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
nadams 11y ago
> I stopped using groupon because of the near-universal resentment I felt from the employees of the stores selling the groupons. Clearly, these businesses weren't getting the value they thought they would get I think that's just a misunderstanding on the stores part. A groupon is just another form of advertising (which costs money) - but businesses believe that by offering groupons they will come out ahead. I've personally gone to places I wouldn't have normally because of groupon and usually spent extra.
- wpietri 11y ago
  If it is a common misunderstanding on the stores' part, I think it's Groupon's job to manage that. If an organization is set up to sell the product to the wrong customers, that organization should fix their sales process. But I suspect it's a correct understanding on the part of the employees. When I talked with servers at restaurants, their experience was that the average Groupon customer was demanding, cheap, and a bad tipper. And they were also unlikely to come back, meaning there wasn't a lot of incentive to invest in a relationship.
- ryan90 11y ago
  The business typically only makes 25% of what they would have. A restaurant cannot survive on that margin. And most Grouponers are bottom-feeders. Just looking for a deal. They're also the most likely to be vocal on Yelp (there was a study somewhere showing how Grouponers/Living Social people were more likely to leave bad reviews). Groupon's salespeople are so high-pressure and portray an overly optimistic view of what a struggling small business should expect. Speaking from personal interactions from several business owners who have tried daily deals here. Sure, a business needs to calculate it's ROI, but I think Groupon 1) oversells the value of 'getting their name out there' through their deals and 2) doesn't explain how bad their customers are.
nosage 11y ago
I stopped using groupon when the hostess slipped us a different menu when she asked us if we had a groupon to use.
- IkmoIkmo 11y ago
  I've had this experience a few times and every single time it was mentioned on the Groupon, I actually checked out the menu before hand, and bought or refused the deal there and then. This isn't really unique, you buy a specific deal so you get that deal's menu, Groupon rarely sells some kind of carte blanche 20% discount card on whatever the company offers which seems to be what you were expecting. I've also had Groupon redeem me for stuff that I had no right to in the TOS but was morally sensible to do. There are quite a few things I criticise Groupon for but they've always been pretty transparent about their deals and willing to right any wrongs in my personal experience.
dasboth 11y ago
This was my experience too. We had a 7-course taster meal in a restaurant in Shoreditch and the waitress turned from delightful to rude in an instant after hearing the word "Groupon"...
- tedunangst 11y ago
  Based on her likely experience with the previous ten groupon customers, you basically announced "I intend to tip you 25% of what you were expecting."
  - Symbiote 11y ago
    Based on it being Shoreditch, which is in London, the tip should have been 10%. Do many people leave 2½% (essentially no) tip in London?
    - jacalata 11y ago
      Many people tip on what they paid instead of the normal cost, so if they bought their Groupon at a heavy discount, they'll tip correspondingly less.
    - tedunangst 11y ago
      Nearly everyone tips based on the coupon value, not the market value. So that's maybe 50% less. They're also more "value minded" customers, who are likely to tip at the low end. Regular customers sometimes get the expensive bottle of wine; groupon users only ever get the cheapest bottle, if any. And then you get a subset of people who bring a $20 groupon and exactly $20 to the restaurant. It doesn't mean everyone using groupon is automatically a jerk, but it definitely selects in that direction.
      - mynameisvlad 11y ago
        > groupon users only ever get the cheapest bottle, if any. Yeah, because absolutes like this help. Groupon customers can be just like any other customer out there. Some "regular" customers will get cheap wine, some will get an expensive bottle. Similarly, some Groupon customers will get the cheapest wine, others will take the money they saved by getting a Groupon and get the expensive wine. Being a "Groupon customer" might move the needle towards one direction but it's far from absolute the way you're making it out to be.
neves 11y ago
It's usual for the management of a franchise to organize these groupoun promotions. The owners of the stores is whom suffer.
whisps 11y ago
Not to defend the attitude/behavior of the employees, but I can share my perspective as someone who has managed a small food business that repeatedly used Groupons (because they worked for us, despite what I'm about to describe). There was always a large minority of Groupon users trying to get the rules bent/broken in their favor--so for example, the Groupon they purchased might say "Only useable Monday-Thursday, does not stack with any other Groupon, coupon, promotion, or discount" and then they'd come in on a Saturday and try to use their Groupon with another discount. When we'd explain why that wasn't possible, they'd complain, hold up service for other customers, and/or write negative online reviews. This happened pretty consistently over the course of 2 years and 3 different Groupon deals we had. However, we were not a restaurant--we sold pre-packaged gourmet sweets--and so none of our employees depended on tips to get paid. We also had high profit margin on our goods, so we still made a good amount of profit with the discounted Groupon prices. Additionally, despite the above-described behavior happening consistently, we had even more Groupon users discover the place for the first time, and then become returning and loyal customers. So Groupon worked out for us, but I think it's because we had a pretty unique situation.
- zippergz 11y ago
  I've also noticed a pattern in which a large proportion of the negative reviews for some restaurants (which I know to be good from my own direct experience) mention groupon, and others don't mention groupon but have very similar complaints. I wish Yelp would let you just exclude reviews from people who used groupons because their experiences and/or expectations seem to have nothing in common with mine...
ojbyrne 11y ago
My understanding is that some of that (specific to employees) is because people tip on the basis of the discounted price, and I've gotten groupons where they explicitly say something about "please tip based on the non-discounted price."
TallGuyShort 11y ago
I've had businesses refuse to honour coupons they had sold for money because they weren't getting the return. If I feel resentment from a business because I'm exercising what is essentially a contract, my solution is to not patronize that business again.

by hnal943 11y ago

toomuchtodo 11y ago

I think it was a feedback loop. More often then not, Groupon's provided no return business, so you'd continue to lower you expectations about the people who were buying them. I'd compare it to how hotels will sometimes give you the worst rooms if you booked through an online site that gets heavily discounted inventory.

mindcrime 11y ago
I think it was a feedback loop. More often then not, Groupon's provided no return business, so you'd continue to lower you expectations about the people who were buying them. How much of that is because the business owner made no attempt to establish a direct relationship with the customer while they were present? If you use a groupon to get me in your restaurant, great. But even better if you do some "permission marketing" and get me to add my name to your newsletter list, or "like" your Facebook page, or something that lets you keep in contact with me. It's amazing how few restaurants and hotels and what-not seem to even try to do this kind of customer relationship / one-to-one marketing stuff, in 2015. I get regular emails from Petterino's in Chicago, letting me know about specials on Mother's Day, Father's Day, etc., or other special events. I don't live in Chicago so I don't visit their restaurant very often, but they keep themselves on my mind, and you can bet that next time I'm in Chicago, I'm more predisposed to visit them than most of the other restaurants I vaguely remember from my last time there. OK, to be fair, it helps that the product is really good as well. Their "Midwest Corn Chowder" is to die for. But still, it boggles the mind that none of the other places even seem to try.
- toomuchtodo 11y ago
  Anecdotally, the people I've talked to who bought and used a Groupon have no intention of a continuing business relationship. They got a steal, they know it, and they'll move on to the next Groupon, whatever it is. There's something to be said for the type of audience you cater to. (TL;DR Market to those who know what the idea of "value" is compared to "cheap".)

loco5niner 11y ago

I got a groupon(or similar) for a straight-blade shave. The guy was using replaceable blades, was obviously using and old blade, and absolutely tore my face up. Nicks and blood everywhere. When I didn't give him a tip, I could tell he was upset.

todd3834 11y ago
You are very brave! When it comes to a razor on my throat, I'm not sure I would want a steep discount.
paulcole 11y ago
I believe the vast majority of barbers use a replaceable blade shaver. It's called a shavette and just makes more sense for professional use. If you're not familiar with that, not sure how you could know the blade was old. How often and by what method do you shave/get a straight razor shave? Both of those could affect the quality of the shave more than the age of the blade. http://theshaveden.com/forums/threads/shavettes-the-truth-about-disposable-straight-razors.29942/ http://theshaveden.com/forums/threads/shavettes-the-truth-ab...
- loco5niner 11y ago
  You're right, it was a shavette. This was the one and only time I've gotten a straight blade shave, but at the time, I was often shaving with a double edge razor at home. The blade in the shavette appeared very similar, and I can definitely tell the difference between new blade and old. To me it was a clear case of "penny wise, pound foolish". *I just noticed from your link that the type of blade used was the DE blade, about which the author says "I cannot, in good conscience, recommend any shavette style razor that uses DE blades."
bsder 11y ago
Where did you even find a barber who does straight-blade shaves? Let alone a Groupon?
- jschwartzi 11y ago

deepanchor 11y ago

My experiences with Groupon mirror your own. Whenever my friends and I would show up to a business with a Groupon, we would be treated with bad attitudes, worse service and just general reluctance when the exact opposite should have been true. I mean, that is the entire point of Groupon right? To promote a business -to spread the word on the street about how great your restaurant/bowling alley/pub is. Sadly, it has been my experience that a lot of the businesses that sign up for Groupon don't know what they are getting themselves into and as a result, take out their frustrations on customers when they can't break even for the month... which is, I think, a fatal flaw in the human psychology aspect of the business model. I'd rather just pay the sticker price and enjoy better service than have to deal with all that.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago
I thought that before even trying Groupon. I can't imagine how coming in as a 2nd-class customer will improve my experience. Rather pay well, tip big and enjoy the best service they have to offer. Also, as an Engineer with a 1st-world salary, its socially responsible for me to spread it around.
- zck 11y ago
  But shouldn't Groupon just be a marketing expense? I'm not saying that the company should be ok losing money all the time, but it's common for companies to spend money to acquire customers. Do you avoid all "new customer" deals? It seems like companies on Groupon, for whatever reason, often offer way more of a discount than they're comfortable with. I wonder why that is.
  - RyanZAG 11y ago
    It's not always the company. In the case of the USA and their insane tipping customs, a customer coming in with groupon specials is going to end up tipping less. Since the whole service at USA restaurants is based around tipping, the employees know they won't really get tipped well so they're very customer hostile.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

nadams 11y ago

> I stopped using groupon because of the near-universal resentment I felt from the employees of the stores selling the groupons. Clearly, these businesses weren't getting the value they thought they would get I think that's just a misunderstanding on the stores part. A groupon is just another form of advertising (which costs money) - but businesses believe that by offering groupons they will come out ahead. I've personally gone to places I wouldn't have normally because of groupon and usually spent extra.

wpietri 11y ago
If it is a common misunderstanding on the stores' part, I think it's Groupon's job to manage that. If an organization is set up to sell the product to the wrong customers, that organization should fix their sales process. But I suspect it's a correct understanding on the part of the employees. When I talked with servers at restaurants, their experience was that the average Groupon customer was demanding, cheap, and a bad tipper. And they were also unlikely to come back, meaning there wasn't a lot of incentive to invest in a relationship.
ryan90 11y ago
The business typically only makes 25% of what they would have. A restaurant cannot survive on that margin. And most Grouponers are bottom-feeders. Just looking for a deal. They're also the most likely to be vocal on Yelp (there was a study somewhere showing how Grouponers/Living Social people were more likely to leave bad reviews). Groupon's salespeople are so high-pressure and portray an overly optimistic view of what a struggling small business should expect. Speaking from personal interactions from several business owners who have tried daily deals here. Sure, a business needs to calculate it's ROI, but I think Groupon 1) oversells the value of 'getting their name out there' through their deals and 2) doesn't explain how bad their customers are.

nosage 11y ago

I stopped using groupon when the hostess slipped us a different menu when she asked us if we had a groupon to use.

IkmoIkmo 11y ago
I've had this experience a few times and every single time it was mentioned on the Groupon, I actually checked out the menu before hand, and bought or refused the deal there and then. This isn't really unique, you buy a specific deal so you get that deal's menu, Groupon rarely sells some kind of carte blanche 20% discount card on whatever the company offers which seems to be what you were expecting. I've also had Groupon redeem me for stuff that I had no right to in the TOS but was morally sensible to do. There are quite a few things I criticise Groupon for but they've always been pretty transparent about their deals and willing to right any wrongs in my personal experience.

dasboth 11y ago

This was my experience too. We had a 7-course taster meal in a restaurant in Shoreditch and the waitress turned from delightful to rude in an instant after hearing the word "Groupon"...

tedunangst 11y ago
Based on her likely experience with the previous ten groupon customers, you basically announced "I intend to tip you 25% of what you were expecting."
- Symbiote 11y ago
  Based on it being Shoreditch, which is in London, the tip should have been 10%. Do many people leave 2½% (essentially no) tip in London?
  - jacalata 11y ago
    Many people tip on what they paid instead of the normal cost, so if they bought their Groupon at a heavy discount, they'll tip correspondingly less.
  - tedunangst 11y ago
    Nearly everyone tips based on the coupon value, not the market value. So that's maybe 50% less. They're also more "value minded" customers, who are likely to tip at the low end. Regular customers sometimes get the expensive bottle of wine; groupon users only ever get the cheapest bottle, if any. And then you get a subset of people who bring a $20 groupon and exactly $20 to the restaurant. It doesn't mean everyone using groupon is automatically a jerk, but it definitely selects in that direction.
    - mynameisvlad 11y ago
      > groupon users only ever get the cheapest bottle, if any. Yeah, because absolutes like this help. Groupon customers can be just like any other customer out there. Some "regular" customers will get cheap wine, some will get an expensive bottle. Similarly, some Groupon customers will get the cheapest wine, others will take the money they saved by getting a Groupon and get the expensive wine. Being a "Groupon customer" might move the needle towards one direction but it's far from absolute the way you're making it out to be.

neves 11y ago

It's usual for the management of a franchise to organize these groupoun promotions. The owners of the stores is whom suffer.

whisps 11y ago

Not to defend the attitude/behavior of the employees, but I can share my perspective as someone who has managed a small food business that repeatedly used Groupons (because they worked for us, despite what I'm about to describe). There was always a large minority of Groupon users trying to get the rules bent/broken in their favor--so for example, the Groupon they purchased might say "Only useable Monday-Thursday, does not stack with any other Groupon, coupon, promotion, or discount" and then they'd come in on a Saturday and try to use their Groupon with another discount. When we'd explain why that wasn't possible, they'd complain, hold up service for other customers, and/or write negative online reviews. This happened pretty consistently over the course of 2 years and 3 different Groupon deals we had. However, we were not a restaurant--we sold pre-packaged gourmet sweets--and so none of our employees depended on tips to get paid. We also had high profit margin on our goods, so we still made a good amount of profit with the discounted Groupon prices. Additionally, despite the above-described behavior happening consistently, we had even more Groupon users discover the place for the first time, and then become returning and loyal customers. So Groupon worked out for us, but I think it's because we had a pretty unique situation.

zippergz 11y ago
I've also noticed a pattern in which a large proportion of the negative reviews for some restaurants (which I know to be good from my own direct experience) mention groupon, and others don't mention groupon but have very similar complaints. I wish Yelp would let you just exclude reviews from people who used groupons because their experiences and/or expectations seem to have nothing in common with mine...

ojbyrne 11y ago

My understanding is that some of that (specific to employees) is because people tip on the basis of the discounted price, and I've gotten groupons where they explicitly say something about "please tip based on the non-discounted price."

TallGuyShort 11y ago

I've had businesses refuse to honour coupons they had sold for money because they weren't getting the return. If I feel resentment from a business because I'm exercising what is essentially a contract, my solution is to not patronize that business again.