5 ms·

Political correctness, as far as I've been able to tell, boils down in most cases to: be respectful in how you treat people, because the ubiquitous disrespect

by Frondo 11y ago

Political correctness, as far as I've been able to tell, boils down in most cases to: be respectful in how you treat people, because the ubiquitous disrespect shown to women/minorities/gays/whoever is no longer considered appropriate or praiseworthy. I don't think I've ever heard someone complain about political correctness run amok, and had it turn out that they weren't just complaining--in careful language, mind--about uppity black people or women trying to rise above their station (i.e. the kitchen). You might not be referring to that, of course. What do you mean about "sick and tired of political correctness"? And what demands are being made that are so burdensome? Is it the stuff about not assuming muslims are terrorists, or not assuming brown people are illegals? Is it the bit about not tossing around phrases like "anchor babies," or the thing about putting a woman on a common denomination of currency?

seivan 11y ago
You forgot the part where it's used to harass and chase people you might consider to be 'fascists'. Where it's justified for the Gulag ;-) But if you want to keep thinking it's about respect and not abused by people, sure, that's pretty noble.
- Frondo 11y ago
  As far as I know, the political correctness police don't actually send anyone to forced labor camps, because, of course, no such thing exists. As for being harassed or chased, again, it seems like, if there's any merit to that accusation of harassment or "chasing," the beleaguered not-politically-correct victims of that could, you know, call the cops or file a restraining order or whatever. Those are actual real-world behaviors you're accusing the political correctness police of making, but I guess I just don't buy it. Well-meaning, respectful people are being "harassed" or "chased" by some foul political correctness police? Pull the other one, it's got bells on.
  - seivan 11y ago
    Yeah no forced labor/torture camps exist today. And people aren't put in them for their unpopular views such as atheism or satire. And if a person wants to state something crude and obviously insensitive and get sent to a forced labour camp, it's their own God damn fault for being insensitive to the dear leader(s) You don't get sent to a forced labour camp in civilised countries. You get ostracised, to be fair they probably deserved to be silenced because they are bigots.
  - dennisnedry 11y ago
    Here's an example of the "political correct police" - Twitter shaming. Somebody says something satirical and they are assigned a "label". This was the case with Justine Sacco. Jerry Seinfeld and Chris Rock refuse to perform at universities, citing that the students there "can't take a joke due to political correctness". There isn't a regulating force in the USA for being PC; however, there are social ramifications that lead to real life consequences.
    - rustynails 11y ago
      Or, watch the Google Science Fair awards for 2015. The Bolivian teacher that won an award said she supported "girls", I assumed it was a girls school until i saw a glimpse of a boy momentarily. No one blinked an eye, but my first thought was "how do those poor boys feel being ostracised like that, especially when it's done on purpose". That's political correctness says it's fine to discriminate against boys. Thankfully, other than one slip up by a Google employee (who corrected herself quickly), it was well balanced across genders and nationalities.
    - Frondo 11y ago
      If twitter shaming is the punishment that the PC police can dole out, I would deem them the least consequential force for justice in the history of the world. It's actually kind of difficult to believe that you're really saying that--the PC police can't lock you up, can't send you to the gulag, but they can shame you on twitter! That's no consequence. That's nothing. As for Seinfeld not getting much of a laugh out of college kids anymore, I'd say he made the critical error of having dated, boring material. Humor's always changing, comics (unless they want to move into the corporate retreat humor circuit) got to keep up with the times. Telling the audience they're in the wrong for not finding the old material funny? Now that's a good joke.
      - Nadya 11y ago
        >It's actually kind of difficult to believe that you're really saying that--the PC police can't lock you up, can't send you to the gulag, but they can shame you on twitter! That's no consequence. That's nothing. Which leads to job loss and career damage because you have a mob of 10,000 twats with nothing better to do than complain on Twitter to anyone who even so much as thinks of hiring your "racist ass" because you shared an article about the military armor having chinks in it [0]. Or do you think the Army was being racist? That's what people are terming as "PC" and "overly PC". >Telling the audience they're in the wrong for not finding the old material funny? Now that's a good joke. Comedy and tragedy go hand in hand. When someone is unable to make humor out of tragedy - you lose comedy. There is a reason that, outside of wordplay, most jokes play on disasters, stereotypes or outrageous scenarios. If you think you know a joke that isn't a play on words or isn't based on a stereotype, feel free to share it. I can't even think of one. While I do have some respect for rakugo performances [1], it's not something a lot of people can get into. An entire comedy based on nothing but wordplay and puns only fits a niche audience. Maybe more people who do nothing but puns and dry humor should tell jokes at college campuses? Joke: "I spilled some spot remover on my dog. Now he's gone." Expected College Campus Reaction: "Animal abuse!!!" Nevermind. Dry humor off limits too. The college niche dislikes politically incorrect jokes. While colleges have always leaned pretty liberal, in recent years academia has gone absolutely crazy over gender/identity politics. Anyone who so much as laughs at a potentially-racist-joke gets shunned by their peers as a racist. So yes, it's fair to say "college kids are just too PC for the jokes" when they're still successful everywhere else and even among the same age range but with different, and less PC-extreme, political leanings. [0] http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-army-deletes-tweet-after-accusations-of-racism-only-to-provoke-more-anger-10016273.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-army-del... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakugo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakugo
A_COMPUTER 11y ago
Euphemism treadmill, ridiculous proliferation of personal pronouns, victim veto, persistent assault on works like The Mikado or Dante's Inferno. Anchor babies are a thing, Chinese pay 80K for exactly what the term implies, feds shut down places being used for birth tourism, but being true's not a defense when the goal's not offending. Careful language, what could be wrong with that? Well what's the opportunity cost, what's the upper limit on the cognitive burden on that? Relatively easy for people with college degrees and lots of time, great way to signal social superiority by being able to waste fucktons of time on intricate, piddling shit, just like aristocrats used to do with clothing and politeness rules. No cost to being polite, except for all those plays I guess you can't show anymore. Let's throw a fit about a kid wearing a fucking kimono, what's that, Japanese people don't even care? That's not important to me, this is the USA and I've got to show how not racist I am by calling other people racist. Oh shit, the little girl wearing the kimono is biracial and has a Japanese mom, well she looked white so when I started that shitstorm of hate against the family on Facebook and Twitter, at least I was raising awareness about cultural appropriation. She was white-looking anyway so she has white privilege. Cool story, political correctness isn't real.
- Frondo 11y ago
  I saw a performance of the Mikado a few years ago. It's definitely still being performed. It's also not one of Gilbert & Sullivan's finest, so if it falls out of the rotation, shrug. As for the euphemism treadmill, or the ridiculous proliferation of personal pronouns, hey, if you don't care about or respect the people who are asking you to use those labels, don't use them. That's what it comes down to--respect. Do you want to show others the respect of using their preferred words? Fine, go for it. There really isn't any law you're breaking if you don't show them that respect. It just means you don't want to show them that respect, for whatever reason you choose.
  - MadcapJake 11y ago
    Respect is kind of like personal hygiene. If you want to be the smelly kid, go for it. People might not want to hang out with you though. What's so funny about the great PC-hate is that people sit there and complain that others are spending too much time being PC. Now just imagine those same fools complaining about others spending too much time on their personal hygiene, pretty ridiculous eh? What's even more funny is that some people think that politicians could be non-PC and do just fine...do smelly kids get picked first or last? If you think about it, PCness is such a non-issue that it really brings to light how completely botched the US political climate is. If you spend the time to post a diatribe on PCness, you are supporting non-thoughtful/non-constructive discourse on important issues. You probably think bathtime is stupid and you probably think careful, respectful communication is just too much effort. Well, sorry to burst your bubble: politics are EVERYWHERE. Everything we do is awash with political forces and the more effort/thoughtfulness/care you put in to dealing with them, the more you will gain (at least the respect of your peers). On the flipside, the more you choose to ignore PC, respect, etc., the more you will find yourself an outsider and a pariah. So the next time you read/hear someone expressing the ills of PC or the joys of nonPC, just imagine they're school-age kids complaining of the degradation of bathtime or waxing poetic about the virtues of smelliness.
Lawtonfogle 11y ago
>I don't think I've ever heard someone complain about political correctness run amok What about getting fired over a private joke about forking a repository?

by Frondo 11y ago

seivan 11y ago

You forgot the part where it's used to harass and chase people you might consider to be 'fascists'. Where it's justified for the Gulag ;-) But if you want to keep thinking it's about respect and not abused by people, sure, that's pretty noble.

Frondo 11y ago
As far as I know, the political correctness police don't actually send anyone to forced labor camps, because, of course, no such thing exists. As for being harassed or chased, again, it seems like, if there's any merit to that accusation of harassment or "chasing," the beleaguered not-politically-correct victims of that could, you know, call the cops or file a restraining order or whatever. Those are actual real-world behaviors you're accusing the political correctness police of making, but I guess I just don't buy it. Well-meaning, respectful people are being "harassed" or "chased" by some foul political correctness police? Pull the other one, it's got bells on.
- seivan 11y ago
  Yeah no forced labor/torture camps exist today. And people aren't put in them for their unpopular views such as atheism or satire. And if a person wants to state something crude and obviously insensitive and get sent to a forced labour camp, it's their own God damn fault for being insensitive to the dear leader(s) You don't get sent to a forced labour camp in civilised countries. You get ostracised, to be fair they probably deserved to be silenced because they are bigots.
- dennisnedry 11y ago
  Here's an example of the "political correct police" - Twitter shaming. Somebody says something satirical and they are assigned a "label". This was the case with Justine Sacco. Jerry Seinfeld and Chris Rock refuse to perform at universities, citing that the students there "can't take a joke due to political correctness". There isn't a regulating force in the USA for being PC; however, there are social ramifications that lead to real life consequences.
  - rustynails 11y ago
    Or, watch the Google Science Fair awards for 2015. The Bolivian teacher that won an award said she supported "girls", I assumed it was a girls school until i saw a glimpse of a boy momentarily. No one blinked an eye, but my first thought was "how do those poor boys feel being ostracised like that, especially when it's done on purpose". That's political correctness says it's fine to discriminate against boys. Thankfully, other than one slip up by a Google employee (who corrected herself quickly), it was well balanced across genders and nationalities.
  - Frondo 11y ago
    If twitter shaming is the punishment that the PC police can dole out, I would deem them the least consequential force for justice in the history of the world. It's actually kind of difficult to believe that you're really saying that--the PC police can't lock you up, can't send you to the gulag, but they can shame you on twitter! That's no consequence. That's nothing. As for Seinfeld not getting much of a laugh out of college kids anymore, I'd say he made the critical error of having dated, boring material. Humor's always changing, comics (unless they want to move into the corporate retreat humor circuit) got to keep up with the times. Telling the audience they're in the wrong for not finding the old material funny? Now that's a good joke.
    - Nadya 11y ago
      >It's actually kind of difficult to believe that you're really saying that--the PC police can't lock you up, can't send you to the gulag, but they can shame you on twitter! That's no consequence. That's nothing. Which leads to job loss and career damage because you have a mob of 10,000 twats with nothing better to do than complain on Twitter to anyone who even so much as thinks of hiring your "racist ass" because you shared an article about the military armor having chinks in it [0]. Or do you think the Army was being racist? That's what people are terming as "PC" and "overly PC". >Telling the audience they're in the wrong for not finding the old material funny? Now that's a good joke. Comedy and tragedy go hand in hand. When someone is unable to make humor out of tragedy - you lose comedy. There is a reason that, outside of wordplay, most jokes play on disasters, stereotypes or outrageous scenarios. If you think you know a joke that isn't a play on words or isn't based on a stereotype, feel free to share it. I can't even think of one. While I do have some respect for rakugo performances [1], it's not something a lot of people can get into. An entire comedy based on nothing but wordplay and puns only fits a niche audience. Maybe more people who do nothing but puns and dry humor should tell jokes at college campuses? Joke: "I spilled some spot remover on my dog. Now he's gone." Expected College Campus Reaction: "Animal abuse!!!" Nevermind. Dry humor off limits too. The college niche dislikes politically incorrect jokes. While colleges have always leaned pretty liberal, in recent years academia has gone absolutely crazy over gender/identity politics. Anyone who so much as laughs at a potentially-racist-joke gets shunned by their peers as a racist. So yes, it's fair to say "college kids are just too PC for the jokes" when they're still successful everywhere else and even among the same age range but with different, and less PC-extreme, political leanings. [0] http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-army-deletes-tweet-after-accusations-of-racism-only-to-provoke-more-anger-10016273.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-army-del... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakugo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakugo

A_COMPUTER 11y ago

Euphemism treadmill, ridiculous proliferation of personal pronouns, victim veto, persistent assault on works like The Mikado or Dante's Inferno. Anchor babies are a thing, Chinese pay 80K for exactly what the term implies, feds shut down places being used for birth tourism, but being true's not a defense when the goal's not offending. Careful language, what could be wrong with that? Well what's the opportunity cost, what's the upper limit on the cognitive burden on that? Relatively easy for people with college degrees and lots of time, great way to signal social superiority by being able to waste fucktons of time on intricate, piddling shit, just like aristocrats used to do with clothing and politeness rules. No cost to being polite, except for all those plays I guess you can't show anymore. Let's throw a fit about a kid wearing a fucking kimono, what's that, Japanese people don't even care? That's not important to me, this is the USA and I've got to show how not racist I am by calling other people racist. Oh shit, the little girl wearing the kimono is biracial and has a Japanese mom, well she looked white so when I started that shitstorm of hate against the family on Facebook and Twitter, at least I was raising awareness about cultural appropriation. She was white-looking anyway so she has white privilege. Cool story, political correctness isn't real.

Frondo 11y ago
I saw a performance of the Mikado a few years ago. It's definitely still being performed. It's also not one of Gilbert & Sullivan's finest, so if it falls out of the rotation, shrug. As for the euphemism treadmill, or the ridiculous proliferation of personal pronouns, hey, if you don't care about or respect the people who are asking you to use those labels, don't use them. That's what it comes down to--respect. Do you want to show others the respect of using their preferred words? Fine, go for it. There really isn't any law you're breaking if you don't show them that respect. It just means you don't want to show them that respect, for whatever reason you choose.
- MadcapJake 11y ago
  Respect is kind of like personal hygiene. If you want to be the smelly kid, go for it. People might not want to hang out with you though. What's so funny about the great PC-hate is that people sit there and complain that others are spending too much time being PC. Now just imagine those same fools complaining about others spending too much time on their personal hygiene, pretty ridiculous eh? What's even more funny is that some people think that politicians could be non-PC and do just fine...do smelly kids get picked first or last? If you think about it, PCness is such a non-issue that it really brings to light how completely botched the US political climate is. If you spend the time to post a diatribe on PCness, you are supporting non-thoughtful/non-constructive discourse on important issues. You probably think bathtime is stupid and you probably think careful, respectful communication is just too much effort. Well, sorry to burst your bubble: politics are EVERYWHERE. Everything we do is awash with political forces and the more effort/thoughtfulness/care you put in to dealing with them, the more you will gain (at least the respect of your peers). On the flipside, the more you choose to ignore PC, respect, etc., the more you will find yourself an outsider and a pariah. So the next time you read/hear someone expressing the ills of PC or the joys of nonPC, just imagine they're school-age kids complaining of the degradation of bathtime or waxing poetic about the virtues of smelliness.

Lawtonfogle 11y ago

>I don't think I've ever heard someone complain about political correctness run amok What about getting fired over a private joke about forking a repository?