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I disagree. I am a physician training to be an electrophysiologist (cardiologist that sub-specializes in the electrical conducting system of the heart). Witho

by khed 11y ago

I disagree. I am a physician training to be an electrophysiologist (cardiologist that sub-specializes in the electrical conducting system of the heart). Without significant equipment it would be impossible to disconnect the leads of an EKG without causing enormous irregularities in the read out. Even small movements, like subtly shifting the body, causes blatantly obvious noise in the EKG baseline. If these baseline changes weren't present, as the authors state, then it is unreasonable to assume the yogi removed the leads.

carbocation 11y ago
> The straight line on the ECG persisted till the eighth morning. Then, to our astonishment, electrical activity returned about half an hour before the pit was scheduled to be opened. After some initial disturbance, a normal configuration appeared. Sounds a bit like he disconnected and reconnected.
sandworm101 11y ago
This was 1973 and a pen-on-paper EKG. The sensitivity re disconnecting things might be slightly less than you are used to these days.
cjensen 11y ago
It's well-understood that if your heart stops for a few minutes, your brain dies. Since his brain didn't die, we can conclude that his heart never stopped. A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. Therefore we can conclude that the yogi is a liar. The letter prints out some of the EKGs, but declines to show the moment when the flatline occurs, and the moment when the heart is again detected.[1] You now have four facts: (1) the yogi's heart did not stop, (2) the EKG lead showed no activity, (3) the yogi is a habitual deceiver and (4) the most important data is intentionally hidden from the reader Do you still feel confident that the yogi did not disconnect the leads? [1] An alternative explanation would be that this 1973-era EKG machine did not make continuous recordings, in which case it defies reason to claim that it was watched carefully enough to rule out irregularities during the transition to/from flatline.
- jtriangle 11y ago
  You're making an awful lot of assumptions to arrive at your conclusion. You have exactly as much evidence as is provided in the article and therefore can't make the claim that he did not. Of your points above, only point 1 is based in any sort of fact which relies on a current understanding of how a human heart functions. Therefore, the point you're making is that a human heart cannot be consciously stopped because a human heart cannot be consciously controlled. With the current data you've been provided all you can do is conclude that the test was flawed, not that what the test suggested was true or false.
- PhasmaFelis 11y ago
  > A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. This does not appear to be accurate, based on a few minutes on Google. It's unlikely but possible for humans to live more than a week with no water.
- phaemon 11y ago
  > A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. This is factually incorrect. We know of people who have survived longer without water. > Therefore we can conclude that the yogi is a liar. Therefore I can conclude you are a liar?
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- khed 11y ago
  You are make a fallacious argument. Your first point is just taking your conclusion for granted. Your third point is just assumed, not proven. People have survived at least 40 minutes with circulatory arrest. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_B%C3%A5genholm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_B%C3%A5genholm EKG machines have been capable of continuous read outs since before this research was published. It is entirely reasonable to be mildly skeptical of research. But with a clear grounding for your bayesian priors, extreme skepticism becomes inimical to the search for truth. That said, I would like to see the EKG during the "transition" periods.

by khed 11y ago

carbocation 11y ago

> The straight line on the ECG persisted till the eighth morning. Then, to our astonishment, electrical activity returned about half an hour before the pit was scheduled to be opened. After some initial disturbance, a normal configuration appeared. Sounds a bit like he disconnected and reconnected.

sandworm101 11y ago

This was 1973 and a pen-on-paper EKG. The sensitivity re disconnecting things might be slightly less than you are used to these days.

cjensen 11y ago

It's well-understood that if your heart stops for a few minutes, your brain dies. Since his brain didn't die, we can conclude that his heart never stopped. A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. Therefore we can conclude that the yogi is a liar. The letter prints out some of the EKGs, but declines to show the moment when the flatline occurs, and the moment when the heart is again detected.[1] You now have four facts: (1) the yogi's heart did not stop, (2) the EKG lead showed no activity, (3) the yogi is a habitual deceiver and (4) the most important data is intentionally hidden from the reader Do you still feel confident that the yogi did not disconnect the leads? [1] An alternative explanation would be that this 1973-era EKG machine did not make continuous recordings, in which case it defies reason to claim that it was watched carefully enough to rule out irregularities during the transition to/from flatline.

jtriangle 11y ago
You're making an awful lot of assumptions to arrive at your conclusion. You have exactly as much evidence as is provided in the article and therefore can't make the claim that he did not. Of your points above, only point 1 is based in any sort of fact which relies on a current understanding of how a human heart functions. Therefore, the point you're making is that a human heart cannot be consciously stopped because a human heart cannot be consciously controlled. With the current data you've been provided all you can do is conclude that the test was flawed, not that what the test suggested was true or false.
PhasmaFelis 11y ago
> A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. This does not appear to be accurate, based on a few minutes on Google. It's unlikely but possible for humans to live more than a week with no water.
phaemon 11y ago
> A human cannot live without water for the length of time claimed. This is factually incorrect. We know of people who have survived longer without water. > Therefore we can conclude that the yogi is a liar. Therefore I can conclude you are a liar?
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
khed 11y ago
You are make a fallacious argument. Your first point is just taking your conclusion for granted. Your third point is just assumed, not proven. People have survived at least 40 minutes with circulatory arrest. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_B%C3%A5genholm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_B%C3%A5genholm EKG machines have been capable of continuous read outs since before this research was published. It is entirely reasonable to be mildly skeptical of research. But with a clear grounding for your bayesian priors, extreme skepticism becomes inimical to the search for truth. That said, I would like to see the EKG during the "transition" periods.