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Look up the "China study" for an incredibly detailed study on plant-based diets, or the research that's been done on the "Blue Zones." In addition there have be

Look up the "China study" for an incredibly detailed study on plant-based diets, or the research that's been done on the "Blue Zones." In addition there have been quite a number of studies on diet that show people who follow plant-based diets live longer and have fewer health problems. Being vegetarian doesn't require a lot of effort if you learn a little bit more than the average American about food. Eating fruit, veg, grains, and beans is not difficult and provides all the nutrients one could need - even more, considering how unhealthy the standard American diet (SAD) is. Look up vegan body builders - you will see that they are not puny at all!

com2kid 11y ago
The China Study has been debunked numerous times[0]. I'm currently on a high fat, medium protein, 0 carb diet. It isn't environmentally friendly, but the weight falls off and I feel great. The Standard American Diet is High Carb, Medium Fat, with some tasteless white meat (turkey breasts) thrown in at random. [0]http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
- geomark 11y ago
  That's a ketogenic diet, right? I tried that about 6 months ago, but not to lose weight, in fact I really don't have any extra weight to lose. I just wanted to reduce my blood sugar and see if it improved mental clarity as some people have claimed. I ended up losing 5 kilos in two weeks, which is a lot since I wasn't overweight at all. I couldn't keep the weight on without the carbs. The bummer was I got the flu right around that time and was so sick I just didn't feel like eating. And since I had lost so much weight I had no reserves and just looked and felt like hell. I'm ok now, no worries, but I find it hard to eat enough fats and protein to maintain my weight without any carbs.
  - eimai134 11y ago
    I know exactly what you mean. This no carb thing is a crazy fad! Many people don't seem to understand the difference between good carbs like many whole grains, and bad carbs like refined white flour. We shouldn't classify all carbs together in the same group!
- DanBC 11y ago
  > and I feel great. That's not a good way to assess a lifestyle that has long term consequences. If a lifestyle increases your risk of bowel cancer that's going to happen this week, it'll happen after you get to fifty. UK screening for bowel cancer happens at 55. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx (90 g is 3oz.)
  - mobiuscog 11y ago
    Neither is relying on government 'recommendations' based upon a fairly old working group recommendation (1990s) which itself was based around interpretation of other studies. I'm all for following scientific research (especially if it includes actual scientific process) but the governmental guidelines are not (unfortunately) the most reliable. We've already suffered through 'eggs increase cholesterol - don't eat too many' and 'saturated fat is evil - avoid it' which had been well proven to be largely false for most people.
  - Evgeny 11y ago
    http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx So ... not a single link to a scientific study on that very long page? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 Collectively, associations between red meat consumption and colorectal cancer are generally weak in magnitude, with most relative risks below 1.50 and not statistically significant, and there is a lack of a clear dose-response trend. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014000564 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014... Meat contains a number of compounds of nutritional benefit and may not be carcinogenic as such but rather, when consumed in very high amounts, may result in an imbalanced diet and thereby increase the risk of developing CRC. Products formed in cured or heated meats may further enhance such damage. So, basically, do not eat so much meat that your diet is unbalanced, and avoid processed meats and you'll be fine.
    - noondip 11y ago
      > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 This work was partially funded by the Beef Checkoff, through the National Cattlemen's Beef Association (NCBA) > http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014000564 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014... D Weed has received consulting fees from the National Cattleman's Beef Association in the past. So, basically, you have been mislead by industry lobbyists.
- noondip 11y ago
  > I'm currently on a high fat, medium protein, 0 carb diet. It isn't environmentally friendly, but the weight falls off and I feel great. Your personal experience is not statistically significant. There is overwhelming scientific consensus that a plant-based, whole food, vegan diet is optimal for human health. Okinawan and Seventh-Day Adventist in California diets are two frequently cited examples.
Evgeny 11y ago
In addition there have been quite a number of studies on diet that show people who follow plant-based diets live longer and have fewer health problems These studies have a huge flaw though: vegetarians in Western world very often do it for health reasons. Therefore, vegetarians also exercise, smoke and drink less and generally care more about their health compared to omnivores. So called "healthy user bias". The benefits of vegetarianism disappear when you compare them to other health conscious groups, or when you look at societies where people are vegetarians for religious purposes. or the research that's been done on the "Blue Zones." And all Blue Zone diets included meat, by the way. Plus, of course, the research was purely observational. Look up vegan body builders - you will see that they are not puny at all! There are hardly any, so they are more an exception than the rule.
- eimai134 11y ago
  You are missing the point on what I said - the China study was about plant-based diets. And all of the Blue Zone diets do not include meat - I can think of the Seventh Day Adventists that were studied just as one example. While you are correct that the exception doesn't prove the rule regarding vegan body builders, it doesn't work for saying plant-eaters are puny either! You can be healthy or unhealthy by being vegetarian. My point was that it is very possible to be strong and super-fit. There are actually quite a number of vegan bodybuilders and athletes.
  - Evgeny 11y ago
    You are missing the point on what I said - the China study was about plant-based diets. China study was widely critisized, and the author's own data does not support his conclusions. There was a link already in this discussion, here's one more http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/ http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/ And all of the Blue Zone diets do not include meat - I can think of the Seventh Day Adventists that were studied just as one example. As I remember, only some of them are vegetarians, it is not a requirement. My point was that it is very possible to be strong and super-fit. There are actually quite a number of vegan bodybuilders and athletes. I suppose it's technically possible, just so much harder. Otherwise those elusive vegan bodybuilders would be a majority. Just to make my point clear: I'm not saying vegetarianism is bad or unhealthy. I'm just against demonizing animal based foods for no reason.

com2kid 11y ago

The China Study has been debunked numerous times[0]. I'm currently on a high fat, medium protein, 0 carb diet. It isn't environmentally friendly, but the weight falls off and I feel great. The Standard American Diet is High Carb, Medium Fat, with some tasteless white meat (turkey breasts) thrown in at random. [0]http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html

geomark 11y ago
That's a ketogenic diet, right? I tried that about 6 months ago, but not to lose weight, in fact I really don't have any extra weight to lose. I just wanted to reduce my blood sugar and see if it improved mental clarity as some people have claimed. I ended up losing 5 kilos in two weeks, which is a lot since I wasn't overweight at all. I couldn't keep the weight on without the carbs. The bummer was I got the flu right around that time and was so sick I just didn't feel like eating. And since I had lost so much weight I had no reserves and just looked and felt like hell. I'm ok now, no worries, but I find it hard to eat enough fats and protein to maintain my weight without any carbs.
- eimai134 11y ago
  I know exactly what you mean. This no carb thing is a crazy fad! Many people don't seem to understand the difference between good carbs like many whole grains, and bad carbs like refined white flour. We shouldn't classify all carbs together in the same group!
DanBC 11y ago
> and I feel great. That's not a good way to assess a lifestyle that has long term consequences. If a lifestyle increases your risk of bowel cancer that's going to happen this week, it'll happen after you get to fifty. UK screening for bowel cancer happens at 55. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx (90 g is 3oz.)
- mobiuscog 11y ago
  Neither is relying on government 'recommendations' based upon a fairly old working group recommendation (1990s) which itself was based around interpretation of other studies. I'm all for following scientific research (especially if it includes actual scientific process) but the governmental guidelines are not (unfortunately) the most reliable. We've already suffered through 'eggs increase cholesterol - don't eat too many' and 'saturated fat is evil - avoid it' which had been well proven to be largely false for most people.
- Evgeny 11y ago
  http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/Goodfood/Pages/red-meat.aspx So ... not a single link to a scientific study on that very long page? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 Collectively, associations between red meat consumption and colorectal cancer are generally weak in magnitude, with most relative risks below 1.50 and not statistically significant, and there is a lack of a clear dose-response trend. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014000564 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014... Meat contains a number of compounds of nutritional benefit and may not be carcinogenic as such but rather, when consumed in very high amounts, may result in an imbalanced diet and thereby increase the risk of developing CRC. Products formed in cured or heated meats may further enhance such damage. So, basically, do not eat so much meat that your diet is unbalanced, and avoid processed meats and you'll be fine.
  - noondip 11y ago
    > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20663065 This work was partially funded by the Beef Checkoff, through the National Cattlemen's Beef Association (NCBA) > http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014000564 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174014... D Weed has received consulting fees from the National Cattleman's Beef Association in the past. So, basically, you have been mislead by industry lobbyists.
noondip 11y ago
> I'm currently on a high fat, medium protein, 0 carb diet. It isn't environmentally friendly, but the weight falls off and I feel great. Your personal experience is not statistically significant. There is overwhelming scientific consensus that a plant-based, whole food, vegan diet is optimal for human health. Okinawan and Seventh-Day Adventist in California diets are two frequently cited examples.

Evgeny 11y ago

In addition there have been quite a number of studies on diet that show people who follow plant-based diets live longer and have fewer health problems These studies have a huge flaw though: vegetarians in Western world very often do it for health reasons. Therefore, vegetarians also exercise, smoke and drink less and generally care more about their health compared to omnivores. So called "healthy user bias". The benefits of vegetarianism disappear when you compare them to other health conscious groups, or when you look at societies where people are vegetarians for religious purposes. or the research that's been done on the "Blue Zones." And all Blue Zone diets included meat, by the way. Plus, of course, the research was purely observational. Look up vegan body builders - you will see that they are not puny at all! There are hardly any, so they are more an exception than the rule.

eimai134 11y ago
You are missing the point on what I said - the China study was about plant-based diets. And all of the Blue Zone diets do not include meat - I can think of the Seventh Day Adventists that were studied just as one example. While you are correct that the exception doesn't prove the rule regarding vegan body builders, it doesn't work for saying plant-eaters are puny either! You can be healthy or unhealthy by being vegetarian. My point was that it is very possible to be strong and super-fit. There are actually quite a number of vegan bodybuilders and athletes.
- Evgeny 11y ago
  You are missing the point on what I said - the China study was about plant-based diets. China study was widely critisized, and the author's own data does not support his conclusions. There was a link already in this discussion, here's one more http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/ http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/ And all of the Blue Zone diets do not include meat - I can think of the Seventh Day Adventists that were studied just as one example. As I remember, only some of them are vegetarians, it is not a requirement. My point was that it is very possible to be strong and super-fit. There are actually quite a number of vegan bodybuilders and athletes. I suppose it's technically possible, just so much harder. Otherwise those elusive vegan bodybuilders would be a majority. Just to make my point clear: I'm not saying vegetarianism is bad or unhealthy. I'm just against demonizing animal based foods for no reason.