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Others were more civil in their reply to you. I just have to call your comment complete bullshit. I ignore the first two paragraphs which are devoid of content

Others were more civil in their reply to you. I just have to call your comment complete bullshit. I ignore the first two paragraphs which are devoid of content, but try to set you up as reasonable person. Then you bring up parenthood. And boy, you messed that up. I don't think you can fail any further. Not only are you trying to set up (your own!) rules to even _have_ a child, you are then ending in a - as far as I can read this comment - condescending 'be better than your parents were' pat-on-the-back comment. Here's the thing: You cannot make sure that you can take care of a child's needs. You might be prepared to support a kid and looking forward to a family of three. Then you get twins or more. Or your kid has health problems (let's take a really common but overused example: Trisomy 21). The former just means that your calculation was off by one or more and you basically pay twice+ of what you planned for - and arguably have more than twice the amount of stress. The latter is something that influences the rest of your life. You probably _planned_ to pay for college, but now you pay for a lot more and basically will have a child that will need support in one way or another. You claimed that the GP shouldn't have kids if they couldn't afford to take care of them. I say that you don't even _know_ what kids need before you get them. Yes, if you live under a bridge you might not be in the best position to have a child. No, "I might need help" isn't a reason to have no child though. And frankly, I'm so sad that you really think that way. In my world, society is meant to support people in need. If I lose my job tomorrow, I'm glad to know that the people around me will support me - through taxes - until I get a new job. If I have a kid that needs help I'm glad to know that the people around me will contribute to make its life bearable/comfortable/as good as possible. Actually, that's the only thing a state is good for. If it cannot provide that, why would you associate yourself with it in the first place? If it doesn't help you when you're in need of help, why .. wouldn't you ditch it and shake your head while you're traveling across the border?

zo1 11y ago
>"And frankly, I'm so sad that you really think that way. In my world, society is meant to support people in need." And in my world, I have chosen to bear the responsibilities of taking care of the ones I love. Because they are the most important individuals to me, and my morals necessitate that I do not impose my will on others by virtue of the state. >"Here's the thing: You cannot make sure that you can take care of a child's needs. You might be prepared to support a kid and looking forward to a family of three." I get the general point you are making. And I fully agree with you. Unforeseen circumstances happen, and they can be unplanned for. However, in my comment I meant more in terms of general care, which is something that is sorely neglected in today's world where we all expect the state to foot the bill. I.e. Food, basic healthcare, education and safety. I do my best to mitigate all of those. Life insurance, disability insurance, and unusual amounts of saving. >"Actually, that's the only thing a state is good for. If it cannot provide that, why would you associate yourself with it in the first place" Agreed. And yet it does not do that. And doubly-so, we are not calling the state out on it (referendum?). Yet we're perfectly content on espousing it as some sort of "ideal" to bash horrible free-thinking individuals with. As far as I am able to, I don't associate myself with the state. But we both know there is no place for us to go "across the border". It's either another state, a war-torn country (Somalia, etc), or inhospitable water.
- dijit 11y ago
  We're going a bit personal here, but, circumstances are everchanging.. when my mother decided to keep me, she had both parents, both grandparents and a network of friends. All the family died (except my mothers father who did not wish to help) and her friends no longer associated with her because she wasn't available enough. so, you can be wholly unprepared for raising a child and not even know it.
- darklajid 11y ago
  First of all: Thanks for the reply. >"However, in my comment I meant more in terms of general care, which is something that is sorely neglected in today's world where we all expect the state to foot the bill. I.e. Food, basic healthcare, education and safety." I'm not sure I follow. Can you elaborate? Not my native language and so far I read this as 'we expect the state to provide food/healthcare/education/safety' and .. I'm not sure if you agree with that or not - and how 'general care' comes into play or what general care is, actually. >"But we both know there is no place for us to go "across the border"." While I understand your argument, I do think that you have options here. I'm from Europe and I do consider 'state-hopping' very seriously. I lived abroad for some time and I can imagine doing it again/elsewhere, and certainly for quality of life related reasons. Admittedly I'm already in a ~decent~ position here, and get most of the social benefits that I expect [1]. My point is: While no state is perfect, I seriously do believe that you have a choice and can switch. Especially today, especially if you speak English well/natively, especially if you happen to work in IT. But it's certainly a big leap of faith.. 1: Or .. I expect all these benefits, because I was raised right here?

zo1 11y ago

>"And frankly, I'm so sad that you really think that way. In my world, society is meant to support people in need." And in my world, I have chosen to bear the responsibilities of taking care of the ones I love. Because they are the most important individuals to me, and my morals necessitate that I do not impose my will on others by virtue of the state. >"Here's the thing: You cannot make sure that you can take care of a child's needs. You might be prepared to support a kid and looking forward to a family of three." I get the general point you are making. And I fully agree with you. Unforeseen circumstances happen, and they can be unplanned for. However, in my comment I meant more in terms of general care, which is something that is sorely neglected in today's world where we all expect the state to foot the bill. I.e. Food, basic healthcare, education and safety. I do my best to mitigate all of those. Life insurance, disability insurance, and unusual amounts of saving. >"Actually, that's the only thing a state is good for. If it cannot provide that, why would you associate yourself with it in the first place" Agreed. And yet it does not do that. And doubly-so, we are not calling the state out on it (referendum?). Yet we're perfectly content on espousing it as some sort of "ideal" to bash horrible free-thinking individuals with. As far as I am able to, I don't associate myself with the state. But we both know there is no place for us to go "across the border". It's either another state, a war-torn country (Somalia, etc), or inhospitable water.

dijit 11y ago
We're going a bit personal here, but, circumstances are everchanging.. when my mother decided to keep me, she had both parents, both grandparents and a network of friends. All the family died (except my mothers father who did not wish to help) and her friends no longer associated with her because she wasn't available enough. so, you can be wholly unprepared for raising a child and not even know it.
darklajid 11y ago
First of all: Thanks for the reply. >"However, in my comment I meant more in terms of general care, which is something that is sorely neglected in today's world where we all expect the state to foot the bill. I.e. Food, basic healthcare, education and safety." I'm not sure I follow. Can you elaborate? Not my native language and so far I read this as 'we expect the state to provide food/healthcare/education/safety' and .. I'm not sure if you agree with that or not - and how 'general care' comes into play or what general care is, actually. >"But we both know there is no place for us to go "across the border"." While I understand your argument, I do think that you have options here. I'm from Europe and I do consider 'state-hopping' very seriously. I lived abroad for some time and I can imagine doing it again/elsewhere, and certainly for quality of life related reasons. Admittedly I'm already in a ~decent~ position here, and get most of the social benefits that I expect [1]. My point is: While no state is perfect, I seriously do believe that you have a choice and can switch. Especially today, especially if you speak English well/natively, especially if you happen to work in IT. But it's certainly a big leap of faith.. 1: Or .. I expect all these benefits, because I was raised right here?