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That's great work and I would love to be able to say I helped my company save $24M, but I'm willing to bet he isn't the only engineer in the world capable of do

That's great work and I would love to be able to say I helped my company save $24M, but I'm willing to bet he isn't the only engineer in the world capable of doing that. It really wouldn't make sense to pay him $3M based on his past work when it's possible to hire another engineer and pay him $150k, assuming they can do the same job.

acchow 11y ago
Agreed. People don't seem to understand how a labor market works.
- toomuchtodo 11y ago
  Relationships aren't fungible like skills. Some people find this out the hard way, as non-competes are short or hard to enforce (if enforceable at all).
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  Yet, sales people get commissions. Executives get bonuses when the quarter is good. But Engineers, who actually do the f'ing work, get paid. I understand completely how the labor market works.
  - Nicholas_C 11y ago
    >Yet, sales people get commissions. And they usually have lower salaries because of this. Many "eat what they kill" and if they don't sell they don't make money. > Executives get bonuses when the quarter is good Everyone in the company I work for gets bonuses commensurate with how well the company does, even the engineers. You just listed a very, very small part of every company. Other than sales people and high level execs, no one else has their compensation tied by a significant extent to their productivity. The rest, the accountants, financial analysts, business analysts, strategy analysts, marketers, billing analysts, researchers, designers, managers, etc. all are in the same boats as the engineers. >But Engineers, who actually do the f'ing work Construction workers actually "do the f'ing work" as well and they aren't compensated extremely well because although it is a very hard job there are many people who can do the job. There are also many competent engineers who can probably do your job as well, lowering your salary. I work in finance, and there are even more people who can do my job well than there are engineers who can do your job well, thus I am not paid like an engineer. This is how the labor market works.
JoeAltmaier 11y ago
He had a relationship going back years with each customer, and a deep knowledge of their application requirements. The new guy will have none of that. Its that attitude, that engineers can be bought by the 6-pack for any application, that causes tragedies like this. Any new guy will fail to save contracts at a much higher rate, perhaps not having any benefit at all until a relationship is built up over a period of years (with new customers of course; the old ones will leave).
codeddesign 11y ago
I think that was his entire point - that regardless of the engineer's profit potential to the company, he was being undervalued. If a single doctor brought in $24m worth of patient revenue into a hospital, the doctor would have a huge bargaining chip and would be paid accordingly. The issue between doctors and developers purely based on requirements. A good developers needs just knowledge to perform the task, a doctor needs board certification and years of college to generate PhD credentials. The barrier of entry is much stiffer and therefore has greater weight
- Nicholas_C 11y ago
  The engineer did have a huge bargaining chip, it sounded like the company was willing to play ball but the engineer asked for a ridiculous amount in compensation.

acchow 11y ago

Agreed. People don't seem to understand how a labor market works.

toomuchtodo 11y ago
Relationships aren't fungible like skills. Some people find this out the hard way, as non-competes are short or hard to enforce (if enforceable at all).
JoeAltmaier 11y ago
Yet, sales people get commissions. Executives get bonuses when the quarter is good. But Engineers, who actually do the f'ing work, get paid. I understand completely how the labor market works.
- Nicholas_C 11y ago
  >Yet, sales people get commissions. And they usually have lower salaries because of this. Many "eat what they kill" and if they don't sell they don't make money. > Executives get bonuses when the quarter is good Everyone in the company I work for gets bonuses commensurate with how well the company does, even the engineers. You just listed a very, very small part of every company. Other than sales people and high level execs, no one else has their compensation tied by a significant extent to their productivity. The rest, the accountants, financial analysts, business analysts, strategy analysts, marketers, billing analysts, researchers, designers, managers, etc. all are in the same boats as the engineers. >But Engineers, who actually do the f'ing work Construction workers actually "do the f'ing work" as well and they aren't compensated extremely well because although it is a very hard job there are many people who can do the job. There are also many competent engineers who can probably do your job as well, lowering your salary. I work in finance, and there are even more people who can do my job well than there are engineers who can do your job well, thus I am not paid like an engineer. This is how the labor market works.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago

He had a relationship going back years with each customer, and a deep knowledge of their application requirements. The new guy will have none of that. Its that attitude, that engineers can be bought by the 6-pack for any application, that causes tragedies like this. Any new guy will fail to save contracts at a much higher rate, perhaps not having any benefit at all until a relationship is built up over a period of years (with new customers of course; the old ones will leave).

codeddesign 11y ago

I think that was his entire point - that regardless of the engineer's profit potential to the company, he was being undervalued. If a single doctor brought in $24m worth of patient revenue into a hospital, the doctor would have a huge bargaining chip and would be paid accordingly. The issue between doctors and developers purely based on requirements. A good developers needs just knowledge to perform the task, a doctor needs board certification and years of college to generate PhD credentials. The barrier of entry is much stiffer and therefore has greater weight

Nicholas_C 11y ago
The engineer did have a huge bargaining chip, it sounded like the company was willing to play ball but the engineer asked for a ridiculous amount in compensation.