5 ms·

yeah I find interesting that many legend and myths all have the sea rise event in common.

by LoSboccacc 11y ago

qnaal 11y ago
and nothing about lowering, 'cept for like moses or that five chinese brother
- niklasni1 11y ago
  Is lowering ever as dramatic as flooding?
  - buffoon 11y ago
    Yes. It allows people to migrate easily which inevitably leads to conflicts.
    - henriquemaia 11y ago
      Since we are land animals, a lowering of the sea would provide more grounds to be covered by humans; more space means less interaction and less conflict. Maybe the sense of wonderment in finding new grounds is not enough to be folk-told throughout generations. As in the news, we tend to stick to the bad news rather than the good ones.
  - Intermernet 11y ago
    Aboriginal people wouldn't be in Australia at all if it weren't for sea level lowering, so you could say it's actually more dramatic than flooding. "There is considerable discussion among archeologists as to the route taken by the first migrants to Australia, widely taken to be ancestors of the modern Aborigines. Migration took place during the closing stages of the Pleistocene, when sea levels were much lower than they are today."[1] "It is generally believed that Aboriginal people are the descendants of a single migration into the continent, a people that split from the first modern human populations to leave Africa 64,000 to 75,000 years ago, although a minority propose that there were three waves of migration, most likely island hopping by boat during periods of low sea levels"[2] [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_Australia#Arrival https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_Australia#Arriva... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians#Arrival_and_occupation_of_Australia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians#Arrival...
- Rooki 11y ago
  If I'm reading Wikipedias article on glacial periods correctly it indicates that the last time sea levels lowered significantly would have been between 71k and 115k years ago. I wonder if language complex enough to have an oral tradition existed that far back.
  - dalke 11y ago
    Very likely. You may be interested in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_language ("The results suggest that language first evolved around 350,000-150,000 years ago, which is around the time when modern Homo sapiens evolved") an https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_modernity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_modernity ("Howiesons Poort, Blombos, and other South African archaeological sites, for example, show evidence of marine resource acquisition, trade, and abstract ornamentation at least by 80,000 years ago.")
  - arethuza 11y ago
    Relative sea levels can change because the land is rising as well as sea levels dropping - post glacial rebound means that areas that were heavily glaciated can actually be lifting at quite a rate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound e.g. Here in Scotland you just have to look at a shoreline to see that relative sea levels have dropped quite a bit even though sea levels have risen. When I was a kid I can remember my father talking about legends of Vikings sailing round Roseisle in Moray - which is quite high and dry now.
  - themgt 11y ago
    Nope, more like 12-8k years ago. Check out the Holocene sea level rise [1]. Jeffrey Rose's Persian Gulf Oasis / Out of Arabia theory is especially intriguing. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_glacial_retreat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_glacial_retreat
    - Rooki 11y ago
      The parent was talking about sea levels lowering.
simonh 11y ago
It's worth bearing in mind that not all flood myths are necessarily about rises in sea level. Extreme seasonal flooding is another possibility, especially for a population relatively new to an area occasionally prone to it, as is new lake formation or existing lakes bursting through a natural dam.
- nikbackm 11y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_hypothesis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_hypothesis
fit2rule 11y ago
I'm personally a huge fan of Szukalski and his crackpot art-theories about how, in all ancient art, there is a hidden proto-language which is being used to give us all a dire warning that in fact, every 60,000 years or so, a major deluge occurs, the planet is covered in water, which eventually recedes, but land-lubbers need to reset .. its a total crackpot theory, but if you're interested in great artwork and a wicked read through a highly profound mind, check out the book "BEYHOLD!! THE PROTONG!", Szukalski. http://www.amazon.com/Behold-Protong-Robert-Williams/dp/0867195193 http://www.amazon.com/Behold-Protong-Robert-Williams/dp/0867... Totally great stuff, had me looking at ancient art again, and I thoroughly enjoy finding Protong absolutely everywhere these days, its madness .. in a good way. (Not so keen on Zermatism, however, also mind-bending..)
- charonn0 11y ago
  This reminds me of an Isaac Asimov short story named Nightfall[1] where (spoilers!) a species living in a trinary star system only sees the stars every few thousand years. The stars (indeed the very concept of "night" itself) are considered mythical/religious stories, and when night does come it drives the entire population violently insane, destroying the civilization and becoming the earliest myth of the civilization that rises from the ashes. [1]: http://www.astro.sunysb.edu/fwalter/AST389/TEXTS/Nightfall.htm http://www.astro.sunysb.edu/fwalter/AST389/TEXTS/Nightfall.h...
  - fit2rule 11y ago
    Cool, thanks for the recommendation .. I might've read that in my far, far distant youth, but I'll be picking it up again for sure now its on my to-read list.

yeah I find interesting that many legend and myths all have the sea rise event in common.

qnaal 11y ago

and nothing about lowering, 'cept for like moses or that five chinese brother

niklasni1 11y ago
Is lowering ever as dramatic as flooding?
- buffoon 11y ago
  Yes. It allows people to migrate easily which inevitably leads to conflicts.
  - henriquemaia 11y ago
    Since we are land animals, a lowering of the sea would provide more grounds to be covered by humans; more space means less interaction and less conflict. Maybe the sense of wonderment in finding new grounds is not enough to be folk-told throughout generations. As in the news, we tend to stick to the bad news rather than the good ones.
- Intermernet 11y ago
  Aboriginal people wouldn't be in Australia at all if it weren't for sea level lowering, so you could say it's actually more dramatic than flooding. "There is considerable discussion among archeologists as to the route taken by the first migrants to Australia, widely taken to be ancestors of the modern Aborigines. Migration took place during the closing stages of the Pleistocene, when sea levels were much lower than they are today."[1] "It is generally believed that Aboriginal people are the descendants of a single migration into the continent, a people that split from the first modern human populations to leave Africa 64,000 to 75,000 years ago, although a minority propose that there were three waves of migration, most likely island hopping by boat during periods of low sea levels"[2] [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_Australia#Arrival https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_Australia#Arriva... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians#Arrival_and_occupation_of_Australia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australians#Arrival...
Rooki 11y ago
If I'm reading Wikipedias article on glacial periods correctly it indicates that the last time sea levels lowered significantly would have been between 71k and 115k years ago. I wonder if language complex enough to have an oral tradition existed that far back.
- dalke 11y ago
  Very likely. You may be interested in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_language ("The results suggest that language first evolved around 350,000-150,000 years ago, which is around the time when modern Homo sapiens evolved") an https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_modernity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_modernity ("Howiesons Poort, Blombos, and other South African archaeological sites, for example, show evidence of marine resource acquisition, trade, and abstract ornamentation at least by 80,000 years ago.")
- arethuza 11y ago
  Relative sea levels can change because the land is rising as well as sea levels dropping - post glacial rebound means that areas that were heavily glaciated can actually be lifting at quite a rate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound e.g. Here in Scotland you just have to look at a shoreline to see that relative sea levels have dropped quite a bit even though sea levels have risen. When I was a kid I can remember my father talking about legends of Vikings sailing round Roseisle in Moray - which is quite high and dry now.
- themgt 11y ago
  Nope, more like 12-8k years ago. Check out the Holocene sea level rise [1]. Jeffrey Rose's Persian Gulf Oasis / Out of Arabia theory is especially intriguing. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_glacial_retreat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_glacial_retreat
  - Rooki 11y ago
    The parent was talking about sea levels lowering.

simonh 11y ago

It's worth bearing in mind that not all flood myths are necessarily about rises in sea level. Extreme seasonal flooding is another possibility, especially for a population relatively new to an area occasionally prone to it, as is new lake formation or existing lakes bursting through a natural dam.

nikbackm 11y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_hypothesis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_hypothesis

fit2rule 11y ago

I'm personally a huge fan of Szukalski and his crackpot art-theories about how, in all ancient art, there is a hidden proto-language which is being used to give us all a dire warning that in fact, every 60,000 years or so, a major deluge occurs, the planet is covered in water, which eventually recedes, but land-lubbers need to reset .. its a total crackpot theory, but if you're interested in great artwork and a wicked read through a highly profound mind, check out the book "BEYHOLD!! THE PROTONG!", Szukalski. http://www.amazon.com/Behold-Protong-Robert-Williams/dp/0867195193 http://www.amazon.com/Behold-Protong-Robert-Williams/dp/0867... Totally great stuff, had me looking at ancient art again, and I thoroughly enjoy finding Protong absolutely everywhere these days, its madness .. in a good way. (Not so keen on Zermatism, however, also mind-bending..)

charonn0 11y ago
This reminds me of an Isaac Asimov short story named Nightfall[1] where (spoilers!) a species living in a trinary star system only sees the stars every few thousand years. The stars (indeed the very concept of "night" itself) are considered mythical/religious stories, and when night does come it drives the entire population violently insane, destroying the civilization and becoming the earliest myth of the civilization that rises from the ashes. [1]: http://www.astro.sunysb.edu/fwalter/AST389/TEXTS/Nightfall.htm http://www.astro.sunysb.edu/fwalter/AST389/TEXTS/Nightfall.h...
- fit2rule 11y ago
  Cool, thanks for the recommendation .. I might've read that in my far, far distant youth, but I'll be picking it up again for sure now its on my to-read list.