5 ms·

I wonder if flat buttons are a good idea. On top of a vibrating rocket I'd prefer buttons where I can feel their outline with my finger tips. The labels seem li

by frede 11y ago

I wonder if flat buttons are a good idea. On top of a vibrating rocket I'd prefer buttons where I can feel their outline with my finger tips. The labels seem light gray, a less elegant but better visible writing might be better suited here, too.

coldpie 11y ago
I saw those and my blood boiled. I find these stupid fucking non-buttons impossible to use in my living room. I can't imagine how frustrating it would be to have zero tactile feedback on a rocket ship. "Oops, I brushed my finger lightly against the ROCKET SHIP IS ON FIRE button and filled the ship with foam, sorry mission control." Obviously they're smarter than that, but damn do I hate those "buttons".
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
ceejayoz 11y ago
> On top of a vibrating rocket I'd prefer buttons where I can feel their outline with my finger tips. Dragon is entirely computer controlled during the times the rocket'd be vibrating. Other than a "oh shit, fire the crew escape rocket" button you're not going to be pressing anything during ascent or landing.
- protomyth 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure NASA told Neil Armstrong the same thing. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11
  - ceejayoz 11y ago
    Computer control and spacecraft have both come a long way (in both complexity and reliability) since the 1960s. Modern cars and aircraft can't even move without their critical computers functioning these days.
    - pluma 11y ago
      If that's meant to be reassuring I'm not sure it has worked.
      - ceejayoz 11y ago
        http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff > But how much work the software does is not what makes it remarkable. What makes it remarkable is how well the software works. This software never crashes. It never needs to be re-booted. This software is bug-free. It is perfect, as perfect as human beings have achieved. Consider these stats : the last three versions of the program — each 420,000 lines long-had just one error each. The last 11 versions of this software had a total of 17 errors. Commercial programs of equivalent complexity would have 5,000 errors.
        protomyth 11y ago
        Software correctness is only part of the problem. Mechanical failure and the need to compensate from it is often beyond the programming. Sending someone into space without a manual override seems unwise. We've seen it used in space already, assuming it won't be needed again is an incorrect assumption.
cfontes 11y ago
They have what they call "the important ones" as real buttons, you can see it in the video
- terryf 11y ago
  The last image shows flat buttons and one of them says "DEORBIT NOW" I am not an astronaut, but it sounds kind of important to me.
  - steckerbrett 11y ago
    I think the most important button ever created is the SCRAM (emergency shutdown) button on a nuclear reactor, they don't fuck around making it look pretty. You know where the button is and you never ever want a seconds hesitation in getting it pushed. https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7244/7300035260_8e872e201c_b.jpg https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7244/7300035260_8e872e201c_b.j... Probably somewhere close on the list is the MAGNET STOP button on a MRI machine, it destroys the superconducting magnet and vents the incredibly expensive helium into the atmosphere. http://a406.idata.over-blog.com/0/01/25/36/magnetic-field-stop-button-mri.jpg http://a406.idata.over-blog.com/0/01/25/36/magnetic-field-st... No cover, no toggle, no delay, you want them big and red and able to be pressed by someone with two broken wrists.
    - fabian2k 11y ago
      Quenching the magnet has a chance to cause damage, but it doesn't necessarily destroy the magnet. And while liquid helium isn't cheap, filling the dewar once isn't that expensive compared to the MRI itself. You have to contiuously refill liquid helium, which is a significant running cost.
      - steckerbrett 11y ago
        I meant it destroys the superconducting-ness rather than the whole magnet. The costs of not having a MRI machine are probably even higher than operating one, though I'm not sure how you'd go about quantifying that.
tkahnoski 11y ago
Something else to consider is the amount of force required to press the buttons while in zero-g. Astronauts currently have to anchor themselves so a button press doesnt launch you in the opposite direction. Now I'm wondering how well typing on a keyboard works in space...
jonnycowboy 11y ago
I work in commercial aerospace (OEM) - flat buttons and touchscreen displays are not permitted, physical switches are required for exactly the reasons you described, in addition to smoke procedures which must be done "blind".

by frede 11y ago

coldpie 11y ago

I saw those and my blood boiled. I find these stupid fucking non-buttons impossible to use in my living room. I can't imagine how frustrating it would be to have zero tactile feedback on a rocket ship. "Oops, I brushed my finger lightly against the ROCKET SHIP IS ON FIRE button and filled the ship with foam, sorry mission control." Obviously they're smarter than that, but damn do I hate those "buttons".

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

ceejayoz 11y ago

> On top of a vibrating rocket I'd prefer buttons where I can feel their outline with my finger tips. Dragon is entirely computer controlled during the times the rocket'd be vibrating. Other than a "oh shit, fire the crew escape rocket" button you're not going to be pressing anything during ascent or landing.

protomyth 11y ago
I'm pretty sure NASA told Neil Armstrong the same thing. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  Computer control and spacecraft have both come a long way (in both complexity and reliability) since the 1960s. Modern cars and aircraft can't even move without their critical computers functioning these days.
  - pluma 11y ago
    If that's meant to be reassuring I'm not sure it has worked.
    - ceejayoz 11y ago
      http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff > But how much work the software does is not what makes it remarkable. What makes it remarkable is how well the software works. This software never crashes. It never needs to be re-booted. This software is bug-free. It is perfect, as perfect as human beings have achieved. Consider these stats : the last three versions of the program — each 420,000 lines long-had just one error each. The last 11 versions of this software had a total of 17 errors. Commercial programs of equivalent complexity would have 5,000 errors.
      - protomyth 11y ago
        Software correctness is only part of the problem. Mechanical failure and the need to compensate from it is often beyond the programming. Sending someone into space without a manual override seems unwise. We've seen it used in space already, assuming it won't be needed again is an incorrect assumption.

cfontes 11y ago

They have what they call "the important ones" as real buttons, you can see it in the video

terryf 11y ago
The last image shows flat buttons and one of them says "DEORBIT NOW" I am not an astronaut, but it sounds kind of important to me.
- steckerbrett 11y ago
  I think the most important button ever created is the SCRAM (emergency shutdown) button on a nuclear reactor, they don't fuck around making it look pretty. You know where the button is and you never ever want a seconds hesitation in getting it pushed. https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7244/7300035260_8e872e201c_b.jpg https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7244/7300035260_8e872e201c_b.j... Probably somewhere close on the list is the MAGNET STOP button on a MRI machine, it destroys the superconducting magnet and vents the incredibly expensive helium into the atmosphere. http://a406.idata.over-blog.com/0/01/25/36/magnetic-field-stop-button-mri.jpg http://a406.idata.over-blog.com/0/01/25/36/magnetic-field-st... No cover, no toggle, no delay, you want them big and red and able to be pressed by someone with two broken wrists.
  - fabian2k 11y ago
    Quenching the magnet has a chance to cause damage, but it doesn't necessarily destroy the magnet. And while liquid helium isn't cheap, filling the dewar once isn't that expensive compared to the MRI itself. You have to contiuously refill liquid helium, which is a significant running cost.
    - steckerbrett 11y ago
      I meant it destroys the superconducting-ness rather than the whole magnet. The costs of not having a MRI machine are probably even higher than operating one, though I'm not sure how you'd go about quantifying that.

tkahnoski 11y ago

Something else to consider is the amount of force required to press the buttons while in zero-g. Astronauts currently have to anchor themselves so a button press doesnt launch you in the opposite direction. Now I'm wondering how well typing on a keyboard works in space...

jonnycowboy 11y ago

I work in commercial aerospace (OEM) - flat buttons and touchscreen displays are not permitted, physical switches are required for exactly the reasons you described, in addition to smoke procedures which must be done "blind".