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He blackmailed his boss, used f* f* f* in a conversation with him and you think "hink he's shown himself to have good character here."? Holy Batman.
by Bonogongo 11y ago
He blackmailed his boss, used f* f* f* in a conversation with him and you think "hink he's shown himself to have good character here."? Holy Batman.
- nilkn 11y agoWhere is the part where he blackmailed anyone?
- Bonogongo 11y ago@nilkin "You give me more money or I leave." vs. Just walking away from the negotiation. From my experience if you give in to "You give me more money or I leave" 6 months down the road it will be another "You give me more money or I leave" and then another. Wikipedia: "Blackmail is an act [..] involving unjustified threats to make [..] cause loss to another unless a demand is met."
- gayprogrammer 11y agoPaying an employee for work and services is not "a loss". It's an exchange.
- lagadu 11y agoI'll go further and say it's an investment.
- nilkn 11y agoIt sounds like you've had a bad experience with a former employee, but this is not blackmail. That's just standing up for himself. The OP was working there contingent on his boss's promise of a raise, and both parties knew this, including the boss. In fact, the OP was remarkably generous towards his boss by doing something very foolish: knowingly taking an unlivable wage out of trust that the boss would live up to his word. Regarding your Wikipedia quote, leaving a job in which you are abused and underpaid is not at all unjustified.
- Bonogongo 11y agoIt sounds like you have done this in the past, and it is blackmail. And I understand that you don't want to see yourself as a blackmailer. "I'm more worth than that" and leaving is standing up. "Give me more money or I leave" is blackmail. "Regarding your Wikipedia quote, leaving a job in which you are abused and underpaid is not at all unjustified." Leaving is not the blackmail part, threatening to leave is the blackmail part.
- icebraining 11y agoFirst, blackmail is about information, so if anything it would be extortion. And it's not extortion because the "threat" was not wrongful; the boss is not his owner nor is he entitled to his work. The word you're looking for is haggling, and it's a common part of negotiations.
- DanBC 11y agoBut "give me more money or I'll leave" is a bad way to go about haggling, and is likely to lead to the employee leaving. "I'm worth more than you're paying" is better, even though the employer and employee both know that "and if yu don't pay me more I'll leave" is an unspoken part of that sentence. HN regularly mentions the book "how to win friends and influence people" or talks about hacking various interpersonal processes. This is just an interpersonal hack. Saying "give me more money or I'll leave" causes many - but admittedly not all - managers to respond with "go ahead and leave then", even when the manager knows that replacing the leavig employee will require a higher wage than the employee is currently getting and some expenditure on the recruitment process. People are not rational and they do mot make rational decisions. We know that management, and recruitment, is very broken.
- icebraining 11y agoOh, for sure, it's not a good negotiation tactic, no argument there.
- gliese1337 11y ago
- argc 11y agoIf I was offered that much I would say the same thing. Although, I might try to have something else lined up first.
- glyxbaer 11y agoHow is that blackmailing? It's negotiating salary. If you can't pay me a livable wage- or a wage that I am worth- I'll look for a job somewhere else.
- chrisbennet 11y agoAfter being strung along (he was lied to) for months he made a totally justified ultimatum to be paid what he's worth or he'd go somewhere that would. A manager who knows someone is worth it but would still rather let me go than pay market price for their labor (because he doesn't like negotiating when he's not in a position of absolute power) is probably doing so because he can't man up and negotiate with someone his own size figuratively speaking. The stereotypical "I'm not letting a woman tell me what to do." sort of insecurity/attitude. Employees have been "on the bottom" in the traditional work relationship for so long, it can seem "unfair" to employers to have to deal with employees on a more level playing field.
- MisterBastahrd 11y agoUm... that's exactly how salary negotiations work. If I don't do a good enough job, you demote or fire me. If I do a good enough job AND the market says I should make X, then X - Y isn't fucking good enough, and you should be warned that I'm happy to find an employer that WILL pay me what I ask for.
- everyone 11y agoI shall never utter the dreaded F word to my boss. I will to my boss be true and faithful and love all which he loves and shun all which he shuns. Also please explain where he 'blackmailed' his boss?
- Bonogongo 11y agoYou can do what you like, but if you swear at me and call me f* I'll not hire you.
- louhike 11y agoHe used the f* word in a specific context. And can you answer when did he blackmail his boss?
- etchalon 11y agoThat's ridiculous. Good managers let their employees vent, when necessary, and don't take it personally. Insecure ones get all uppity about things like that.
- DanBC 11y agoSince the world is full of pretty poor managers "don't swear at your boss" is pragmatic advice. It'd be nice if all managers had the skill to recognise that a bit of venting is probably healthy.
- 11y ago