6 ms·

I can't even imagine having a 40+K$ salary in my country (Turkey) that's like 3x what I make.

by nurettin 11y ago

Jake232 11y ago
Your monthly expenses are likely 3x lower than the location he lives in though.
- gorkemyurt 11y ago
  Not if he is not living in New York, LA, SF or maybe couple other cities.. Rest of america has really cheap housing and pretty good social services
dkarapetyan 11y ago
SF devs make 150k+. It doesn't mean anything because at the end of the day after taxes and rent they probably take home less than you.
- selestify 11y ago
  Come on now, it's not that ridiculous to save $40k+ a year on a $150k salary, even in the Bay Area. That's saving more than the other poster makes in his entire pretax salary.
  - dkarapetyan 11y ago
    My point is that absolute numbers don't really mean anything. I'm not saying SF devs are poor or struggling but if you factor in taxes and living costs then the absolute numbers no longer look so impressive.
- onedev 11y ago
  but they get to live in a better city than you.
- vacri 11y ago
  What a ridiculous statement. Taxes are what, a third of that? Leaves 100k. This means that rent would have to be $5k/mo before you get to the same starting point of $40k. And now you have $40k of money post-tax and post-rent; nurettin is talking about $40k before tax and accommodation. US$40k in Turkish lira loses a third to income tax as well, and I have no idea what accommodation is like there. $5k/mo rent exists in SV, but if you're paying that much, it's because you choose to, not because you have to. I love this industry, but it sickens me when people on six figures moan about how they're 'so poor' or 'hardly make anything' and try to distort the numbers to make it sound bad.
  - dkarapetyan 11y ago
    No one is moaning. I'm pointing out that envying someone making more than you is a pointless exercise.
    - vacri 11y ago
      You were making a nonsense value judgement that a 150k+ engineer would take home less than a 40k engineer in a different place. Both places take a third in income tax at those levels. I don't know how much rent is in Turkey, 40k is 27k after a third is taken for tax - if you wanted to match even this number, that means you would have to be paying $73k in rent in SV, even higher than I was suggesting. So yes, "probably take home less than you" is definitely moaning and has no substance. It's playing to the "omg, I'm so poor" crap that's prevalent in some parts of our industry. Living expenses are higher in first-world countries and that does need to be taken into account, but claiming to have less money than someone on a quarter of your wage "because tax and rent" is nonsensical self-pity.
      - dkarapetyan 11y ago
        You should relax and tone it back a little bit. I already said several times you are taking things a little too literally so by all means move to SF and make as much as all those rich developers if you want.
throwgoaway 11y ago
Made a throwaway account just to post this. I'm a well-respected professional (in a different, though connected field) with many years of experience and I earn a hair over what the blog poster earns. I just can't be sympathetic with the desperate tone -- yes, I get it, other devs earn more money, and a Ruby pro can probably get upwards of 70 or 80k. But making it sound like you're on the brink of poverty with 40k? You're spending too much. The laptop cost keeps getting mentioned as a huge factor, but a MacBook is $2000 at most, and it can be had for a lot less, especially if you buy second hand. Don't get me wrong, his treatment at that company was far from fair. And he could and probably should get a job elsewhere. But the drama is non-existent here.
- vellum 11y ago
  >But making it sound like you're on the brink of poverty with 40k? He's living in a trailer with a wife and 4 kids, one of whom's severely autistic. At $44,600, his family is at 137% of the federal poverty level.
  - trumpete 11y ago
    Why the hell did he make four kids though? It's not necessarily a well thought-out action is it? He should have not had any kids until he was stable enough, let alone four. With his previous job at a factory too? Not. Smart.
    - normloman 11y ago
      I'm sick of everyone shaming the guy for having 4 kids. It's not like he can reverse time and stop them from being born. So saying he can't afford kids only serves the purpose of making the guy feel bad. Besides, you don't know enough about his situation to criticize his decision to have children.

I can't even imagine having a 40+K$ salary in my country (Turkey) that's like 3x what I make.

Jake232 11y ago

Your monthly expenses are likely 3x lower than the location he lives in though.

gorkemyurt 11y ago
Not if he is not living in New York, LA, SF or maybe couple other cities.. Rest of america has really cheap housing and pretty good social services

dkarapetyan 11y ago

SF devs make 150k+. It doesn't mean anything because at the end of the day after taxes and rent they probably take home less than you.

selestify 11y ago
Come on now, it's not that ridiculous to save $40k+ a year on a $150k salary, even in the Bay Area. That's saving more than the other poster makes in his entire pretax salary.
- dkarapetyan 11y ago
  My point is that absolute numbers don't really mean anything. I'm not saying SF devs are poor or struggling but if you factor in taxes and living costs then the absolute numbers no longer look so impressive.
onedev 11y ago
but they get to live in a better city than you.
vacri 11y ago
What a ridiculous statement. Taxes are what, a third of that? Leaves 100k. This means that rent would have to be $5k/mo before you get to the same starting point of $40k. And now you have $40k of money post-tax and post-rent; nurettin is talking about $40k before tax and accommodation. US$40k in Turkish lira loses a third to income tax as well, and I have no idea what accommodation is like there. $5k/mo rent exists in SV, but if you're paying that much, it's because you choose to, not because you have to. I love this industry, but it sickens me when people on six figures moan about how they're 'so poor' or 'hardly make anything' and try to distort the numbers to make it sound bad.
- dkarapetyan 11y ago
  No one is moaning. I'm pointing out that envying someone making more than you is a pointless exercise.
  - vacri 11y ago
    You were making a nonsense value judgement that a 150k+ engineer would take home less than a 40k engineer in a different place. Both places take a third in income tax at those levels. I don't know how much rent is in Turkey, 40k is 27k after a third is taken for tax - if you wanted to match even this number, that means you would have to be paying $73k in rent in SV, even higher than I was suggesting. So yes, "probably take home less than you" is definitely moaning and has no substance. It's playing to the "omg, I'm so poor" crap that's prevalent in some parts of our industry. Living expenses are higher in first-world countries and that does need to be taken into account, but claiming to have less money than someone on a quarter of your wage "because tax and rent" is nonsensical self-pity.
    - dkarapetyan 11y ago
      You should relax and tone it back a little bit. I already said several times you are taking things a little too literally so by all means move to SF and make as much as all those rich developers if you want.

throwgoaway 11y ago

Made a throwaway account just to post this. I'm a well-respected professional (in a different, though connected field) with many years of experience and I earn a hair over what the blog poster earns. I just can't be sympathetic with the desperate tone -- yes, I get it, other devs earn more money, and a Ruby pro can probably get upwards of 70 or 80k. But making it sound like you're on the brink of poverty with 40k? You're spending too much. The laptop cost keeps getting mentioned as a huge factor, but a MacBook is $2000 at most, and it can be had for a lot less, especially if you buy second hand. Don't get me wrong, his treatment at that company was far from fair. And he could and probably should get a job elsewhere. But the drama is non-existent here.

vellum 11y ago
>But making it sound like you're on the brink of poverty with 40k? He's living in a trailer with a wife and 4 kids, one of whom's severely autistic. At $44,600, his family is at 137% of the federal poverty level.
- trumpete 11y ago
  Why the hell did he make four kids though? It's not necessarily a well thought-out action is it? He should have not had any kids until he was stable enough, let alone four. With his previous job at a factory too? Not. Smart.
  - normloman 11y ago
    I'm sick of everyone shaming the guy for having 4 kids. It's not like he can reverse time and stop them from being born. So saying he can't afford kids only serves the purpose of making the guy feel bad. Besides, you don't know enough about his situation to criticize his decision to have children.