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I'm definitely not a fan of DRM, but mentioned it since some people are concerned about it. I think, from the little I have read about this (with regard to the

I'm definitely not a fan of DRM, but mentioned it since some people are concerned about it. I think, from the little I have read about this (with regard to the issues we've discussed here), academics in general is kind of screwed up given the power structures in place. This might sound like a broad generalization, and perhaps counter-intuitive, but I think for academic institutions to optimize themselves, they need to be thinking about how to re-arrange the incentive structure to align with incentives that drive a professor to write books and not with incentive structure of the markets. For example I think within the realm of academics it makes total sense to move toward a "pay for the person, not the product" model. With electronic distribution of the media, you get almost zero-cost of production and distribution (except of course for the time the author spends writing the book). This theoretically allows the industry to figure out how to cut the middle men and move those savings to the "talent" instead of finding more ways to bureaucratize the system further, eating away at the salaries of those who are producing the material in the first place. However, given the power structure my hunch is without an "(r)evolution" within those industries professors will continue to get a fraction of what they deserve.

dalke 11y ago
As I am not an academic but rather an independent researcher working in industry, I have little useful to say about the academic power structure or its future. To get back to why I joined this thread, do you accept that your scenario of having to visit a state university library in person to read someone's "magnum opus" in book form is unlikely enough that it is more fanciful than meaningful? As you are also not an academic, I instead offer a better scenario. Many Masters and PhD dissertations are deposited in the univeristy library but otherwise unpublished, and even un-indexed. For some of those you may have to visit the library in person to see a copy or even learn that it exists.
- datashovel 11y ago
  It sounds like you are more of an expert on Inter-Library Loans than I am. If, as it sounds like you are saying, I have access to all publications from all public and private (or maybe not private) libraries in all 49 countries that offer ILL. I'm assuming, for the purposes of this discussion, that all public and private? libraries in those 49 countries participate in this ILL program. As long as I have a library card to one of said libraries, then I think it's safe to say that a publisher who publishes a fixed number of books and sells them exclusively to libraries (public or private?) which may or may not be far away from where I live, is not as big of a problem as I originally thought. Technically one could argue that I have "access" to those books.
  - dalke 11y ago
    I was necessarily incomplete in describing what ILL does since I figured that information was easily available at places like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlibrary_loan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlibrary_loan and http://www.oclc.org/services/resource-sharing.en.html http://www.oclc.org/services/resource-sharing.en.html . No, you absolutely do not have access to "all publications" - for example, you cannot ask the Library of Congress to send you their copy of the Magna Carta. Some things are too bulky, expensive, or fragile to ship. Remember though that you asked about some academic's "magnum opus", which is unlikely to be restricted that way. No, not all public and private libraries are members of the OCLC. A search of http://www.oclc.org/contacts/libraries.en.html http://www.oclc.org/contacts/libraries.en.html gives 15K OCLC members and 63K participating libraries around the world. The library at the National Museum of Mysteries (see http://web.randi.org/swift/paranormal-themed-festivals-bring-tourists-to-town http://web.randi.org/swift/paranormal-themed-festivals-bring... ) is not listed as one of them. Remember though that your scenario concerned a state university, and those definitely are members of ILL. "Technically one could argue that I have "access" to those books." Yes. Though 'technically' you have access even if you have to fly to the Vatican library to see something in person. I would add the qualifier "relatively low-cost". It's costs me about $12 to get a copy of a journal article though ILL when it costs me about $35 to get it directly from the publisher. The main difference is that I need to wait a week or two. Books, oddly enough, are free.
    - datashovel 11y ago
      I concur. Thanks for the conversation.

dalke 11y ago

As I am not an academic but rather an independent researcher working in industry, I have little useful to say about the academic power structure or its future. To get back to why I joined this thread, do you accept that your scenario of having to visit a state university library in person to read someone's "magnum opus" in book form is unlikely enough that it is more fanciful than meaningful? As you are also not an academic, I instead offer a better scenario. Many Masters and PhD dissertations are deposited in the univeristy library but otherwise unpublished, and even un-indexed. For some of those you may have to visit the library in person to see a copy or even learn that it exists.

datashovel 11y ago
It sounds like you are more of an expert on Inter-Library Loans than I am. If, as it sounds like you are saying, I have access to all publications from all public and private (or maybe not private) libraries in all 49 countries that offer ILL. I'm assuming, for the purposes of this discussion, that all public and private? libraries in those 49 countries participate in this ILL program. As long as I have a library card to one of said libraries, then I think it's safe to say that a publisher who publishes a fixed number of books and sells them exclusively to libraries (public or private?) which may or may not be far away from where I live, is not as big of a problem as I originally thought. Technically one could argue that I have "access" to those books.
- dalke 11y ago
  I was necessarily incomplete in describing what ILL does since I figured that information was easily available at places like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlibrary_loan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlibrary_loan and http://www.oclc.org/services/resource-sharing.en.html http://www.oclc.org/services/resource-sharing.en.html . No, you absolutely do not have access to "all publications" - for example, you cannot ask the Library of Congress to send you their copy of the Magna Carta. Some things are too bulky, expensive, or fragile to ship. Remember though that you asked about some academic's "magnum opus", which is unlikely to be restricted that way. No, not all public and private libraries are members of the OCLC. A search of http://www.oclc.org/contacts/libraries.en.html http://www.oclc.org/contacts/libraries.en.html gives 15K OCLC members and 63K participating libraries around the world. The library at the National Museum of Mysteries (see http://web.randi.org/swift/paranormal-themed-festivals-bring-tourists-to-town http://web.randi.org/swift/paranormal-themed-festivals-bring... ) is not listed as one of them. Remember though that your scenario concerned a state university, and those definitely are members of ILL. "Technically one could argue that I have "access" to those books." Yes. Though 'technically' you have access even if you have to fly to the Vatican library to see something in person. I would add the qualifier "relatively low-cost". It's costs me about $12 to get a copy of a journal article though ILL when it costs me about $35 to get it directly from the publisher. The main difference is that I need to wait a week or two. Books, oddly enough, are free.
  - datashovel 11y ago
    I concur. Thanks for the conversation.