4 ms·

There is a coordinated media attempt across the EU to spin positive 'messaging' onto the refugee crisis. But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the re

There is a coordinated media attempt across the EU to spin positive 'messaging' onto the refugee crisis. But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. The EU has been exposed once again as an incompetent overreaching poorly though dangerously romantic mistake. Continuous failures of ECB policy, the collapse of Greece under the EURO, the PIGS in serious trouble, add a totally uncontrolled mass refugee crisis, the entire EU project looks like an incompetent bureaucratic mess. The damage is so great that Even China and Russia have managed to claim the moral high ground and quit rightly blame the crisis on the EU itself and NATO adventurism in Syria. I do not think rehashing WW2 German collective guilt as a media spectacle is going to change the perceptions of anyone paying attention to this horrible situation.

mahouse 11y ago
What I don't understand is why us Europeans have to pay for the adventurism of the NATO; I wish all the refugees moved to Israel and the US, to be honest. Once again Putin is right, and this uncovers how a permanent conflict at the arab world is in the interest of the NATO and the US/Israel-aligned world overall.
- mineshaftgap 11y ago
  You do realize that Europe is part of the US aligned world and the only thing preventing Europe from becoming Putin's playground is NATO?
  - mahouse 11y ago
    I would rather allow Europe to become Putin's playground than to allow the current situation to continue.
    - mineshaftgap 11y ago
      I hope you get your wish.
  - joeyspn 11y ago
    Aligned? That's why they won't allow us Europeans to vote NO to TTIP and they have to discuss and approve it in secrecy. The citizens of Europe are not aligned with anyone. We've had enough with two WW.
    - mineshaftgap 11y ago
      Holy fuck people get confused. Exactly how are Americans stopping you from voting? You don't think Europe and the US are aligned? Hate can be blinding. Has a there ever been even a single EU candidate that ran on an anti-US platform? If not why not?
      - mahouse 11y ago
        Because you can't win an election without the blessing of the media, and guess who controls it.
      - joeyspn 11y ago
        > Exactly how are Americans stopping you from voting? Who said “Americans”? I’m just saying “they”, and “they” are the bribed politicians [0] (both in the US and Europe). “They” don’t want us to vote [1] because they know We (the citizens) are not aligned with everything that USA or ANYONE says and does. > Hate can be blinding. Has a there ever been even a single EU candidate that ran on an anti-US platform? LOL, who is telling you that being neutral is being anti-american? chillax dude. I’m just anti-war and anti-media-bullshit, like any libertarian able to read between the lines (even american ones [2]). Get your facts straight. [0] http://venturebeat.com/2015/09/04/creative-commons-founder-larry-lessig-is-running-for-president-the-system-is-rigged/ http://venturebeat.com/2015/09/04/creative-commons-founder-l... [1] http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/ttip-biggest-threat-democracy-youve-never-heard http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/ttip-biggest-th... [2] http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/ http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/
        happyscrappy 11y ago
        It is clear who tou meant when you said they, but I can see why you want to backtrack. And despite popular confusion it will be voted on so Europeans will have only their own government to blame if it passes.
- peterjancelis 11y ago
  What I don't get is why being a war refugee entitles you to claim asylum in any country, even if you passed several peaceful countries in the process. It would make much more sense to have refugees claim asylum in neighboring countries, to maximize cultural coherence, ease a move back home once the country can rebuild, and to stop incentivizing people to risk their life going from a safe country to another safe country with more benefits. If any war in the world will result in mass migration to just the richest countries with the most elaborate welfare states, then you'll just end up with fewer rich welfare states in the long run. Be careful what you wish for.
  - return0 11y ago
    The rich countries in the region are more interested in slave labor rather than desperate refugees. The refugees are making the rational choice here, i don't believe they are driven out of some greedy interest.
- omonra 11y ago
  Please keep your tinfoil-hat antisemitism off HN.
chvid 11y ago
How is it coordinated?
- generic_user 11y ago
  It is coordinated in the Press. The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA. When the global press put a front page picture of a drowned Syrian Child on there covers it is a Coordinated release. Media Messaging is the bread and butter of the News Media. This story is part of Messageing to set the 'tone'.
  - moe 11y ago
    The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA. It really hurts to read this kind of drivel on HN. This is not how the press works. "The press" is not an uniform entity. This is not how any of this works. Please take your conspiracy theories elsewhere.
    - chvid 11y ago
      "The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA." That is probably true but I don't understand how the recent pictures of a Syrian child washing ashore could be a part of a "coordinated release"?
      - leaveyou 11y ago
        It looks quite coordinated because the same press was raging against eastern european immigrants, workers and gypsies for years before and accused them of parasitism and now in one, two months, with appeal to emotions, the new immigrants which have way higher chances of being hard to assimilate and drain some budgets are portrayed in rather a positive light. The father who recklessly took his family from the relative safety of Turkey to death on an overcrowded boat for the elusive european mirage is portrayed as innocent victim..
    - 11y ago
jpfr 11y ago
The EU is winning this. It shows that it goes by the humanitarian principles it claims to have. Refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay and to become citizens. People fleeing from a bad economic situation are not. > But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. It's a disaster for the refugees. But the disaster is in Syria. > The damage is so great that Even China and Russia have managed to claim the moral high ground and quit rightly blame the crisis on the EU itself and NATO adventurism in Syria. You are confused. The US and Turkey are in NATO. But the EU has nearly no involvement in Syria. Besides taking on the fleeing population, that is.
- return0 11y ago
  As a European I hope the EU is not guided by blind faith in abstract ideas, but is acting pragmatically and to the interest of its own people instead.
- acqq 11y ago
  >> The EU is winning this. It shows that it goes by the humanitarian principles it claims to have. Refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay and to become citizens. People fleeing from a bad economic situation are not. Actually the "refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay" only if they manage to cross the borders which EU still works hard to close: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO0IRsfrPQ4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO0IRsfrPQ4 There is a reason why people must pay the illegal boats to reach Europe across the sea.
return0 11y ago
I don't mind the positive messaging, and to be precise the number of refugees is still small. There are millions that have been driven out of syria in neighboring countries like jordan. However the european media are doing a bad job at telling people the whole story in simple terms about how syria got in this mess and what are the ways to end the crisis where it began (military intervention? who knows). It shouldn't have to take horrible pictures of refugees and children for the people in europe to start talking seriously about this crisis. Focusing on who's going to take more refugees is short-sighted politicking that is benefiting only the far-right parties. http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16979186 http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16979186
- acqq 11y ago
  > the european media are doing a bad job at telling people the whole story in simple terms about how syria got in this mess The BBC text linked "conveniently" ignores some influential players and even the recent history: Compare: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/cia-begins-weapons-delivery-to-syrian-rebels/2013/09/11/9fcf2ed8-1b0c-11e3-a628-7e6dde8f889d_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/cia-b... The Washington Post, September 11, 2013: "CIA begins weapons delivery to Syrian rebels" And: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_Levant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_... "The group gained prominence after it drove Iraqi government forces out of key cities in western Iraq in an offensive initiated in early 2014." Also note, the state as of October 2014: http://www.quora.com/Where-is-ISIL-getting-their-ammunition http://www.quora.com/Where-is-ISIL-getting-their-ammunition (which refers to: http://www.conflictarm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Dispatch_IS_Iraq_Syria_Ammunition.pdf http://www.conflictarm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Dispat... ) "Iraqi and Syrian government forces and moderate rebels now face a significant number of ISIL fighters equipped from huge stocks of captured American-made weapons. The report states that the majority of ISIL ammo recovered in Iraq appears traceable to these stocks."
  - return0 11y ago
    All true, but you rarely find an article that mentions the whole story in simple terms, instead of artifacts.

mahouse 11y ago

What I don't understand is why us Europeans have to pay for the adventurism of the NATO; I wish all the refugees moved to Israel and the US, to be honest. Once again Putin is right, and this uncovers how a permanent conflict at the arab world is in the interest of the NATO and the US/Israel-aligned world overall.

mineshaftgap 11y ago
You do realize that Europe is part of the US aligned world and the only thing preventing Europe from becoming Putin's playground is NATO?
- mahouse 11y ago
  I would rather allow Europe to become Putin's playground than to allow the current situation to continue.
  - mineshaftgap 11y ago
    I hope you get your wish.
- joeyspn 11y ago
  Aligned? That's why they won't allow us Europeans to vote NO to TTIP and they have to discuss and approve it in secrecy. The citizens of Europe are not aligned with anyone. We've had enough with two WW.
  - mineshaftgap 11y ago
    Holy fuck people get confused. Exactly how are Americans stopping you from voting? You don't think Europe and the US are aligned? Hate can be blinding. Has a there ever been even a single EU candidate that ran on an anti-US platform? If not why not?
    - mahouse 11y ago
      Because you can't win an election without the blessing of the media, and guess who controls it.
    - joeyspn 11y ago
      > Exactly how are Americans stopping you from voting? Who said “Americans”? I’m just saying “they”, and “they” are the bribed politicians [0] (both in the US and Europe). “They” don’t want us to vote [1] because they know We (the citizens) are not aligned with everything that USA or ANYONE says and does. > Hate can be blinding. Has a there ever been even a single EU candidate that ran on an anti-US platform? LOL, who is telling you that being neutral is being anti-american? chillax dude. I’m just anti-war and anti-media-bullshit, like any libertarian able to read between the lines (even american ones [2]). Get your facts straight. [0] http://venturebeat.com/2015/09/04/creative-commons-founder-larry-lessig-is-running-for-president-the-system-is-rigged/ http://venturebeat.com/2015/09/04/creative-commons-founder-l... [1] http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/ttip-biggest-threat-democracy-youve-never-heard http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/ttip-biggest-th... [2] http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/ http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/
      - happyscrappy 11y ago
        It is clear who tou meant when you said they, but I can see why you want to backtrack. And despite popular confusion it will be voted on so Europeans will have only their own government to blame if it passes.
peterjancelis 11y ago
What I don't get is why being a war refugee entitles you to claim asylum in any country, even if you passed several peaceful countries in the process. It would make much more sense to have refugees claim asylum in neighboring countries, to maximize cultural coherence, ease a move back home once the country can rebuild, and to stop incentivizing people to risk their life going from a safe country to another safe country with more benefits. If any war in the world will result in mass migration to just the richest countries with the most elaborate welfare states, then you'll just end up with fewer rich welfare states in the long run. Be careful what you wish for.
- return0 11y ago
  The rich countries in the region are more interested in slave labor rather than desperate refugees. The refugees are making the rational choice here, i don't believe they are driven out of some greedy interest.
omonra 11y ago
Please keep your tinfoil-hat antisemitism off HN.

chvid 11y ago

How is it coordinated?

generic_user 11y ago
It is coordinated in the Press. The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA. When the global press put a front page picture of a drowned Syrian Child on there covers it is a Coordinated release. Media Messaging is the bread and butter of the News Media. This story is part of Messageing to set the 'tone'.
- moe 11y ago
  The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA. It really hurts to read this kind of drivel on HN. This is not how the press works. "The press" is not an uniform entity. This is not how any of this works. Please take your conspiracy theories elsewhere.
  - chvid 11y ago
    "The EU has its own Press agents that work with all Member state media and the international Press Including the USA." That is probably true but I don't understand how the recent pictures of a Syrian child washing ashore could be a part of a "coordinated release"?
    - leaveyou 11y ago
      It looks quite coordinated because the same press was raging against eastern european immigrants, workers and gypsies for years before and accused them of parasitism and now in one, two months, with appeal to emotions, the new immigrants which have way higher chances of being hard to assimilate and drain some budgets are portrayed in rather a positive light. The father who recklessly took his family from the relative safety of Turkey to death on an overcrowded boat for the elusive european mirage is portrayed as innocent victim..
  - 11y ago

jpfr 11y ago

The EU is winning this. It shows that it goes by the humanitarian principles it claims to have. Refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay and to become citizens. People fleeing from a bad economic situation are not. > But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. It's a disaster for the refugees. But the disaster is in Syria. > The damage is so great that Even China and Russia have managed to claim the moral high ground and quit rightly blame the crisis on the EU itself and NATO adventurism in Syria. You are confused. The US and Turkey are in NATO. But the EU has nearly no involvement in Syria. Besides taking on the fleeing population, that is.

return0 11y ago
As a European I hope the EU is not guided by blind faith in abstract ideas, but is acting pragmatically and to the interest of its own people instead.
acqq 11y ago
>> The EU is winning this. It shows that it goes by the humanitarian principles it claims to have. Refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay and to become citizens. People fleeing from a bad economic situation are not. Actually the "refugees fleeing from a humanitarian crisis are allowed to stay" only if they manage to cross the borders which EU still works hard to close: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO0IRsfrPQ4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO0IRsfrPQ4 There is a reason why people must pay the illegal boats to reach Europe across the sea.

return0 11y ago

I don't mind the positive messaging, and to be precise the number of refugees is still small. There are millions that have been driven out of syria in neighboring countries like jordan. However the european media are doing a bad job at telling people the whole story in simple terms about how syria got in this mess and what are the ways to end the crisis where it began (military intervention? who knows). It shouldn't have to take horrible pictures of refugees and children for the people in europe to start talking seriously about this crisis. Focusing on who's going to take more refugees is short-sighted politicking that is benefiting only the far-right parties. http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16979186 http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16979186

acqq 11y ago
> the european media are doing a bad job at telling people the whole story in simple terms about how syria got in this mess The BBC text linked "conveniently" ignores some influential players and even the recent history: Compare: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/cia-begins-weapons-delivery-to-syrian-rebels/2013/09/11/9fcf2ed8-1b0c-11e3-a628-7e6dde8f889d_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/cia-b... The Washington Post, September 11, 2013: "CIA begins weapons delivery to Syrian rebels" And: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_Levant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_... "The group gained prominence after it drove Iraqi government forces out of key cities in western Iraq in an offensive initiated in early 2014." Also note, the state as of October 2014: http://www.quora.com/Where-is-ISIL-getting-their-ammunition http://www.quora.com/Where-is-ISIL-getting-their-ammunition (which refers to: http://www.conflictarm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Dispatch_IS_Iraq_Syria_Ammunition.pdf http://www.conflictarm.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Dispat... ) "Iraqi and Syrian government forces and moderate rebels now face a significant number of ISIL fighters equipped from huge stocks of captured American-made weapons. The report states that the majority of ISIL ammo recovered in Iraq appears traceable to these stocks."
- return0 11y ago
  All true, but you rarely find an article that mentions the whole story in simple terms, instead of artifacts.