4 ms·

Keep in mind that this kind of news (such that government aided IS) are produced/propagated by a group in Turkey who's sole aim is to overthrow the current gove

by afsina 11y ago

Keep in mind that this kind of news (such that government aided IS) are produced/propagated by a group in Turkey who's sole aim is to overthrow the current government because of an evident power struggle. Just take it with a large grain of salt.

caio1982 11y ago
You're saying the news is fake or that simply spreading it is the real propaganda? What's this group name, by the way?
- gokhan 11y ago
  Parent is referring to Gulenists, followers of Fethullah Gulen, a cleric living in exile in Pennsylvania. The news may be true as well, although source is as bad as the ruling party in Turkey. But the current situation in Turkey makes it almost impossible to investigate such claims. Maybe in the future.
- afsina 11y ago
  Group is so called Gulen movement. Their media outlets are constantly spreading this kind of anti-government news, as they have a feud with them. These guys are well organized, well hid and well educated. Funnily enough many western media uses them as their primary news source. From what I see, there may have been a help to Syrian rebels, nobody denies that anyway. But claiming it was "IS" and help was sent to them deliberately is just wrong.
gokhan 11y ago
But remember that Erdogan's party's sympathy for IS is a well known fact with lots of evidence, none proved to be false or untrue to this date. This power struggle only makes clear that both sides you mention (and they were close friends until 2014) are criminal organizations battling for power.
- afsina 11y ago
  I don't see the facts or the evidence as you do. Problem is that IS is a completely different beast, even many radical opposition groups in Syria hate them. There were and there are many other opposition forces before even IS appeared in Syria which might be helped by governments and there may have been logistics screw ups as well. But telling IS got helped deliberately crosses the line in my mind.
  - gokhan 11y ago
    Here's one for you: 'ISIS Sees Turkey as Its Ally': Former Islamic State Member Reveals Turkish Army Cooperation http://europe.newsweek.com/isis-and-turkey-cooperate-destroy-kurds-former-isis-member-reveals-turkish-282920 http://europe.newsweek.com/isis-and-turkey-cooperate-destroy... Do you also think it's fabricated?
    - afsina 11y ago
      From all I know, they see the current government as "tyrants" and "enemy of God". They may see some radicals here as their allies but this news is much like "i heard that", "he said this" kind.
megalodon 11y ago
This might be true, but keep in mind that all Europeans that travel to fight for IS pass through Turkey without much resistance. They are officially against IS, but they have their own agenda in the area (i.e. the PKK).
- afsina 11y ago
  I would simply say Hanlon's razor. Before shit got real they did not care much who passes from there I guess.
beshrkayali 11y ago
This is inaccurate and misleading. Saying that it's produced/propagated by this vague group with no evidence is produced/propagated by you right now. There is a lot of evidence on the other hand that weapons are being transported to Syria via Turkey, is that with the knowledge of the government or not can't be proven, but it's as credible of an option as them (government) supposedly helping to fight IS.
- afsina 11y ago
  the group is not vague at all. And their media outlets are constantly spreading such news. As repeatedly I said, IS is a late comer to Syria and there are many other groups there. Putting IS to the context just changes the ball game.
binarray2000 11y ago
If you read this document - uncovered by Judicial Watch (conservative organisation) through FOIA request - it doesn't seem to be propaganda news: http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Pg.-291-Pgs.-287-293-JW-v-DOD-and-State-14-812-DOD-Release-2015-04-10-final-version11.pdf http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Pg.-... Good analysis: http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/newly-declassified-u-s-government-documents-the-west-supported-the-creation-of-isis.html http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/newly-declassified-u-... Confirmation by the former DIA director: http://levantreport.com/2015/08/06/former-dia-chief-michael-flynn-says-rise-of-islamic-state-was-a-willful-decision-and-defends-accuracy-of-2012-memo/ http://levantreport.com/2015/08/06/former-dia-chief-michael-...
hamdiakoguz 11y ago
These are the photographs mentioned in the news: http://www.bugun.com.tr/gundem/sok-fotograflar-haberi/1810549 http://www.bugun.com.tr/gundem/sok-fotograflar-haberi/181054... The fact that these are reported by an organization which is anti-government does not make it false. I agree that we should take any news with a large grain of salt.
- afsina 11y ago
  where is IS in that photo?
  - decafbad 11y ago
    You can read YPG on that DIY "tank". http://img.bugun.com.tr/newsFiles/arsiv/nakil7_31_08_15.jpg http://img.bugun.com.tr/newsFiles/arsiv/nakil7_31_08_15.jpg
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - gokhan 11y ago
      And a YPG (kurdish group fighting ISIS) militant doing tawhid, hand sign done with index finger belonging to radical islamist groups? You're such a troll.
      - decafbad 11y ago
        Look at the front side. It's written there in blue.
mda 11y ago
Actually this article is weird, it says "Turkish daily" in the headline but never mentions what this term means in the article, it mentions a "daily Bugun" newspaper, maybe he means "Bugun newspaper" as "Turkish Daily"? In general a very poorly structured article.

by afsina 11y ago

caio1982 11y ago

You're saying the news is fake or that simply spreading it is the real propaganda? What's this group name, by the way?

gokhan 11y ago
Parent is referring to Gulenists, followers of Fethullah Gulen, a cleric living in exile in Pennsylvania. The news may be true as well, although source is as bad as the ruling party in Turkey. But the current situation in Turkey makes it almost impossible to investigate such claims. Maybe in the future.
afsina 11y ago
Group is so called Gulen movement. Their media outlets are constantly spreading this kind of anti-government news, as they have a feud with them. These guys are well organized, well hid and well educated. Funnily enough many western media uses them as their primary news source. From what I see, there may have been a help to Syrian rebels, nobody denies that anyway. But claiming it was "IS" and help was sent to them deliberately is just wrong.

gokhan 11y ago

But remember that Erdogan's party's sympathy for IS is a well known fact with lots of evidence, none proved to be false or untrue to this date. This power struggle only makes clear that both sides you mention (and they were close friends until 2014) are criminal organizations battling for power.

afsina 11y ago
I don't see the facts or the evidence as you do. Problem is that IS is a completely different beast, even many radical opposition groups in Syria hate them. There were and there are many other opposition forces before even IS appeared in Syria which might be helped by governments and there may have been logistics screw ups as well. But telling IS got helped deliberately crosses the line in my mind.
- gokhan 11y ago
  Here's one for you: 'ISIS Sees Turkey as Its Ally': Former Islamic State Member Reveals Turkish Army Cooperation http://europe.newsweek.com/isis-and-turkey-cooperate-destroy-kurds-former-isis-member-reveals-turkish-282920 http://europe.newsweek.com/isis-and-turkey-cooperate-destroy... Do you also think it's fabricated?
  - afsina 11y ago
    From all I know, they see the current government as "tyrants" and "enemy of God". They may see some radicals here as their allies but this news is much like "i heard that", "he said this" kind.

megalodon 11y ago

This might be true, but keep in mind that all Europeans that travel to fight for IS pass through Turkey without much resistance. They are officially against IS, but they have their own agenda in the area (i.e. the PKK).

afsina 11y ago
I would simply say Hanlon's razor. Before shit got real they did not care much who passes from there I guess.

beshrkayali 11y ago

This is inaccurate and misleading. Saying that it's produced/propagated by this vague group with no evidence is produced/propagated by you right now. There is a lot of evidence on the other hand that weapons are being transported to Syria via Turkey, is that with the knowledge of the government or not can't be proven, but it's as credible of an option as them (government) supposedly helping to fight IS.

afsina 11y ago
the group is not vague at all. And their media outlets are constantly spreading such news. As repeatedly I said, IS is a late comer to Syria and there are many other groups there. Putting IS to the context just changes the ball game.

binarray2000 11y ago

If you read this document - uncovered by Judicial Watch (conservative organisation) through FOIA request - it doesn't seem to be propaganda news: http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Pg.-291-Pgs.-287-293-JW-v-DOD-and-State-14-812-DOD-Release-2015-04-10-final-version11.pdf http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Pg.-... Good analysis: http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/newly-declassified-u-s-government-documents-the-west-supported-the-creation-of-isis.html http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/newly-declassified-u-... Confirmation by the former DIA director: http://levantreport.com/2015/08/06/former-dia-chief-michael-flynn-says-rise-of-islamic-state-was-a-willful-decision-and-defends-accuracy-of-2012-memo/ http://levantreport.com/2015/08/06/former-dia-chief-michael-...

hamdiakoguz 11y ago

These are the photographs mentioned in the news: http://www.bugun.com.tr/gundem/sok-fotograflar-haberi/1810549 http://www.bugun.com.tr/gundem/sok-fotograflar-haberi/181054... The fact that these are reported by an organization which is anti-government does not make it false. I agree that we should take any news with a large grain of salt.

afsina 11y ago
where is IS in that photo?
- decafbad 11y ago
  You can read YPG on that DIY "tank". http://img.bugun.com.tr/newsFiles/arsiv/nakil7_31_08_15.jpg http://img.bugun.com.tr/newsFiles/arsiv/nakil7_31_08_15.jpg
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - gokhan 11y ago
    And a YPG (kurdish group fighting ISIS) militant doing tawhid, hand sign done with index finger belonging to radical islamist groups? You're such a troll.
    - decafbad 11y ago
      Look at the front side. It's written there in blue.

mda 11y ago

Actually this article is weird, it says "Turkish daily" in the headline but never mentions what this term means in the article, it mentions a "daily Bugun" newspaper, maybe he means "Bugun newspaper" as "Turkish Daily"? In general a very poorly structured article.