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It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Ar

by candl 11y ago

It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, etc... Same culture, same religion and they are much closer! It also amazes me why the EU leaders insist for other European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness and they build fences on their borders because they know what this might lead to.

ashleyp 11y ago
Why cares who's responsible? They're humans. Arn't we all responsible for all humans on the planet?
- jqm 11y ago
  I don't think we can be. Sadly.
- gyardley 11y ago
  Whether we should be is up for debate, but no, I'm pretty sure we're not.
  - ashleyp 11y ago
    Who says we're not?
    - gyardley 11y ago
      The legal codes we're subject to, whether we are or we aren't. I believe in most locales people are responsible for their own children, but - and correct me if I'm wrong, happy to learn something - I don't think there's anything in there that makes anyone responsible for random strangers on the other side of the planet. Again, this doesn't have anything to do with whether we should be responsible for random strangers on the other side of the planet.
      - ashleyp 11y ago
        Hello :) So in my perspective, no one can make us =). But - we can choose to be. Or choose not to be. I.e we, individually say if we are or are not. It is our choice. I choose to be (as much as I can, and I may not be able to do much in these circumstances but I try in others of my life as much as possible and I dedicate most of my time to others). I choose to be because I believe this builds a better planet and it encourages help rather than a "I'm not helping i'm not responsible. Find the person to blame and make them pay". But how do we ever find the person to blame? Is it the refugee coming over in hope with their family for a better life? Is it the people fighting in the war? The people who started the war? Who should pay the price? In my studies of humanity and cultures the place that most inspired me was an island where every child was taken care of by every family on that island. There were no barriers, parents treated every kid as their own. So, forgive my post if it has come across as convincing people they should take responsibility that was not the case. I was asking a genuine question in the sense, why can we not help? Why does responsibility matter really?
- treenyc 11y ago
  You can be responsible, and it doesn't has to be in the way that allows 'refugees' into your country. People in each country ought to have a choice in that.
  - ashleyp 11y ago
    True - there's still ways of helping without that. But what's the fear about letting refugees into the country? Why are people so scared of this? (genuine question =)) It seems to me the only countries whom are scared are the ones who think they're the best, greatest and fear loosing that status. This sounds like idk...country ego? lol.
    - caseysoftware 11y ago
      > Why cares who's responsible? They're humans. Arn't we all responsible for all humans on the planet? How many homeless people do you let crash at your place each night?
      - ashleyp 11y ago
        Caseysoftware - i've had exactly three people crash at my house who were homeless strangers. Only for a few nights each. I have also got chatting to a homeless dude who turned out to be an artist. He carried on a pen drive pictures he'd created over the last few years but he had no computer access and no way to get them. I said i'd take a look and the next day went into a shop and printed every single picture, paid for it and gave it to him. I have no problem giving to strangers and not getting anything in return. I get something back naturally, I feel happier that they are happier. Hence i'm in the process of starting a social enterprise =).
        caseysoftware 11y ago
        Sounds like a great start. When are you going fulltime with it? "It" being letting homeless people crash at your house all the time.
- mrdodge 11y ago
  Why do you state this like it's a truth?
  - ashleyp 11y ago
    You don't think they're Humans?
    - mrdodge 11y ago
      That we are responsible for them. They are responsible for themselves, they understand that, that's why they go to the most generous countries.
      - ashleyp 11y ago
        I take it you've spoken to loads of refuges then and that's exactly what they said then? "Our childrens lives are at risk, but we fancy risking them more to come to a generous country". I think you misunderstood my point and took it too literally: who cares who's responsible. We can still help people unconditionally without expecting anything in return but within reason. "Hey man, you're going through a really hard time at the moment. It's not my fault what has happened to you and it's not your fault this has happened to you either. But I would be happy to help you regardless." Now, wouldn't that be an amazing place to be? Well done Germany, Iceland and the others. --- Slightly off topic There's videos of locals all going up and greeting refuges and offering toys, food, donations. I can't imagine how amazing it must feel after years of hardship and death on your door to see happy faces greeting you with open arms. That right there would give me hope and a strong feeling of wanting to do everything possibly to repay the people who helped me in my desperate time of need. P.s I wasn't a refugee, but I did grow up in refuges as a child and I met and spoke to refugees. This was going back 18 years ago now, much has changed but I met the most incredible and inspirational people there.
- ryanlol 11y ago
  Why would I be responsible for people I don't even know? If I help somebody it's out of kindness, not responsibility.
  - ashleyp 11y ago
    Thankyou. That's my point. Who cares? We can still help them out of kindness and unconditionally, not expecting anything back.
    - Kalium 11y ago
      There are limits, practical as well as rhetorical. Not everyone wants to be lectured about how unconditional kindness is their duty and responsibility. Not everyone wants to be told that this kindness needs to come at significant expense at a time when (insert fiscal problems here, such as Greece or the UK) are already occurring.
      - ashleyp 11y ago
        I'm aware, i'm from the uk. No lecture. I wasnt telling anyone what to do.
    - ryanlol 11y ago
      I don't want to pay extra taxes to help foreigners, I'll gladly donate money to charities. But the second my country started demanding I pay taxes to help refugees, all my income moved over to HK. And no, I don't have a problem with refugees, I'm glad to help them. I have a problem with the state _forcing_ me to help them.
      - ashleyp 11y ago
        Yeah I can understand your point. Not nice being told what to do or forced what to do. When did the UK start demanding taxes to help refugees btw? I'm not aware of this.
        11y ago
- venomsnake 11y ago
  That is a view usually held from people that are separated by geography, class or income from a lot of the humans they feel responsible for.
jacobush 11y ago
Sadly, I am not amazed at all by your reaction.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
afterburner 11y ago
Hint: civil liberties plays a part.
gambiting 11y ago
I don't think any country has to be responsible for anything in order to accept refugees, do you? If you are fleeing from war, then you should be able to apply for asylum/refugee status everywhere. Doesn't mean that every country should accept them,but the implication that EU countries are not responsible for the conflict so they shouldn't help out is.....weird. Maybe EU shouldn't be sending help to people affected by tsunamis, or earthquakes too? In the end, we are not responsible for it, so why should my tax money be going to some poor people in a country I've never been to or plan to go to? "Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness" I am pretty sure some people said the same thing about Hitler calling out Jews, not being afraid of political correctness, exposing them for what they were! Everyone knew what letting jews sprawl might lead to! /s
- ashleyp 11y ago
  THANKYOU for articulating what I was REALLY struggling to do!
mcmalloc 11y ago
Because those countries largely don't accept and accommodate refugees. There are no stigmas in countries like that against being racist or being against immigration like there are in Europe. Hell, those countries won't even take Palestinian refugees even though they will claim that Palestinians are suffering an oppressive occupation.
- venomsnake 11y ago
  There is no stigma of being racist and antiimmigration in Europe too. Our whiny SJW are still in infancy.
ErikRogneby 11y ago
Nobody is lucky to have xenophobic and bigoted leaders.
rumcajz 11y ago
If you are fleeing from ISIS why, for heaven's sake, would you go to Saudi Arabia?
- edkhalid1 11y ago
  hahahahah
EliRivers 11y ago
They're often not the same culture, and not the same religion.
circuiter 11y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_W... Their nearby brethren have already taken in MILLIONS of refugees. It took only a few hundred thousand in Europe for the media circus to begin and for their plight to be put in the spotlight.
- jacobush 11y ago
  Lebanon took a million and a half or thereabouts.
  - mrdodge 11y ago
    And look how that is turning out for them.
  - sremani 11y ago
    Jordan and Turkey also absorbed massive refugees. But the ones making to Europe are industrious and economically sophisticated, they are in it for more than personal/family safety. If you are educated and industrious why would you accept squalor conditions in refugee camp, if I were them I would do the same. The irony is ISIS's propaganda heavily relies on Europe born second generation Immigrants.
    - jacobush 11y ago
      Of course. Because a camp in Jordan is so safe. A lovely place to raise a family.
zerr 11y ago
We (Europeans) never bothered about cultural and religious closeness when we were occupying, colonizing and sucking goods from them, did we?
- hnpc123 11y ago
  You know, at least Europeans are consistent in their moral grandstanding. For sure mass immigration from illiberal non-Western societies will cause damage to the cultural fabric of Europe and cause strain on the welfare systems, but at least you consistently apply your moral standards to yourself and not just America and Israel when it's convenient. That is admirable.
  - zerr 11y ago
    > mass immigration from illiberal non-Western societies will cause damage to the cultural fabric of Europe .... That's not necessarily truth. In fact, most of immigrants are escaping from those illiberal societies. They want to have an European lifestyle. Become musicians, artists, engineers, etc... These kind of fresh workforce, who know what is it to live in poverty are actually much better at work and contribute more to the welfare system.
- ciupicri 11y ago
  What Europeans? Do you mean UK and France?
  - zerr 11y ago
    Pretty much every European country: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_European_colonies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_European_coloni...
    - ciupicri 11y ago
      I think you meant some Western European countries. Because I don't see Slovenia, the Czech Republic, Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Poland, Ukraine, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and probably others on that list. And I definitely don't see Switzerland. Europe doesn't mean the European Union (founders).
paganel 11y ago
> European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. I'll pass over the casual xenophobia implicit in your post (just for you info, Lebanon has over 1 million Syrian refugees for a population of ~4.5 million, Jordan has ~600,000 refugees for a population of ~8 million), I just want to mention how the whole Middle East fuck-up is the result of the post-WW1 partitions, for which the UK and France are hugely responsible. I'll also copy-paste this from the wikipedia page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_involvement_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War#France_and_Britain https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_involvement_in_the_Syr...): > On 19 September 2013, French President François Hollande hinted that France was ready to begin supplying lethal aid to the Free Syrian Army during a press conference in Bamako in a "controlled framework". Hollande told the conference that "On delivering weapons we have always said that we want to control these supplies so that they do indeed go to the Free Syrian Army ... because they represent the Syrian National Coalition that we recognise as the legitimate representative of the Syrian people and today they are caught between a hammer and an anvil. The hammer is the air strikes and actions of the Syrian regime and the anvil is radical Islam. Two years later it turns out that the FSA is almost an empty shell (with the partial exception of the southern region around Daraa - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Southern_Syria_offensive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Southern_Syria_offensive), and the forces now fighting Assad in Syria are mostly Islamist, from Al Nusra (the local Al Qaeda branch) to the Islamic Front. So what Hollande was suggesting was something along the lines of "let's bomb Assad and help this other bad guys instead".
- herge 11y ago
  > the whole Middle East fuck-up is the result of the post-WW1 partitions Blaming everything on the Sykes-Picot agreement removes a lot of agency from the inhabitants of the Middle East, especially political movements like the rise of Baathism and pan-arabism. /r/BadHistory had a good post on this recently: https://www.reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/3j75b8/sykespicot_or_why_my_blood_pressure_spiked_at/ https://www.reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/3j75b8/sykespic...
  - paganel 11y ago
musha68k 11y ago
We could all end up being dependent on the solidarity of others ourselves - it's all about love and understanding :) ️
erikb 11y ago
Actually Europe is very much responsible, only a small percentage flees to our countries and the reason is clear: People at least think that life in Europe is much better and in some cases they are correct. Please learn about the situation and not just judge it.
- lexcorvus 11y ago
  Life in Europe is better for now. Flood European countries with millions of "refugees" and it won't be for long. On the other hand, I sometimes say "If immigration is so great, why don't you take a foreign lodger into your house?" At least these "Refugees welcome" people are putting their flats where their mouths are.
- ciupicri 11y ago
  Why is Europe very much responsible? Also, please define Europe to avoid any confusion with the European Union or Western Europe.
  - programmernews3 11y ago
    They want free stuff so they travel to the places that give them the most free stuff.
turk- 11y ago
This completely false. Five countries neighboring Syria - Lebanon, Jordan, Turkey, Iraq and Egypt - host 97% of the refugees. Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan have taken in 3 million refugees. Egypt and Iraq have another 200,000 are much poorer than Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan and have taken in 200,000 which is more than all of Europe combined. Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and UAE refuse to take in refugees in large numbers. They are also known for horrible human rights abuses. It would be foolish to attempt to go to these countries as a refugee.
- clarus 11y ago
  candl does not talk about neighbouring countries but about the Golf countries, so he is right.
AngrySkillzz 11y ago
Implying that they'd fit right in because they're brown and Muslim is some seriously ignorant shit. Remember all the ethnic tensions in Europe, in the Balkans? And religious tensions, even between different sects of Christianity? To imply that doesn't exist in other cultures is to attribute complexities to your own race and deny that they exist elsewhere. Ignorant.
binarray2000 11y ago
>>> It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, etc... Same culture, same religion and they are much closer! Some of the "alternative" countries you mention are direct supporters of the forces who have caused or are themselves involved in wars in countries from where refugees come. And despite "same" culture, "same" religion and proximity, I assume, these countries don't want to import social and financial problems. >>> It also amazes me why the EU leaders insist for other European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. As for EU countries not being responsible: UK, France and Germany (and other EU and non-EU NATO member countries in their tow) are very well directly involved and responsible. Political destabilization, intelligence services involvement, boots on the ground, flying aeroplanes and drones (and dropping bombs) over their heads, supporting local "rebel" forces. In Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen - they are all over the place. So, it's "natural" that the "weapons of mass immigration" are heading towards EU. >>> Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness and they build fences on their borders because they know what this might lead to. No, European "leaders" are not stupid for building fences. OK, they are... because by building fences they are dealing with the effect and not solving the cause. They are stupid for making themselves marionettes to the Oligarchy. For letting their countries become vassal states. Especially funny, all ex Warsaw-bloc countries, in pursuit of "freedom", have flocked in the arms of another tyrant (instead of trying being truly independent). Last but not least, they are stupid for not building good trans Atlantic ships and sending the refugees to the Oligarchy.
rbehrends 11y ago
> It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, etc... Out of these countries, only Egypt is even a signatory to the Refugee Convention and its Protocol. All of these countries range from "questionable human rights status" to "fascist theocracy". More importantly, most Syrian refugees are in Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan, and Iraq, all of which are already overflowing (Turkey alone has close to two million refugees). They are fleeing to closer countries, but these countries are already operating beyond capacity. > Same culture, same religion and they are much closer! Watch this video of Damascus college students before the war: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbM4trP42NY&sns=em https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbM4trP42NY&sns=em How much do you think they have in common with the culture of Saudi Arabia? > It also amazes me why the EU leaders insist for other European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. The underlying reason here is Dublin III. According to the Dublin Regulation, asylum seekers are to be processed in the country where they enter the EU [1]. Right now, this means that Greece, Hungary, Italy, and Spain. You see the problem? Now, Sweden, Austria, and Germany are helping out despite Dublin. Finally, it doesn't matter who is responsible. The EU member states are bound by treaty and customary international law to deal with refugees on its territory; the principle of non-refoulement prevents them from sending refugees back into danger. And yes, it would still be nice if the countries that helped create that mess also helped out with the refugees. As it pertains to Syria and Iraq, that would be in particular the members of the "coalition of the willing"; Daesh arose out of the ashes of Saddam's military [2]. > Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness and they build fences on their borders because they know what this might lead to. It's pretty hard to build a fence in the middle of the sea. [1] The Dublin Regulation also is intended to support the countries of entry through various means, but was designed for a much smaller number of asylum seekers. [2] http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/iraq-war-on-terror/rise-of-isis/how-saddams-former-soldiers-are-fueling-the-rise-of-isis/ http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/iraq-war-on-terror/r...
mmosta 11y ago
RE: Egypt There are upwards of 130,000 registered Syrian refugees alone in Egypt [0], in addition to those from Sudan and Somalia. Unofficial estimates place the number much higher [1]. Absolutely no one chooses to become a refugee and its the epitome of privilege to pontificate about where they should go. They go anywhere they can that isn't here and "culture" plays absolutely no part because it isn't a vacation. In fact, geographic proximity and regional support systems are the most important thing [3]. "European" countries don't even clock in top 5. [0] http://data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/country.php?id=8 http://data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/country.php?id=8 [1] https://egyptianfoundation.wordpress.com/welcome/refugees-in-egypt/ https://egyptianfoundation.wordpress.com/welcome/refugees-in... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_W...
noobie 11y ago
You just went full retard.

by candl 11y ago

ashleyp 11y ago

Why cares who's responsible? They're humans. Arn't we all responsible for all humans on the planet?

jqm 11y ago
I don't think we can be. Sadly.
gyardley 11y ago
Whether we should be is up for debate, but no, I'm pretty sure we're not.
- ashleyp 11y ago
  Who says we're not?
  - gyardley 11y ago
    The legal codes we're subject to, whether we are or we aren't. I believe in most locales people are responsible for their own children, but - and correct me if I'm wrong, happy to learn something - I don't think there's anything in there that makes anyone responsible for random strangers on the other side of the planet. Again, this doesn't have anything to do with whether we should be responsible for random strangers on the other side of the planet.
    - ashleyp 11y ago
      Hello :) So in my perspective, no one can make us =). But - we can choose to be. Or choose not to be. I.e we, individually say if we are or are not. It is our choice. I choose to be (as much as I can, and I may not be able to do much in these circumstances but I try in others of my life as much as possible and I dedicate most of my time to others). I choose to be because I believe this builds a better planet and it encourages help rather than a "I'm not helping i'm not responsible. Find the person to blame and make them pay". But how do we ever find the person to blame? Is it the refugee coming over in hope with their family for a better life? Is it the people fighting in the war? The people who started the war? Who should pay the price? In my studies of humanity and cultures the place that most inspired me was an island where every child was taken care of by every family on that island. There were no barriers, parents treated every kid as their own. So, forgive my post if it has come across as convincing people they should take responsibility that was not the case. I was asking a genuine question in the sense, why can we not help? Why does responsibility matter really?
treenyc 11y ago
You can be responsible, and it doesn't has to be in the way that allows 'refugees' into your country. People in each country ought to have a choice in that.
- ashleyp 11y ago
  True - there's still ways of helping without that. But what's the fear about letting refugees into the country? Why are people so scared of this? (genuine question =)) It seems to me the only countries whom are scared are the ones who think they're the best, greatest and fear loosing that status. This sounds like idk...country ego? lol.
  - caseysoftware 11y ago
    > Why cares who's responsible? They're humans. Arn't we all responsible for all humans on the planet? How many homeless people do you let crash at your place each night?
    - ashleyp 11y ago
      Caseysoftware - i've had exactly three people crash at my house who were homeless strangers. Only for a few nights each. I have also got chatting to a homeless dude who turned out to be an artist. He carried on a pen drive pictures he'd created over the last few years but he had no computer access and no way to get them. I said i'd take a look and the next day went into a shop and printed every single picture, paid for it and gave it to him. I have no problem giving to strangers and not getting anything in return. I get something back naturally, I feel happier that they are happier. Hence i'm in the process of starting a social enterprise =).
      - caseysoftware 11y ago
        Sounds like a great start. When are you going fulltime with it? "It" being letting homeless people crash at your house all the time.
mrdodge 11y ago
Why do you state this like it's a truth?
- ashleyp 11y ago
  You don't think they're Humans?
  - mrdodge 11y ago
    That we are responsible for them. They are responsible for themselves, they understand that, that's why they go to the most generous countries.
    - ashleyp 11y ago
      I take it you've spoken to loads of refuges then and that's exactly what they said then? "Our childrens lives are at risk, but we fancy risking them more to come to a generous country". I think you misunderstood my point and took it too literally: who cares who's responsible. We can still help people unconditionally without expecting anything in return but within reason. "Hey man, you're going through a really hard time at the moment. It's not my fault what has happened to you and it's not your fault this has happened to you either. But I would be happy to help you regardless." Now, wouldn't that be an amazing place to be? Well done Germany, Iceland and the others. --- Slightly off topic There's videos of locals all going up and greeting refuges and offering toys, food, donations. I can't imagine how amazing it must feel after years of hardship and death on your door to see happy faces greeting you with open arms. That right there would give me hope and a strong feeling of wanting to do everything possibly to repay the people who helped me in my desperate time of need. P.s I wasn't a refugee, but I did grow up in refuges as a child and I met and spoke to refugees. This was going back 18 years ago now, much has changed but I met the most incredible and inspirational people there.
ryanlol 11y ago
Why would I be responsible for people I don't even know? If I help somebody it's out of kindness, not responsibility.
- ashleyp 11y ago
  Thankyou. That's my point. Who cares? We can still help them out of kindness and unconditionally, not expecting anything back.
  - Kalium 11y ago
    There are limits, practical as well as rhetorical. Not everyone wants to be lectured about how unconditional kindness is their duty and responsibility. Not everyone wants to be told that this kindness needs to come at significant expense at a time when (insert fiscal problems here, such as Greece or the UK) are already occurring.
    - ashleyp 11y ago
      I'm aware, i'm from the uk. No lecture. I wasnt telling anyone what to do.
  - ryanlol 11y ago
    I don't want to pay extra taxes to help foreigners, I'll gladly donate money to charities. But the second my country started demanding I pay taxes to help refugees, all my income moved over to HK. And no, I don't have a problem with refugees, I'm glad to help them. I have a problem with the state _forcing_ me to help them.
    - ashleyp 11y ago
      Yeah I can understand your point. Not nice being told what to do or forced what to do. When did the UK start demanding taxes to help refugees btw? I'm not aware of this.
      - 11y ago
venomsnake 11y ago
That is a view usually held from people that are separated by geography, class or income from a lot of the humans they feel responsible for.

jacobush 11y ago

Sadly, I am not amazed at all by your reaction.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

afterburner 11y ago

Hint: civil liberties plays a part.

gambiting 11y ago

I don't think any country has to be responsible for anything in order to accept refugees, do you? If you are fleeing from war, then you should be able to apply for asylum/refugee status everywhere. Doesn't mean that every country should accept them,but the implication that EU countries are not responsible for the conflict so they shouldn't help out is.....weird. Maybe EU shouldn't be sending help to people affected by tsunamis, or earthquakes too? In the end, we are not responsible for it, so why should my tax money be going to some poor people in a country I've never been to or plan to go to? "Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness" I am pretty sure some people said the same thing about Hitler calling out Jews, not being afraid of political correctness, exposing them for what they were! Everyone knew what letting jews sprawl might lead to! /s

ashleyp 11y ago
THANKYOU for articulating what I was REALLY struggling to do!

mcmalloc 11y ago

Because those countries largely don't accept and accommodate refugees. There are no stigmas in countries like that against being racist or being against immigration like there are in Europe. Hell, those countries won't even take Palestinian refugees even though they will claim that Palestinians are suffering an oppressive occupation.

venomsnake 11y ago
There is no stigma of being racist and antiimmigration in Europe too. Our whiny SJW are still in infancy.

ErikRogneby 11y ago

Nobody is lucky to have xenophobic and bigoted leaders.

rumcajz 11y ago

If you are fleeing from ISIS why, for heaven's sake, would you go to Saudi Arabia?

edkhalid1 11y ago
hahahahah

EliRivers 11y ago

They're often not the same culture, and not the same religion.

circuiter 11y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_W... Their nearby brethren have already taken in MILLIONS of refugees. It took only a few hundred thousand in Europe for the media circus to begin and for their plight to be put in the spotlight.

jacobush 11y ago
Lebanon took a million and a half or thereabouts.
- mrdodge 11y ago
  And look how that is turning out for them.
- sremani 11y ago
  Jordan and Turkey also absorbed massive refugees. But the ones making to Europe are industrious and economically sophisticated, they are in it for more than personal/family safety. If you are educated and industrious why would you accept squalor conditions in refugee camp, if I were them I would do the same. The irony is ISIS's propaganda heavily relies on Europe born second generation Immigrants.
  - jacobush 11y ago
    Of course. Because a camp in Jordan is so safe. A lovely place to raise a family.

zerr 11y ago

We (Europeans) never bothered about cultural and religious closeness when we were occupying, colonizing and sucking goods from them, did we?

hnpc123 11y ago
You know, at least Europeans are consistent in their moral grandstanding. For sure mass immigration from illiberal non-Western societies will cause damage to the cultural fabric of Europe and cause strain on the welfare systems, but at least you consistently apply your moral standards to yourself and not just America and Israel when it's convenient. That is admirable.
- zerr 11y ago
  > mass immigration from illiberal non-Western societies will cause damage to the cultural fabric of Europe .... That's not necessarily truth. In fact, most of immigrants are escaping from those illiberal societies. They want to have an European lifestyle. Become musicians, artists, engineers, etc... These kind of fresh workforce, who know what is it to live in poverty are actually much better at work and contribute more to the welfare system.
ciupicri 11y ago
What Europeans? Do you mean UK and France?
- zerr 11y ago
  Pretty much every European country: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_European_colonies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_European_coloni...
  - ciupicri 11y ago
    I think you meant some Western European countries. Because I don't see Slovenia, the Czech Republic, Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Poland, Ukraine, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and probably others on that list. And I definitely don't see Switzerland. Europe doesn't mean the European Union (founders).

paganel 11y ago

> European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. I'll pass over the casual xenophobia implicit in your post (just for you info, Lebanon has over 1 million Syrian refugees for a population of ~4.5 million, Jordan has ~600,000 refugees for a population of ~8 million), I just want to mention how the whole Middle East fuck-up is the result of the post-WW1 partitions, for which the UK and France are hugely responsible. I'll also copy-paste this from the wikipedia page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_involvement_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War#France_and_Britain https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_involvement_in_the_Syr...): > On 19 September 2013, French President François Hollande hinted that France was ready to begin supplying lethal aid to the Free Syrian Army during a press conference in Bamako in a "controlled framework". Hollande told the conference that "On delivering weapons we have always said that we want to control these supplies so that they do indeed go to the Free Syrian Army ... because they represent the Syrian National Coalition that we recognise as the legitimate representative of the Syrian people and today they are caught between a hammer and an anvil. The hammer is the air strikes and actions of the Syrian regime and the anvil is radical Islam. Two years later it turns out that the FSA is almost an empty shell (with the partial exception of the southern region around Daraa - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Southern_Syria_offensive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Southern_Syria_offensive), and the forces now fighting Assad in Syria are mostly Islamist, from Al Nusra (the local Al Qaeda branch) to the Islamic Front. So what Hollande was suggesting was something along the lines of "let's bomb Assad and help this other bad guys instead".

herge 11y ago
> the whole Middle East fuck-up is the result of the post-WW1 partitions Blaming everything on the Sykes-Picot agreement removes a lot of agency from the inhabitants of the Middle East, especially political movements like the rise of Baathism and pan-arabism. /r/BadHistory had a good post on this recently: https://www.reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/3j75b8/sykespicot_or_why_my_blood_pressure_spiked_at/ https://www.reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/3j75b8/sykespic...
- paganel 11y ago

musha68k 11y ago

We could all end up being dependent on the solidarity of others ourselves - it's all about love and understanding :) ️

erikb 11y ago

Actually Europe is very much responsible, only a small percentage flees to our countries and the reason is clear: People at least think that life in Europe is much better and in some cases they are correct. Please learn about the situation and not just judge it.

lexcorvus 11y ago
Life in Europe is better for now. Flood European countries with millions of "refugees" and it won't be for long. On the other hand, I sometimes say "If immigration is so great, why don't you take a foreign lodger into your house?" At least these "Refugees welcome" people are putting their flats where their mouths are.
ciupicri 11y ago
Why is Europe very much responsible? Also, please define Europe to avoid any confusion with the European Union or Western Europe.
- programmernews3 11y ago
  They want free stuff so they travel to the places that give them the most free stuff.

turk- 11y ago

This completely false. Five countries neighboring Syria - Lebanon, Jordan, Turkey, Iraq and Egypt - host 97% of the refugees. Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan have taken in 3 million refugees. Egypt and Iraq have another 200,000 are much poorer than Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan and have taken in 200,000 which is more than all of Europe combined. Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and UAE refuse to take in refugees in large numbers. They are also known for horrible human rights abuses. It would be foolish to attempt to go to these countries as a refugee.

clarus 11y ago
candl does not talk about neighbouring countries but about the Golf countries, so he is right.

AngrySkillzz 11y ago

Implying that they'd fit right in because they're brown and Muslim is some seriously ignorant shit. Remember all the ethnic tensions in Europe, in the Balkans? And religious tensions, even between different sects of Christianity? To imply that doesn't exist in other cultures is to attribute complexities to your own race and deny that they exist elsewhere. Ignorant.

binarray2000 11y ago

>>> It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, etc... Same culture, same religion and they are much closer! Some of the "alternative" countries you mention are direct supporters of the forces who have caused or are themselves involved in wars in countries from where refugees come. And despite "same" culture, "same" religion and proximity, I assume, these countries don't want to import social and financial problems. >>> It also amazes me why the EU leaders insist for other European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. As for EU countries not being responsible: UK, France and Germany (and other EU and non-EU NATO member countries in their tow) are very well directly involved and responsible. Political destabilization, intelligence services involvement, boots on the ground, flying aeroplanes and drones (and dropping bombs) over their heads, supporting local "rebel" forces. In Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen - they are all over the place. So, it's "natural" that the "weapons of mass immigration" are heading towards EU. >>> Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness and they build fences on their borders because they know what this might lead to. No, European "leaders" are not stupid for building fences. OK, they are... because by building fences they are dealing with the effect and not solving the cause. They are stupid for making themselves marionettes to the Oligarchy. For letting their countries become vassal states. Especially funny, all ex Warsaw-bloc countries, in pursuit of "freedom", have flocked in the arms of another tyrant (instead of trying being truly independent). Last but not least, they are stupid for not building good trans Atlantic ships and sending the refugees to the Oligarchy.

rbehrends 11y ago

> It "amazes" me why these "refugees" flock to Germany or Great Britain and not to their very wealthy brethren in countries such as Kuwaii, Egypt, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, etc... Out of these countries, only Egypt is even a signatory to the Refugee Convention and its Protocol. All of these countries range from "questionable human rights status" to "fascist theocracy". More importantly, most Syrian refugees are in Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan, and Iraq, all of which are already overflowing (Turkey alone has close to two million refugees). They are fleeing to closer countries, but these countries are already operating beyond capacity. > Same culture, same religion and they are much closer! Watch this video of Damascus college students before the war: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbM4trP42NY&sns=em https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbM4trP42NY&sns=em How much do you think they have in common with the culture of Saudi Arabia? > It also amazes me why the EU leaders insist for other European countries to accept these "refugees" when the majority of EU countries is not responsible for this situation at all. The underlying reason here is Dublin III. According to the Dublin Regulation, asylum seekers are to be processed in the country where they enter the EU [1]. Right now, this means that Greece, Hungary, Italy, and Spain. You see the problem? Now, Sweden, Austria, and Germany are helping out despite Dublin. Finally, it doesn't matter who is responsible. The EU member states are bound by treaty and customary international law to deal with refugees on its territory; the principle of non-refoulement prevents them from sending refugees back into danger. And yes, it would still be nice if the countries that helped create that mess also helped out with the refugees. As it pertains to Syria and Iraq, that would be in particular the members of the "coalition of the willing"; Daesh arose out of the ashes of Saddam's military [2]. > Luckily there are some leaders out there that are not afraid of this stupid political correctness and they build fences on their borders because they know what this might lead to. It's pretty hard to build a fence in the middle of the sea. [1] The Dublin Regulation also is intended to support the countries of entry through various means, but was designed for a much smaller number of asylum seekers. [2] http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/iraq-war-on-terror/rise-of-isis/how-saddams-former-soldiers-are-fueling-the-rise-of-isis/ http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/iraq-war-on-terror/r...

mmosta 11y ago

RE: Egypt There are upwards of 130,000 registered Syrian refugees alone in Egypt [0], in addition to those from Sudan and Somalia. Unofficial estimates place the number much higher [1]. Absolutely no one chooses to become a refugee and its the epitome of privilege to pontificate about where they should go. They go anywhere they can that isn't here and "culture" plays absolutely no part because it isn't a vacation. In fact, geographic proximity and regional support systems are the most important thing [3]. "European" countries don't even clock in top 5. [0] http://data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/country.php?id=8 http://data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/country.php?id=8 [1] https://egyptianfoundation.wordpress.com/welcome/refugees-in-egypt/ https://egyptianfoundation.wordpress.com/welcome/refugees-in... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_W...

noobie 11y ago

You just went full retard.