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Either way, is really the best solution that women create their own hacker spaces where they can avoid the guys? Surely interacting with your fellow human being
by semi-extrinsic 11y ago
Either way, is really the best solution that women create their own hacker spaces where they can avoid the guys? Surely interacting with your fellow human beings and letting them know how you feel is a better solution?
Now, I come from a European country, where things like wolf-whistling at a pretty woman on the street is an unthinkable act for a sane, sober man. And I sincerely believe that increasing, not reducing, the interactions between girls and boys, men and women, is the key to reducing gender inequality.
- zem 11y agoi see no problem with their wanting to start their own hackerspace. in fact, it seems to fit will into the hacker mentality of "don't waste time working with a broken system; go build your own good one from scratch". if it gets applauded when elon musk does it, why not when liz henry does it too?
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- semi-extrinsic 11y agoFor sure I agree that the "ignore the noise and do your own thing" is valid if all you want is to hack on stuff. But I understand feminists (in general) as working towards changing society for the better, and I fail to see how isolationism accomplishes that. Historical analogy: do you want to go the Booker T. Washington route, and hope that there will be a Martin Luther King later on? Or do you go the MLK route straight away?
- zem 11y agoit's not isolationism, it's providing a welcoming space for people who have historically lacked one, and ensuring that they are in the majority there. that is absolutely one way to change society for the better. can you think of a way to have a free-for-all hackerspace where women are in the majority? because the dynamics are very different if you are not.
- lizzard 11y agoI agree with this, it was a good experience to help start a new space with a new approach, AND still love and support the other (any-gender) hackerspace I've been involved with! It doesn't really have to be a dichotomy - in fact the SF Bay Area has quite a lot of maker/hacker spaces!
- Fomite 11y ago"where things like wolf-whistling at a pretty woman on the street is an unthinkable act for a sane, sober man." This does not mirror my experience of Europe even a little.
- DanBC 11y agoEurope has about 50 different countries. How many did you visit?
- Fomite 11y agoA non-trivial minority. But since the parent post didn't specify either, whose to know.
- semi-extrinsic 11y agoShould've said north/west Europe. I gather such behaviour is more common in mediterranean countries.
- Fomite 11y agoHumorously enough, my non-trivial minority of Europe is concentrated in the north and west.
- troels 11y agoA European country != Europe.
- Fomite 11y agoTrue, but without specifying, the original poster is also trying to cover "Europe" in his statement.
- troels 11y agoA european country can either mean "a specific, unnamed country in europe" or "any one country in europe". From the context, I infer the poster meant the former. But yeah - now we're just picking nit, really.
- rayiner 11y agoMaybe. After all, there are studies that show that girls do better in gender-segregated schools.
- kaitai 11y agoRead the comments here: lots of guys are very frustrated about women interacting with their fellow human beings and letting them know how they feel. Sometimes it's just less tiring to work on the hacking without having to do the interacting and talking about feelings.