5 ms·

I believe that very recent human evolution is favoring the abandonment of critical thinking. As N generation increases, Wisdom of the crowd decreases. There i

I believe that very recent human evolution is favoring the abandonment of critical thinking. As N generation increases, Wisdom of the crowd decreases. There is also evidence that ""educated"" people have been outbred by ""uneducated"" people in the western world recently [0][1] [0] https://edge.org/response-detail/23788 https://edge.org/response-detail/23788 [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_and_intelligence https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_and_intelligence Education, and IQ aside, which I find both rather primitive measures (one is credentialist and the other is biased) - there is a Cost-Benefit analysis involved in the decision to have children, that many are not participating in to begin with. I find the above two links incorrect in that _education_ or _IQ_in_general_ can be true measures of "real" intelligence. however, their argument still stands. The point I'm getting at is Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N > Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N+1, during and after the modern age. NB: these are just my beliefs. I also find that IQ is not the most reliable measure for intelligence, given Flynn effects, given the biased nature in testing itself, and given more recent cognitive psychologies understanding of differing "realms" of intelligence.

pooper 11y ago
> There is also evidence that ""educated"" people have been outbred by ""uneducated"" people in the western world recently Well, yeah. Decision to have kids is not rational. Decision to have a LOT of kids (an old coworker has 10) ipmay even be accompanied by religious delusions or some misguided notion that one has a lineage to protect. I think we should not incentivize people to have children. No tax break per dependent. No tax break for saving towards your children's college. Basically, the only people who have kids should be people willing to take responsibility. Of course, we need to step up ways we take care of young people but it is the relationship between a society (through government I guess) and a young person. For example, easy, free of cost access to health care, easy, free of cost access to education, nutritious meals dad in school, and so on but no incentives for parents to have kids. > The point I'm getting at is Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N > Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N+1, during and after the modern age. I feel like this belief is similar to my previous ideas of a glorious past, almost a heaven we got handed down but were unable to keep up. We are looking at the past with Rose colored glasses. I mean surely the average man today is not as smart as Plato was has a mind to think in scientific processes as Lavoisier did. Now, I have to be careful of making a bad assumption that a newer generation is always wiser but I think I can safely say the newer generation has the benefit of hindsight. Basically what I'm saying is while there seems to be a trend of decline, it might actually be a trend of enlightenment overall and we just see the top declining while we might not see all boats slowly rising.
- TeMPOraL 11y ago
  > I think we should not incentivize people to have children. It's not that simple. If your people won't breed, your civilization will die out, along with all its values, culture and legacy. That is, if it doesn't get conquered by another civilization before. Incentivizing "wrong" people to breed may be a danger, but disincentivizing everyone is even more dangerous.
  - newjersey 11y ago
    > If your people won't breed, your civilization will die out, along with all its values, culture and legacy. Does it matter in the long run? All civilizations eventually die out. If it doesn't matter in the long run, why does it matter in the short term? Let's not pretend like we care about future generations. Clearly, the baby boomers don't care about what they have done to our generation. No offense but when people talk about culture, legacy,and pride all I hear is "keep grinding and don't stop to think for yourself, peasant". I doubt the glorious Roman empire or the Egyptian empire were worth anything to ordinary folks living at that time
    - iofj 11y ago
      The alternative is the misery of completely unsupported subsistence farming.
    - TeMPOraL 11y ago
      > Does it matter in the long run? All civilizations eventually die out. Does anything matter in the long run? Everything will eventually die out, universe included. > Let's not pretend like we care about future generations. Well, I honestly do. > I doubt the glorious Roman empire or the Egyptian empire were worth anything to ordinary folks living at that time I don't know about Romans or Egyptians, but as an ordinary low-to-middle-class citizen of a developing country I like it in here. Yes, the western civilization has a lot of bad aspects. But I like the stability we have, the progress we've been making. I want my children to live in an even better world, where various disabilities can be cured through the advancements in medicine, where people have some, if limited, time for intellectual pursuits, where there is a base on the Mars. Where people can believe in whatever god they want, or none at all, and generally don't kill each other over it. So I apologize if I'm being too protective of the civilization I live in, but I like it and I want it to continue. For myself, my children and their children, and every other human too.

pooper 11y ago

> There is also evidence that ""educated"" people have been outbred by ""uneducated"" people in the western world recently Well, yeah. Decision to have kids is not rational. Decision to have a LOT of kids (an old coworker has 10) ipmay even be accompanied by religious delusions or some misguided notion that one has a lineage to protect. I think we should not incentivize people to have children. No tax break per dependent. No tax break for saving towards your children's college. Basically, the only people who have kids should be people willing to take responsibility. Of course, we need to step up ways we take care of young people but it is the relationship between a society (through government I guess) and a young person. For example, easy, free of cost access to health care, easy, free of cost access to education, nutritious meals dad in school, and so on but no incentives for parents to have kids. > The point I'm getting at is Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N > Wisdom of any given mob in Generation N+1, during and after the modern age. I feel like this belief is similar to my previous ideas of a glorious past, almost a heaven we got handed down but were unable to keep up. We are looking at the past with Rose colored glasses. I mean surely the average man today is not as smart as Plato was has a mind to think in scientific processes as Lavoisier did. Now, I have to be careful of making a bad assumption that a newer generation is always wiser but I think I can safely say the newer generation has the benefit of hindsight. Basically what I'm saying is while there seems to be a trend of decline, it might actually be a trend of enlightenment overall and we just see the top declining while we might not see all boats slowly rising.

TeMPOraL 11y ago
> I think we should not incentivize people to have children. It's not that simple. If your people won't breed, your civilization will die out, along with all its values, culture and legacy. That is, if it doesn't get conquered by another civilization before. Incentivizing "wrong" people to breed may be a danger, but disincentivizing everyone is even more dangerous.
- newjersey 11y ago
  > If your people won't breed, your civilization will die out, along with all its values, culture and legacy. Does it matter in the long run? All civilizations eventually die out. If it doesn't matter in the long run, why does it matter in the short term? Let's not pretend like we care about future generations. Clearly, the baby boomers don't care about what they have done to our generation. No offense but when people talk about culture, legacy,and pride all I hear is "keep grinding and don't stop to think for yourself, peasant". I doubt the glorious Roman empire or the Egyptian empire were worth anything to ordinary folks living at that time
  - iofj 11y ago
    The alternative is the misery of completely unsupported subsistence farming.
  - TeMPOraL 11y ago
    > Does it matter in the long run? All civilizations eventually die out. Does anything matter in the long run? Everything will eventually die out, universe included. > Let's not pretend like we care about future generations. Well, I honestly do. > I doubt the glorious Roman empire or the Egyptian empire were worth anything to ordinary folks living at that time I don't know about Romans or Egyptians, but as an ordinary low-to-middle-class citizen of a developing country I like it in here. Yes, the western civilization has a lot of bad aspects. But I like the stability we have, the progress we've been making. I want my children to live in an even better world, where various disabilities can be cured through the advancements in medicine, where people have some, if limited, time for intellectual pursuits, where there is a base on the Mars. Where people can believe in whatever god they want, or none at all, and generally don't kill each other over it. So I apologize if I'm being too protective of the civilization I live in, but I like it and I want it to continue. For myself, my children and their children, and every other human too.