4 ms·

Since we are on the subject of brain, does anyone know of a good article on how memory is stored and retrieved? I am always intrigued by the biologics of it ...

by qCOVET 11y ago

Since we are on the subject of brain, does anyone know of a good article on how memory is stored and retrieved? I am always intrigued by the biologics of it ... if its purely electrical, how are these charges stored and isolated away from the rest of neuronal activity ... alternatively, what if life has chosen some bizarre quaternary structure of DNA to store the memory ...

pugio 11y ago
It's not very well understood yet, but one of my favorite layman pieces on recent research is at: http://www.wired.com/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/ http://www.wired.com/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/ Somewhat tangentially (but I can't resist), this excellent story by Ted Chiang explores the transience of memory, and the role technology might play in sustaining it: https://subterraneanpress.com/magazine/fall_2013/the_truth_of_fact_the_truth_of_feeling_by_ted_chiang https://subterraneanpress.com/magazine/fall_2013/the_truth_o...
- qCOVET 11y ago
  Thank you ...
lqdc13 11y ago
There's this recent review: http://w3.arizona.edu/~tigger/assets/documents/Nadel-etal%20(2012).pdf http://w3.arizona.edu/~tigger/assets/documents/Nadel-etal%20... But whenever I read these, I always think they might be getting it largely wrong. In fact, they themselves admit to it being partially speculative information. I am by no means an expert, but I was neuroscience major in undergrad, and back then (~5-7 years ago) it wasn't known exactly for sure how it works besides the fact that a part of hippocampus interacts with other parts of the brain and that certain things are reinforced with more learning. Most of the well known and still relevant studies in the field look at people that have a particular part of the brain damaged and how it affected them. Obviously, there aren't too many of such patients. There are also studies in mice and other animals, but their brains work differently sometimes and other times there are a lot of unrelated variables. To give you an idea of where the field was a few years ago: I was a research assistant in a neuro-psych lab and we were giving animals drugs in large amounts and then checking whether the cells in a specific region of the brain are damaged. If the CA1 area of hipoccampus was damaged, we could say that it potentially affects memory formation. That was checked by the ability of a rat to solve puzzles it previously solved. Very crude, unfortunately.
- darkmighty 11y ago
  Aren't there any working 'survey' models of different functions of the brain trying to integrate those findings?
seiji 11y ago
We do know some of these things. Brains don't store "knowledge" like SSDs by capturing discrete electrons then poking them to read the stored data. Brains encode data physically as the arrangement of synapses between neurons. Brain's aren't just electrical—they are electrochemical. Important point: knowledge/memory is stored as synapse configurations, not by shoving information inside neurons themselves. As for suggesting "bizarre quaternary structure of DNA to store the memory ..." that's probably more for wishful new age crystal healing websites than anything based in reality. Back to your original query: let's not forget The Source Of All Knowledge happily fields such questions: https://www.google.com/search?q=a+good+article+on+how+memory+is+stored+and+retrieved https://www.google.com/search?q=a+good+article+on+how+memory...
Shinkei 11y ago
I wish I could share the stuff behind the paywall, but memory is a very interesting question in Neuroscience. I am a neuroradiologist and I still learn about truly incredible phenomena that challenge my preconceived notions about how the brain functions. For example, we had a case recently of "transient global amnesia" and although initially we thought the MRI was normal... more careful review showed a tiny infarct in the hippocampus, a structure critical in memory. Here's a paper behind the paywall discussing a similar case report: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15746236 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15746236 Or consider the fact that the cerebellum is a lot more crucial in global brain function than was previously taught. It's really exciting, cutting-edge work: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebellar_cognitive_affective_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebellar_cognitive_affective...
smcl 11y ago
Radiolab - which Oliver Sacks frequently appeared on - has a good piece on Memory: http://www.radiolab.org/story/91569-memory-and-forgetting/ http://www.radiolab.org/story/91569-memory-and-forgetting/
mirimir 11y ago
The human genome is ~700MB.[0] Even if 75% of that is noise, there's not much capacity for memory. But with CRISPR, one could store a few keys and passphrases ;) Eventually, maybe add a storage organelle. [0] https://medium.com/precision-medicine/how-big-is-the-human-genome-e90caa3409b0 https://medium.com/precision-medicine/how-big-is-the-human-g...

by qCOVET 11y ago

pugio 11y ago

It's not very well understood yet, but one of my favorite layman pieces on recent research is at: http://www.wired.com/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/ http://www.wired.com/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/ Somewhat tangentially (but I can't resist), this excellent story by Ted Chiang explores the transience of memory, and the role technology might play in sustaining it: https://subterraneanpress.com/magazine/fall_2013/the_truth_of_fact_the_truth_of_feeling_by_ted_chiang https://subterraneanpress.com/magazine/fall_2013/the_truth_o...

qCOVET 11y ago
Thank you ...

lqdc13 11y ago

There's this recent review: http://w3.arizona.edu/~tigger/assets/documents/Nadel-etal%20(2012).pdf http://w3.arizona.edu/~tigger/assets/documents/Nadel-etal%20... But whenever I read these, I always think they might be getting it largely wrong. In fact, they themselves admit to it being partially speculative information. I am by no means an expert, but I was neuroscience major in undergrad, and back then (~5-7 years ago) it wasn't known exactly for sure how it works besides the fact that a part of hippocampus interacts with other parts of the brain and that certain things are reinforced with more learning. Most of the well known and still relevant studies in the field look at people that have a particular part of the brain damaged and how it affected them. Obviously, there aren't too many of such patients. There are also studies in mice and other animals, but their brains work differently sometimes and other times there are a lot of unrelated variables. To give you an idea of where the field was a few years ago: I was a research assistant in a neuro-psych lab and we were giving animals drugs in large amounts and then checking whether the cells in a specific region of the brain are damaged. If the CA1 area of hipoccampus was damaged, we could say that it potentially affects memory formation. That was checked by the ability of a rat to solve puzzles it previously solved. Very crude, unfortunately.

darkmighty 11y ago
Aren't there any working 'survey' models of different functions of the brain trying to integrate those findings?

seiji 11y ago

We do know some of these things. Brains don't store "knowledge" like SSDs by capturing discrete electrons then poking them to read the stored data. Brains encode data physically as the arrangement of synapses between neurons. Brain's aren't just electrical—they are electrochemical. Important point: knowledge/memory is stored as synapse configurations, not by shoving information inside neurons themselves. As for suggesting "bizarre quaternary structure of DNA to store the memory ..." that's probably more for wishful new age crystal healing websites than anything based in reality. Back to your original query: let's not forget The Source Of All Knowledge happily fields such questions: https://www.google.com/search?q=a+good+article+on+how+memory+is+stored+and+retrieved https://www.google.com/search?q=a+good+article+on+how+memory...

Shinkei 11y ago

I wish I could share the stuff behind the paywall, but memory is a very interesting question in Neuroscience. I am a neuroradiologist and I still learn about truly incredible phenomena that challenge my preconceived notions about how the brain functions. For example, we had a case recently of "transient global amnesia" and although initially we thought the MRI was normal... more careful review showed a tiny infarct in the hippocampus, a structure critical in memory. Here's a paper behind the paywall discussing a similar case report: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15746236 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15746236 Or consider the fact that the cerebellum is a lot more crucial in global brain function than was previously taught. It's really exciting, cutting-edge work: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebellar_cognitive_affective_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebellar_cognitive_affective...

smcl 11y ago

Radiolab - which Oliver Sacks frequently appeared on - has a good piece on Memory: http://www.radiolab.org/story/91569-memory-and-forgetting/ http://www.radiolab.org/story/91569-memory-and-forgetting/

mirimir 11y ago

The human genome is ~700MB.[0] Even if 75% of that is noise, there's not much capacity for memory. But with CRISPR, one could store a few keys and passphrases ;) Eventually, maybe add a storage organelle. [0] https://medium.com/precision-medicine/how-big-is-the-human-genome-e90caa3409b0 https://medium.com/precision-medicine/how-big-is-the-human-g...