5 ms·

Why I’m Not Looking to Hire Computer-Science Majors

10 points by somerandomness 11y ago

mathias_awkward 11y ago
Is it me or is that signup/premium only content? :s
- alialkhatib 11y ago
  If you Google(/Bing) the title and click on the wsj link from the search results, you can circumvent the paywall. I'd give a link, but I'm not sure that's okay (also, the procedure is just tedious, not complicated).
- thespace12 11y ago
  WSJ has the worst website on the Internet.
- pnt12 11y ago
  Fetched the text with Inoreader (RSS app) and it worked fine.
rayiner 11y ago
College isn't supposed to teach young developers skills. It's supposed to teach them how to acquire skills. You're supposed to teach them skills.
- shawndrost 11y ago
  That is the status quo. Is it a good system design? It seems to result in poor performance (hard for smaller employers to hire fresh college grads, since they haven't built an internal finishing school) and shoddy, duplicated effort (every major employer eventually constructs an ad-hoc finishing school for college grads).
- honest_joe 11y ago
  Except in capitalism no. You are not obliged to give anybody anything for free.
bhewes 11y ago
If one cannot pay market rate for developers maybe the startup is not viable.
semerda 11y ago
What an awful article. "colleges doing such a rotten job of teaching them skills."? right, this is why Google and Facebook nick those with a Computer Science degree and pay them bucket loads of money. Try getting into those companies without a degree lol The author goes on complaining that iPhone and Android development is missing in computer science departments. Right, problems are solved using an app rolls eyes. Computer Science is "Foundations". Language and Tools change daily but foundations rarely.. think algorithms, data structures etc.. this is what these degrees teach and how to apply them to solve problems. Yes it's fkin hard and takes years of practice to be good at it. But this is what makes Computer Science/Engineering majors a hot commodity!
willstepp 11y ago
I come to this as a self-taught programmer and I think like most Ford-Chevy arguments the reality is somewhere in between. After working as a professional software developer for eight years on desktop apps, web apps, and mobile apps, I can see there are places where having a foundation in computer science could absolutely improve quality of my work, mainly algorithms and data structures, but also higher level subjects like OS and database architecture, security...etc. And I also think CompSci folks would do well to work on a personal software project on nights and weekends and see it through to release and get actual people to use what you wrote. There's so much valuable experience that comes from that process that can never be learned in a classroom, or even from most jobs to be honest.
- semerda 11y ago
  I think the CompSci folks that are dissatisfied with their employer and are comfortable with their skills are already doing stuff on the side. Today, sharpening your skills & earning extra $$$ through side projects is a no brainer. The wealth of online how-to articles and distribution channels has lowered the barriers to entry. Of course if one is well looked after their employer financially and personally then there is really no need to do this. Makes you wonder why so many people out there are dissatisfied with their employers eh ;-)
mto 11y ago
Just the usual "omg we need someone for angular/jboss2.34/.net4.3/... We don't care about compilers, logic, theory bla. Because development in the industry is becoming as superficial as tinder in dating. Just riding the current hype train. So we could just throw all our background knowledge out of the window and just teach placing buttons and form fields in angular hybrid apps, right? I also find the trend of everyone having to do side projects on github pretty weird. No one of my professional friends in other fields would do something like that. Because you might think that what you do professionally is worth more than your hobby stuff. Personally, after a typical work day, in the evening my back and my eyes hurt and I also want to enjoy family, dog, nature or just sleep. I do read a lot of technical stuff or watch coursera or udacity. But even more t-rexing?
- pnt12 11y ago
  I agree. As the author says, the development scene is always changing. Maybe that's a reason to teach generic concept skills and concepts instead of current techology. iOS and android development may be totally diffrent in 5 years, for example.
zallen 11y ago
This guy has just got daddy issues: his father is a CS prof at Yale. (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gelernter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gelernter, mention of his son as this guy: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203833104577072162782422558 http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB100014240529702038331045770721...)

Is it me or is that signup/premium only content? :s

alialkhatib 11y ago
If you Google(/Bing) the title and click on the wsj link from the search results, you can circumvent the paywall. I'd give a link, but I'm not sure that's okay (also, the procedure is just tedious, not complicated).
thespace12 11y ago
WSJ has the worst website on the Internet.
pnt12 11y ago
Fetched the text with Inoreader (RSS app) and it worked fine.

College isn't supposed to teach young developers skills. It's supposed to teach them how to acquire skills. You're supposed to teach them skills.

shawndrost 11y ago
That is the status quo. Is it a good system design? It seems to result in poor performance (hard for smaller employers to hire fresh college grads, since they haven't built an internal finishing school) and shoddy, duplicated effort (every major employer eventually constructs an ad-hoc finishing school for college grads).
honest_joe 11y ago
Except in capitalism no. You are not obliged to give anybody anything for free.

bhewes 11y ago

If one cannot pay market rate for developers maybe the startup is not viable.

semerda 11y ago

What an awful article. "colleges doing such a rotten job of teaching them skills."? right, this is why Google and Facebook nick those with a Computer Science degree and pay them bucket loads of money. Try getting into those companies without a degree lol The author goes on complaining that iPhone and Android development is missing in computer science departments. Right, problems are solved using an app rolls eyes. Computer Science is "Foundations". Language and Tools change daily but foundations rarely.. think algorithms, data structures etc.. this is what these degrees teach and how to apply them to solve problems. Yes it's fkin hard and takes years of practice to be good at it. But this is what makes Computer Science/Engineering majors a hot commodity!

willstepp 11y ago

I come to this as a self-taught programmer and I think like most Ford-Chevy arguments the reality is somewhere in between. After working as a professional software developer for eight years on desktop apps, web apps, and mobile apps, I can see there are places where having a foundation in computer science could absolutely improve quality of my work, mainly algorithms and data structures, but also higher level subjects like OS and database architecture, security...etc. And I also think CompSci folks would do well to work on a personal software project on nights and weekends and see it through to release and get actual people to use what you wrote. There's so much valuable experience that comes from that process that can never be learned in a classroom, or even from most jobs to be honest.

semerda 11y ago
I think the CompSci folks that are dissatisfied with their employer and are comfortable with their skills are already doing stuff on the side. Today, sharpening your skills & earning extra $$$ through side projects is a no brainer. The wealth of online how-to articles and distribution channels has lowered the barriers to entry. Of course if one is well looked after their employer financially and personally then there is really no need to do this. Makes you wonder why so many people out there are dissatisfied with their employers eh ;-)

mto 11y ago

Just the usual "omg we need someone for angular/jboss2.34/.net4.3/... We don't care about compilers, logic, theory bla. Because development in the industry is becoming as superficial as tinder in dating. Just riding the current hype train. So we could just throw all our background knowledge out of the window and just teach placing buttons and form fields in angular hybrid apps, right? I also find the trend of everyone having to do side projects on github pretty weird. No one of my professional friends in other fields would do something like that. Because you might think that what you do professionally is worth more than your hobby stuff. Personally, after a typical work day, in the evening my back and my eyes hurt and I also want to enjoy family, dog, nature or just sleep. I do read a lot of technical stuff or watch coursera or udacity. But even more t-rexing?

pnt12 11y ago
I agree. As the author says, the development scene is always changing. Maybe that's a reason to teach generic concept skills and concepts instead of current techology. iOS and android development may be totally diffrent in 5 years, for example.

zallen 11y ago

This guy has just got daddy issues: his father is a CS prof at Yale. (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gelernter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gelernter, mention of his son as this guy: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203833104577072162782422558 http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB100014240529702038331045770721...)