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From page 3: > "NSA may access it only after demonstrating to the FISC that a 'reaonable articulable suspicion' that a particular phone number is associated wi

From page 3: > "NSA may access it only after demonstrating to the FISC that a 'reaonable articulable suspicion' that a particular phone number is associated with a foreign terrorist organization'". Shouldn't this say "associated with a foreign terrorist organisation, or the UN"? http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/17/un-att-nsa-spy-headquarters-privacy http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/17/un-att-nsa-spy-...

Roodgorf 11y ago
I'm sure you could find a few people in the U.S. that would consider the U.N. a foreign terrorist organisation.
- sliverstorm 11y ago
  I know more than a few U.S. citizens who consider the U.S. Government a foreign terrorist organization. So yes, I believe you.
mtgx 11y ago
And I thought the NSA wasn't supposed to lie. When it says "only used to track a terrorist organization" or whatever, they are essentially lying. At the very least they should use words such as "and for other purposes". But this is what we get when Clapper gets to lie and nothing happens to him (or when no one ever gets punished for abuses). The criminality of the system continues and expands - because why wouldn't it?
- sillygeese 11y ago
  Yes, the system is working very much as intended: http://popehat.com/2013/12/23/burn-the-fucking-system-to-the-ground/ http://popehat.com/2013/12/23/burn-the-fucking-system-to-the... If governments were actually useful to us, they wouldn't have to take our money by force. We'd be happy to pay for their services voluntarily. That tells you everything you need to know about the system's nature.
  - afarrell 11y ago
    We already live in an anarcho-capitalist society. It's just that in the U.S., there is a government that has managed to convince most of the others in the area to acquiesce to it. Those few alternate governments that do arise aren't able to convince the U.S. Government and its subsidiaries to choose a different arbitrator than the ones they currently go to. If you can explain how to construct an Anarcho-capitalist society that somehow prevented a sufficiently militarily strong government from deciding not try to dominate or collude with all other governments operating in its territory, I would love to hear it.
    - sillygeese 11y ago
      No thanks, I don't want to play your games.
  - jmckib 11y ago
    > If governments were actually useful to us, they wouldn't have to take our money by force. We'd be happy to pay for their services voluntarily. Not always, take a look at tragedy of the commons: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

Roodgorf 11y ago

I'm sure you could find a few people in the U.S. that would consider the U.N. a foreign terrorist organisation.

sliverstorm 11y ago
I know more than a few U.S. citizens who consider the U.S. Government a foreign terrorist organization. So yes, I believe you.

mtgx 11y ago

And I thought the NSA wasn't supposed to lie. When it says "only used to track a terrorist organization" or whatever, they are essentially lying. At the very least they should use words such as "and for other purposes". But this is what we get when Clapper gets to lie and nothing happens to him (or when no one ever gets punished for abuses). The criminality of the system continues and expands - because why wouldn't it?

sillygeese 11y ago
Yes, the system is working very much as intended: http://popehat.com/2013/12/23/burn-the-fucking-system-to-the-ground/ http://popehat.com/2013/12/23/burn-the-fucking-system-to-the... If governments were actually useful to us, they wouldn't have to take our money by force. We'd be happy to pay for their services voluntarily. That tells you everything you need to know about the system's nature.
- afarrell 11y ago
  We already live in an anarcho-capitalist society. It's just that in the U.S., there is a government that has managed to convince most of the others in the area to acquiesce to it. Those few alternate governments that do arise aren't able to convince the U.S. Government and its subsidiaries to choose a different arbitrator than the ones they currently go to. If you can explain how to construct an Anarcho-capitalist society that somehow prevented a sufficiently militarily strong government from deciding not try to dominate or collude with all other governments operating in its territory, I would love to hear it.
  - sillygeese 11y ago
    No thanks, I don't want to play your games.
- jmckib 11y ago
  > If governments were actually useful to us, they wouldn't have to take our money by force. We'd be happy to pay for their services voluntarily. Not always, take a look at tragedy of the commons: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons