7 ms·

Which is why I'll take the Tesla every single time.

tptacek 11y ago
I mean, there are also tons of shitty American cars you could have bought to get better 0-60 times for the dollar. The point is there are other metrics than 0-60, and in fact 0-60 is --- at least within a given bracket of cars --- a pretty cheap metric to optimize.
- dragontamer 11y ago
  I'm a fan of "fastest Laguna Seca Lap". But I know a bunch of "American Muscle" guys who only care about 0-60. But I prefer statistics that include a combination of good turns, tight handling, AND strong acceleration. Tesla performs horribly on Laguna Lap, but so do all the American Muscle cars. You basically need a low-weight car with high acceleration to do well. Other raceway times are also interesting. But that's what I look for in high-performance cars.
  - bri3d 11y ago
    The problem with lap times is that they're really an OEM tire shootout and not a car comparison. Plus, most factory touring cars are aligned for even tire wear and understeer. With most cars you could probably manipulate lap times by several percent just by adding front camber.
  - sp332 11y ago
    The list, if anyone's looking for it http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - aidenn0 11y ago
      I'm surprised to see the Viper in several spots in the top 10. I think of it as more of a muscle car than as known for handling well.
      - sp332 11y ago
        According to comments here http://fastestlaps.com/cars/dodge_viper_srt-10_acr.html http://fastestlaps.com/cars/dodge_viper_srt-10_acr.html the massive rear spoiler is responsible for the improved handling of that model.
        aidenn0 11y ago
        The number 9 slot is listed as just an SRT though.
    - dragontamer 11y ago
      Thanks. That website also has links by car (to see how a particular car does across different racetracks). The Tesla P85D page is here: http://fastestlaps.com/cars/tesla_model_s_p85d.html http://fastestlaps.com/cars/tesla_model_s_p85d.html Not very many runs yet, but we can get a glimpse of how it is doing from the four tracks listed.
    - busted 11y ago
      I think it's funny that list has 2 different Porsche 911's (2001 & 2004) a few spots under a 2013 Ford Fiesta ST, and above that a Focus ST just above another 911 S.
      - dragontamer 11y ago
        The Ford Focus ST and Ford Fiesta ST are actually fun cars to drive. But its more for the "small and nimble" sort of thing as opposed to "American Muscle". They take very tight corners. I'd imagine that the turn-intensive tracks would be where these smaller cars would do better. Their acceleration leaves a bit to be desired (but what do you expect for $25k?). 0-60 in 6.3 seconds is still reasonably sporty. Fiesta is too small for my tastes, but I did go with a Focus (non-ST... just normal stock Focus) for my vehicle. For a manual vehicle, its perfectly fine. From 4000 through 6500 RPM, you can definitely feel the little engine work. Turbo must kick in or something. --------- In any case, its amusing to see "just" the ST models do decently on these tracks. After all, people who actually want performance go for the RS model.
kylec 11y ago
The P85D is, no question, stupendously fast 0-60. But is that really all you care about when driving a car? I recently was shopping for a performance car and the Tesla was never even a consideration because of all the other limitations (range, charging availability, etc). As something to show off with, the Tesla wows and amazes people. As a car to drive on a daily basis, I think it is too compromised.
- mikeash 11y ago
  Do you drive more than 250 miles in a day on a regular basis? When you do drive that far, do you do it on routes that aren't covered by Tesla's Supercharger network? As a daily driver, the Tesla is easier to deal with than a normal car. With a normal car, you have to worry about how much gas you have, when and where you'll stop to fill up, etc. My Model S is full in the morning every time. For trips that exceed the range available on a single charge you do have to think a little bit more. But for the vast majority of destinations, it's not hard. If you're going to be regularly driving to a place without adequate charging infrastructure then yes, the Tesla is not for you, but that's a relatively small number of people. When you say, "range, charging availability, etc." what does the "etc." refer to? I would not even put charging availability on that list. Range is a limitation for sure, although not a terribly bad one, but I can't think of anything else.
  - kylec 11y ago
    I live in Massachusetts, and I regularly visit my parents in Maine, which is about 270 miles away. There are no Superchargers along the route, at my parents' house, nor indeed anywhere in Maine. I also live in an apartment, and there is no electric car charging here, so I'd probably have to frequent the local Supercharger to keep it topped off. The "etc" covers things like not having physical controls for adjusting the climate and sound systems, as well as a generally substandard interior for a $100K car. Not dealbreakers per se, but factors that leaned me away from considering the car. I don't know if I'm in the minority here, maybe I am. Maybe most people own a house with a garage and never take road trips further than 250 miles (or own a second car with which to do so), but I'm not one of those people. I suspect, though, that there's more of us than you might think.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

I mean, there are also tons of shitty American cars you could have bought to get better 0-60 times for the dollar. The point is there are other metrics than 0-60, and in fact 0-60 is --- at least within a given bracket of cars --- a pretty cheap metric to optimize.

dragontamer 11y ago
I'm a fan of "fastest Laguna Seca Lap". But I know a bunch of "American Muscle" guys who only care about 0-60. But I prefer statistics that include a combination of good turns, tight handling, AND strong acceleration. Tesla performs horribly on Laguna Lap, but so do all the American Muscle cars. You basically need a low-weight car with high acceleration to do well. Other raceway times are also interesting. But that's what I look for in high-performance cars.
- bri3d 11y ago
  The problem with lap times is that they're really an OEM tire shootout and not a car comparison. Plus, most factory touring cars are aligned for even tire wear and understeer. With most cars you could probably manipulate lap times by several percent just by adding front camber.
- sp332 11y ago
  The list, if anyone's looking for it http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - aidenn0 11y ago
    I'm surprised to see the Viper in several spots in the top 10. I think of it as more of a muscle car than as known for handling well.
    - sp332 11y ago
      According to comments here http://fastestlaps.com/cars/dodge_viper_srt-10_acr.html http://fastestlaps.com/cars/dodge_viper_srt-10_acr.html the massive rear spoiler is responsible for the improved handling of that model.
      - aidenn0 11y ago
        The number 9 slot is listed as just an SRT though.
  - dragontamer 11y ago
    Thanks. That website also has links by car (to see how a particular car does across different racetracks). The Tesla P85D page is here: http://fastestlaps.com/cars/tesla_model_s_p85d.html http://fastestlaps.com/cars/tesla_model_s_p85d.html Not very many runs yet, but we can get a glimpse of how it is doing from the four tracks listed.
  - busted 11y ago
    I think it's funny that list has 2 different Porsche 911's (2001 & 2004) a few spots under a 2013 Ford Fiesta ST, and above that a Focus ST just above another 911 S.
    - dragontamer 11y ago
      The Ford Focus ST and Ford Fiesta ST are actually fun cars to drive. But its more for the "small and nimble" sort of thing as opposed to "American Muscle". They take very tight corners. I'd imagine that the turn-intensive tracks would be where these smaller cars would do better. Their acceleration leaves a bit to be desired (but what do you expect for $25k?). 0-60 in 6.3 seconds is still reasonably sporty. Fiesta is too small for my tastes, but I did go with a Focus (non-ST... just normal stock Focus) for my vehicle. For a manual vehicle, its perfectly fine. From 4000 through 6500 RPM, you can definitely feel the little engine work. Turbo must kick in or something. --------- In any case, its amusing to see "just" the ST models do decently on these tracks. After all, people who actually want performance go for the RS model.

kylec 11y ago

The P85D is, no question, stupendously fast 0-60. But is that really all you care about when driving a car? I recently was shopping for a performance car and the Tesla was never even a consideration because of all the other limitations (range, charging availability, etc). As something to show off with, the Tesla wows and amazes people. As a car to drive on a daily basis, I think it is too compromised.

mikeash 11y ago
Do you drive more than 250 miles in a day on a regular basis? When you do drive that far, do you do it on routes that aren't covered by Tesla's Supercharger network? As a daily driver, the Tesla is easier to deal with than a normal car. With a normal car, you have to worry about how much gas you have, when and where you'll stop to fill up, etc. My Model S is full in the morning every time. For trips that exceed the range available on a single charge you do have to think a little bit more. But for the vast majority of destinations, it's not hard. If you're going to be regularly driving to a place without adequate charging infrastructure then yes, the Tesla is not for you, but that's a relatively small number of people. When you say, "range, charging availability, etc." what does the "etc." refer to? I would not even put charging availability on that list. Range is a limitation for sure, although not a terribly bad one, but I can't think of anything else.
- kylec 11y ago
  I live in Massachusetts, and I regularly visit my parents in Maine, which is about 270 miles away. There are no Superchargers along the route, at my parents' house, nor indeed anywhere in Maine. I also live in an apartment, and there is no electric car charging here, so I'd probably have to frequent the local Supercharger to keep it topped off. The "etc" covers things like not having physical controls for adjusting the climate and sound systems, as well as a generally substandard interior for a $100K car. Not dealbreakers per se, but factors that leaned me away from considering the car. I don't know if I'm in the minority here, maybe I am. Maybe most people own a house with a garage and never take road trips further than 250 miles (or own a second car with which to do so), but I'm not one of those people. I suspect, though, that there's more of us than you might think.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]