4 ms·

Stripping Reddit From HackerNews With BOSS Mashup

27 points by mk 17y ago

dasil003 17y ago
Stripping Reddit from your life with /etc/hosts: 127.0.0.1 www.reddit.com
elblanco 17y ago
This makes front page after all those downvotes I received for commenting about essentially the same thing? Seriously? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011277 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011277
- blhack 17y ago
  What is the point of your comment here? It looks like you got downvoted in the other thread because you were whining about something irrelevant.
  - elblanco 17y ago
    Fine, I'll frame it in different language. warning meta-comment, queasy people that can't handle introspection should stop here There is a constant meta-discussion on HN, with HN being on top of course, that social news aggregation sites tend to devolve along the following lattice, HN->reddit->digg->4chan. Various signals are referenced that this is happening, typically in the form of people behaving outside of the established site or community guidelines. HN's guidelines for example state that this post http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 runs counter to the guideline: >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or disasters, or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. So not only was the post counter to guidelines and very clearly not a topical HN post, it was a repost, just a short while after appearing on reddit's main page. In addition, the title: > How do I know China wrecked the Copenhagen deal? I was in the room (while it is the original article title) blows threw at least half of the guidelines for submissions. I added the meta-comment http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 which was immediately downvoted to something like -5 at one point and all of my subsequent comments, even topically related and without violating any HN guidelines were immediately hammered. Some additional people responded to my meta-comment, all non-trollish, one guy is now +8 and another is enjoying time at 0. This is schizophrenic. The guidelines for voting on HN (at least at one time but I can't find any such guidelines anymore) clearly state(d) that upvotes should be for comments that create interesting discussions and should not be due to agreement with the poster. The converse should also be true, essentially, downvotes should be for trolls. But since I was meta-commenting, something that has been well documented and relatively cherished on this site as a way of maintaining quality and preventing the typical downtrend of other aggregator sites...my comments shouldn't have been downmodded to begin with. (I can almost guarantee that this comment will reach at least -3 at some point for example). To make it worse, the downmodders aren't actually providing any interesting commentary either, they don't even post a rebuke or a comment chastising me for violating some imagined HN guideline because they know that they have no grounds to do so and are only downvoting out of malice and disagreement. So, on the same day that I meta-commented that non-topical-HN posts that show up on reddit and immediately show up on HN right after that and then got my ass handed to me for pointing that out (of course with no commentary), an actual post regarding reddit->HN posting shows up and even offers a technical solution to solve this problem shows up not only on HN in the new bin, but on the front page near the top. So of course I meta-meta-meta-comment that this is rapidly becoming ridiculous. It's not the slide to reddit that the HN community should be worried about, it's the slide to schizophrenic insanity. There, so that's the topical explanation since the pithier ones didn't satisfy you. So as not to just complain about the problem, but to offer solutions: HN is a news agreegator, but more importantly it tries to drive interesting and informative discussion. I believe that the modding system as is creates an environment where the HN community is slowly moving towards an echo-chamber-like groupthink a la reddit or digg or some other aggregator. The reasons for this are actually relatively few and are largely addressed in guidelines, but otherwise ignored by the community at large: a. When people post otherwise interesting comments, their mod score is more a function of opinion popularity than a driver of further commentary. b. When scores for a comment are absurdly high (anything over +10 in my book), it drives people to also post comments that are similar. Since comments with high scores appear to be a function of popularity and not discussion drivers, those are the types of comments we are starting to see, and the responses tend to be not sources of discussion and debate but rather "yeah, that was a popular comment right there" followed by more upmods. c. When scores for a comment are absurdly low (anything below -3 in my book), it drives people to not want to post. Even if they might otherwise provide an interesting viewpoint that drives further discussion, even discussion in absolute disagreement with the OP. The result is that the only people who are posting are people that craft comments that fit the group-think popularity metric and are not necessarily drivers of interesting discussion. I'm not saying HN is there yet, but I'm certainly seeing the same signals I saw on /. and digg and reddit. They each tried to address the problem in different ways. /. uses a karma system where a poster can get a karma score, but also a comment meta-tag "funny, insightful, etc.". This creates relative freedom for people to post a variety of comments that drive completely unique kinds of discussion depending on the meta-tag, it also addresses the severe lack of a sense of humor at HN. digg and reddit, on the other hand, tried to diversify topically, hoping that technical people would hang out in /r/technical and politically minded people would hang out in /r/politics etc. In general, I'm not terribly satisfied with the commentary /. provides, and I think both digg and reddit's approaches have proven to not work once their respective communities grew too large. My proposal is that HN institutes the following modding rules: 1. New posts are scored 0. The scoring seems to work this way anyway, so the +1 next to new posts isn't really correct anyway. I don't know off-hand what the algorithm is that determines when a post is counted towards karma, but it's not immediately clear to the user. This also encourages better comments that can earn points by driving discussion. 2. If a person is to be up-modded beyond some small number, say +3, then the new up-modder must post at least some comment. This provides insight into why people might find a particular comment good and worthy of praise. The number of times I've seen a 4 word snarky comment with a mod-score of +43 is far too common. If a comment deserves that many points, it better be so good that people can be bothered to at least say "I agree with that, that's just like the time I...". And write a sentence or two. This also prevents the reddit/digg effect of somebody making a statement they know is popular with the community just to get mod points. I've noticed this starting to happen on HN. It's the unpopular opinions that create the better discussion IMHO -- and these are just the kinds to receive copious down-mods. 3. If a person is to be down-modded below -1, then the down-modder must post a reason for their downvote. This provides insight into why people might find a particular comment poor and worthy of scorn. The number of times I've seen perfectly good, interesting and informative comments (and yes, I'm excluding myself from this) with a score of -11 or something is likewise far too common. If a comment is so poor that a -1 score doesn't clarify to the author that it was a poor comment, then I think the author deserves a reason why. This prevents downvotes on pure disagreement, or for interesting but otherwise unpopular opinions. And large numbers of downvotes will have appropriate commentary as to why that opinion was hit so hard. This prevents the inevitable "why was I downvoted for my perfectly valid commentary?" which the guidelines do admonish. Rather than some nebulous guideline though, I think this should be part of the logic of the site. Futhermore, if a comment is to get a very low score, say less than -10, then it should just be auto-flagged. Anything that poorly scored is likely to be offensive anyways. 4. As a general rule, meta-comments should be allowed and encouraged. This helps HN self-police, and also can provide it's own interesting meta-commentary and meta-discussion. Point of fact, both of my heavily down-modded comments received a number of replies in the form of serious meta-discussion that would have been interesting to flesh out and explore, but the down-mod frenzy drove possible discussion away like a case of bad B.O.. Yet I lost probably a dozen karma points for my troubles. Rules 2 and 3 in particular are designed to force people to craft comments that drive discussion (which, as I understand it, is the point of HN) and not drive popularity. Combined they also prevent a different kind of social effect, one I like to call the wikipedia effect, that of people that feel it is their god-given right to arbitrate some self-selected rules of the community they inhabit and prevent all newcomers from playing in their playground. More than anything, I think this kind pf pathetic "narcissistic-pseudo-moderator" effect harms a site more than anything else and makes it an unwelcome place for new voices. Guidelines against such behavior are one thing, but simply making that philosophy part of the function of the site I believe would be far more useful. There, that's my 2cents worth.
    - rms 17y ago
      You missed the rule I was referring to. >If your account is less than a year old, please don't submit comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. (It's a common semi-noob illusion.)
      - elblanco 17y ago
        > You missed the rule I was referring to. Sorry pal, if a clearly political post can appear on HN with copious upmods even though such a post is clearly against guidelines, I can break guidelines as well and meta-comment about its lack of relevancy to HN in general. >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics...If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. You are precisely the type of person I mention in relation to the wikipedia effect. > ...that of people that feel it is their god-given right to arbitrate some self-selected rules of the community they inhabit and prevent all newcomers from playing in their playground. http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html The relevant word is guidelines. Despite the guideline on the topic. There is an very vigorous and ongoing discussion about this effect. Works Cited: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=508801 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=508801 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=575032 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=575032 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=406293 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=406293 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=164901 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=164901 (perhaps one of my favorite posts on the topic from about 2 years ago). http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=744475 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=744475 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=409659 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=409659 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=88898 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=88898 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=76469 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=76469 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011841 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011841 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=994418 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=994418 and on and on and on...at least since I've started reading HN a couple years ago. So we can either follow guidelines to the letter, in which case pg should rename that to rules, and we should all flag posts like the China/Copenhagen one (and my posts regarding reddit and about half your posts for not being of interest to business technologists) http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011915 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011915 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011368 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011368 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011306 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011306 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011337 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011337 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009130 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009130 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009177 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009177 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007640 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007640 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007289 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007289 etc. or your submissions http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007183 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007183 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1005924 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1005924 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1002837 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1002837 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=975046 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=975046 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=973940 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=973940 etc. You even seem aware of this effect yourself http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=937446 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=937446 ! Or we can regard the guidelines for what they are, directors of discussion in this digital salon. But I can play your game if you like, I can flood HN with garbage submissions to every dog and pony show I find remotely interesting (even against guidelines) to boost my karma and then downvote and flag everybody else who does the same. Or we can use HN for what it's intended for, as a discussion forum for interesting business and technology news. To my understanding, the modding/submission/flagging system is intended to create interesting discussion, not to create karma. HN (the community) has to decide if karma is what's important or discussion is what's important. I've already outlined why I think the current system emphasizes karma over discussion. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1013330 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1013330 I was hoping that HN was not just another reddit/digg.
- mattwdelong 17y ago
  The converse relationship also exists. Hacker News is my first resource when I wake up in the morning, I check it before my emails. Shortly thereafter, I also check /r/programming on reddit. Sometimes, I see content pop up on reddit after it appears on Hacker News. It is not a one way road, as you suggest. It might be interesting to write a script to watch both sites and pull data, determining where content appears first - possibly using modified code from the OP. If I get some time, I might do just this tonight. Somewhat useless, but the information might determine what is a better real time resource for topics relevant to my interests.
  - alnayyir 17y ago
    If you end up following through on this, please make a post or message me a link to a github/source post. I'm bored. :P
    - mattwdelong 17y ago
      Sorry. Got tied up last night, but I am still interested in this data and appended it on my to do list. Ping me @ any of my contact info in my profile and I will link you when it's done!
  - elblanco 17y ago
    Well, it's obvious that, a very large percentage of HN users are reddit users. I prefer HN for the better, startup and technical oriented commentary and community. I think reddit devolves too fast as the discussion length grows (plus I like HN's simple layout better). Right now I check reddit before I check HN, but mainly for topics other than those covered by HN. It's disheartening to see cross posts reddit->HN though, since the communities are virtually the same. But I'll admit that the same topic will get better discussion here.
- rms 17y ago
  It's because your type of comment is explicitly banned in the guidelines.
DanielBMarkham 17y ago
Related note: I wrote a program that collects all the HN, Reddit, and Digg Technology articles and ranks them. It was a fun quickie-project in F# Instead of stripping the intersection, I find that dupes usually indicate a more important story, so I check on those first. I find that by indicating relative movement (is the story moving up or down in rankings?) and relative comment change I can get an indication of what's hot or not. Whenever I'm bored and want to do a bunch of reading, I can control-click my way into dozens of useful stories pretty quickly! It was a fun project. Here's the site if anybody's interested: http://project-management-methodologies.net http://project-management-methodologies.net

27 points by mk 17y ago

Stripping Reddit from your life with /etc/hosts: 127.0.0.1 www.reddit.com

This makes front page after all those downvotes I received for commenting about essentially the same thing? Seriously? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011277 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011277

blhack 17y ago
What is the point of your comment here? It looks like you got downvoted in the other thread because you were whining about something irrelevant.
- elblanco 17y ago
  Fine, I'll frame it in different language. warning meta-comment, queasy people that can't handle introspection should stop here There is a constant meta-discussion on HN, with HN being on top of course, that social news aggregation sites tend to devolve along the following lattice, HN->reddit->digg->4chan. Various signals are referenced that this is happening, typically in the form of people behaving outside of the established site or community guidelines. HN's guidelines for example state that this post http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 runs counter to the guideline: >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or disasters, or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. So not only was the post counter to guidelines and very clearly not a topical HN post, it was a repost, just a short while after appearing on reddit's main page. In addition, the title: > How do I know China wrecked the Copenhagen deal? I was in the room (while it is the original article title) blows threw at least half of the guidelines for submissions. I added the meta-comment http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011258 which was immediately downvoted to something like -5 at one point and all of my subsequent comments, even topically related and without violating any HN guidelines were immediately hammered. Some additional people responded to my meta-comment, all non-trollish, one guy is now +8 and another is enjoying time at 0. This is schizophrenic. The guidelines for voting on HN (at least at one time but I can't find any such guidelines anymore) clearly state(d) that upvotes should be for comments that create interesting discussions and should not be due to agreement with the poster. The converse should also be true, essentially, downvotes should be for trolls. But since I was meta-commenting, something that has been well documented and relatively cherished on this site as a way of maintaining quality and preventing the typical downtrend of other aggregator sites...my comments shouldn't have been downmodded to begin with. (I can almost guarantee that this comment will reach at least -3 at some point for example). To make it worse, the downmodders aren't actually providing any interesting commentary either, they don't even post a rebuke or a comment chastising me for violating some imagined HN guideline because they know that they have no grounds to do so and are only downvoting out of malice and disagreement. So, on the same day that I meta-commented that non-topical-HN posts that show up on reddit and immediately show up on HN right after that and then got my ass handed to me for pointing that out (of course with no commentary), an actual post regarding reddit->HN posting shows up and even offers a technical solution to solve this problem shows up not only on HN in the new bin, but on the front page near the top. So of course I meta-meta-meta-comment that this is rapidly becoming ridiculous. It's not the slide to reddit that the HN community should be worried about, it's the slide to schizophrenic insanity. There, so that's the topical explanation since the pithier ones didn't satisfy you. So as not to just complain about the problem, but to offer solutions: HN is a news agreegator, but more importantly it tries to drive interesting and informative discussion. I believe that the modding system as is creates an environment where the HN community is slowly moving towards an echo-chamber-like groupthink a la reddit or digg or some other aggregator. The reasons for this are actually relatively few and are largely addressed in guidelines, but otherwise ignored by the community at large: a. When people post otherwise interesting comments, their mod score is more a function of opinion popularity than a driver of further commentary. b. When scores for a comment are absurdly high (anything over +10 in my book), it drives people to also post comments that are similar. Since comments with high scores appear to be a function of popularity and not discussion drivers, those are the types of comments we are starting to see, and the responses tend to be not sources of discussion and debate but rather "yeah, that was a popular comment right there" followed by more upmods. c. When scores for a comment are absurdly low (anything below -3 in my book), it drives people to not want to post. Even if they might otherwise provide an interesting viewpoint that drives further discussion, even discussion in absolute disagreement with the OP. The result is that the only people who are posting are people that craft comments that fit the group-think popularity metric and are not necessarily drivers of interesting discussion. I'm not saying HN is there yet, but I'm certainly seeing the same signals I saw on /. and digg and reddit. They each tried to address the problem in different ways. /. uses a karma system where a poster can get a karma score, but also a comment meta-tag "funny, insightful, etc.". This creates relative freedom for people to post a variety of comments that drive completely unique kinds of discussion depending on the meta-tag, it also addresses the severe lack of a sense of humor at HN. digg and reddit, on the other hand, tried to diversify topically, hoping that technical people would hang out in /r/technical and politically minded people would hang out in /r/politics etc. In general, I'm not terribly satisfied with the commentary /. provides, and I think both digg and reddit's approaches have proven to not work once their respective communities grew too large. My proposal is that HN institutes the following modding rules: 1. New posts are scored 0. The scoring seems to work this way anyway, so the +1 next to new posts isn't really correct anyway. I don't know off-hand what the algorithm is that determines when a post is counted towards karma, but it's not immediately clear to the user. This also encourages better comments that can earn points by driving discussion. 2. If a person is to be up-modded beyond some small number, say +3, then the new up-modder must post at least some comment. This provides insight into why people might find a particular comment good and worthy of praise. The number of times I've seen a 4 word snarky comment with a mod-score of +43 is far too common. If a comment deserves that many points, it better be so good that people can be bothered to at least say "I agree with that, that's just like the time I...". And write a sentence or two. This also prevents the reddit/digg effect of somebody making a statement they know is popular with the community just to get mod points. I've noticed this starting to happen on HN. It's the unpopular opinions that create the better discussion IMHO -- and these are just the kinds to receive copious down-mods. 3. If a person is to be down-modded below -1, then the down-modder must post a reason for their downvote. This provides insight into why people might find a particular comment poor and worthy of scorn. The number of times I've seen perfectly good, interesting and informative comments (and yes, I'm excluding myself from this) with a score of -11 or something is likewise far too common. If a comment is so poor that a -1 score doesn't clarify to the author that it was a poor comment, then I think the author deserves a reason why. This prevents downvotes on pure disagreement, or for interesting but otherwise unpopular opinions. And large numbers of downvotes will have appropriate commentary as to why that opinion was hit so hard. This prevents the inevitable "why was I downvoted for my perfectly valid commentary?" which the guidelines do admonish. Rather than some nebulous guideline though, I think this should be part of the logic of the site. Futhermore, if a comment is to get a very low score, say less than -10, then it should just be auto-flagged. Anything that poorly scored is likely to be offensive anyways. 4. As a general rule, meta-comments should be allowed and encouraged. This helps HN self-police, and also can provide it's own interesting meta-commentary and meta-discussion. Point of fact, both of my heavily down-modded comments received a number of replies in the form of serious meta-discussion that would have been interesting to flesh out and explore, but the down-mod frenzy drove possible discussion away like a case of bad B.O.. Yet I lost probably a dozen karma points for my troubles. Rules 2 and 3 in particular are designed to force people to craft comments that drive discussion (which, as I understand it, is the point of HN) and not drive popularity. Combined they also prevent a different kind of social effect, one I like to call the wikipedia effect, that of people that feel it is their god-given right to arbitrate some self-selected rules of the community they inhabit and prevent all newcomers from playing in their playground. More than anything, I think this kind pf pathetic "narcissistic-pseudo-moderator" effect harms a site more than anything else and makes it an unwelcome place for new voices. Guidelines against such behavior are one thing, but simply making that philosophy part of the function of the site I believe would be far more useful. There, that's my 2cents worth.
  - rms 17y ago
    You missed the rule I was referring to. >If your account is less than a year old, please don't submit comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. (It's a common semi-noob illusion.)
    - elblanco 17y ago
      > You missed the rule I was referring to. Sorry pal, if a clearly political post can appear on HN with copious upmods even though such a post is clearly against guidelines, I can break guidelines as well and meta-comment about its lack of relevancy to HN in general. >Off-Topic: Most stories about politics...If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic. You are precisely the type of person I mention in relation to the wikipedia effect. > ...that of people that feel it is their god-given right to arbitrate some self-selected rules of the community they inhabit and prevent all newcomers from playing in their playground. http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html The relevant word is guidelines. Despite the guideline on the topic. There is an very vigorous and ongoing discussion about this effect. Works Cited: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=508801 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=508801 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=575032 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=575032 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=406293 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=406293 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=164901 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=164901 (perhaps one of my favorite posts on the topic from about 2 years ago). http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=744475 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=744475 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=409659 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=409659 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=88898 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=88898 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=76469 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=76469 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011841 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011841 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=994418 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=994418 and on and on and on...at least since I've started reading HN a couple years ago. So we can either follow guidelines to the letter, in which case pg should rename that to rules, and we should all flag posts like the China/Copenhagen one (and my posts regarding reddit and about half your posts for not being of interest to business technologists) http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011915 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011915 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011368 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011368 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011306 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011306 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011337 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1011337 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009130 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009130 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009177 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1009177 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007640 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007640 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007289 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007289 etc. or your submissions http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007183 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1007183 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1005924 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1005924 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1002837 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1002837 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=975046 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=975046 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=973940 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=973940 etc. You even seem aware of this effect yourself http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=937446 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=937446 ! Or we can regard the guidelines for what they are, directors of discussion in this digital salon. But I can play your game if you like, I can flood HN with garbage submissions to every dog and pony show I find remotely interesting (even against guidelines) to boost my karma and then downvote and flag everybody else who does the same. Or we can use HN for what it's intended for, as a discussion forum for interesting business and technology news. To my understanding, the modding/submission/flagging system is intended to create interesting discussion, not to create karma. HN (the community) has to decide if karma is what's important or discussion is what's important. I've already outlined why I think the current system emphasizes karma over discussion. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1013330 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1013330 I was hoping that HN was not just another reddit/digg.
mattwdelong 17y ago
The converse relationship also exists. Hacker News is my first resource when I wake up in the morning, I check it before my emails. Shortly thereafter, I also check /r/programming on reddit. Sometimes, I see content pop up on reddit after it appears on Hacker News. It is not a one way road, as you suggest. It might be interesting to write a script to watch both sites and pull data, determining where content appears first - possibly using modified code from the OP. If I get some time, I might do just this tonight. Somewhat useless, but the information might determine what is a better real time resource for topics relevant to my interests.
- alnayyir 17y ago
  If you end up following through on this, please make a post or message me a link to a github/source post. I'm bored. :P
  - mattwdelong 17y ago
    Sorry. Got tied up last night, but I am still interested in this data and appended it on my to do list. Ping me @ any of my contact info in my profile and I will link you when it's done!
- elblanco 17y ago
  Well, it's obvious that, a very large percentage of HN users are reddit users. I prefer HN for the better, startup and technical oriented commentary and community. I think reddit devolves too fast as the discussion length grows (plus I like HN's simple layout better). Right now I check reddit before I check HN, but mainly for topics other than those covered by HN. It's disheartening to see cross posts reddit->HN though, since the communities are virtually the same. But I'll admit that the same topic will get better discussion here.
rms 17y ago
It's because your type of comment is explicitly banned in the guidelines.

DanielBMarkham 17y ago

Related note: I wrote a program that collects all the HN, Reddit, and Digg Technology articles and ranks them. It was a fun quickie-project in F# Instead of stripping the intersection, I find that dupes usually indicate a more important story, so I check on those first. I find that by indicating relative movement (is the story moving up or down in rankings?) and relative comment change I can get an indication of what's hot or not. Whenever I'm bored and want to do a bunch of reading, I can control-click my way into dozens of useful stories pretty quickly! It was a fun project. Here's the site if anybody's interested: http://project-management-methodologies.net http://project-management-methodologies.net