4 ms·

Yes, how dare he say that an employee being abusive towards another employee is unacceptable. How very dare he.

by untog 11y ago

phaed 11y ago
> Employee: When she and the rest of her blue-haired nose-pierced asshole feminists are gone, the tech industry will breathe a sigh of relief > CEO: "When I talk about crossing the line from criticism to hate speech, I'm talking about when you start saying 'someone's kind doesn't belong here, and we'll all be happy when they're gone.'" > CEO: So if and when we identify who this person is, if they are an employee, they will be fired. And regardless, either way, they are not welcome to continue to participate in the Mozilla project. It is not who we are. Notice how he says when someone says "someone's kind doesn't belong here, and we'll all be happy when they're gone." is hate speech. Yet in the next sentence he says the very thing about the anonymous employee's kind. The only difference here is that she is a radical feminist, and the employee simply expressed his relief at her kind leaving, as she was a permanently offended well known bully of a supervisor and a source of stress for everyone under her. It is funny how people are not allowed to openly have a negative opinion of another person if they are a "protected" class or just not a white male. When you stand up for the bully simply because they are feminist, you know something is wrong. Either way this all left a bad taste in my mouth. I won't be supporting this organization any longer.
- JoshTriplett 11y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance If you're tolerant of everything, including intolerance, you end up supporting intolerance. Or, in short, it's perfectly fine to kick people out for being hateful. There's no inconsistency or hypocrisy in that position.
  - cpeterso 11y ago
    People are getting hung up on pedantic definitions of "hate speech". If we say "hostile work environment" instead, then the anonymous poster's behavior clearly crosses the line. The response is not unique to Mozilla. Big companies like Google have probably encountered similar situations. Mozilla is just more open about it.
- foiboitoi 11y ago
  Can't you use the browser without supporting them? I don't like the hypocrisy either but I love the browser (mostly). I do wish the engineers got back into management positions instead of these clueless politicians.
  - TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
    Engineers don't necessarily share your political leanings.
    - foiboitoi 11y ago
      I don't care about their political leaning. Politics doesn't belong in the work environment, especially for management. That includes every "political leaning". Not just the ones we don't like.
      - TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
        No, you do care about political leanings. There's always going to be office politics. What you perceive as "politics" is politics you dislike.
  - geofft 11y ago
    You know, it was not that long ago that being a hacker was, itself, a political position: you had thoughts on the power structures of the world and its borders, about US arms-control laws and their relationship to strong cryptography, about whether computer code should be subject to copyright or patent protection, about the FBI and J. Edgar Hoover, about voting technology and algorithms, about computer crime laws, etc. Then, slowly, the hackers became engineers. The hackers' way of thinking, in many ways, became society's way of thinking, and it was easy enough not to express contrary political opinions. At which point it became easy not to express any at all. I am an engineer, and what's a "manifesto"? Damn kids, dragging politics into our professional industry... they're all alike. http://phrack.org/issues/7/3.html http://phrack.org/issues/7/3.html
    - 11y ago
- fabrice_d 11y ago
  <disclaimer>I'm a Mozilla employee, though I never worked directly with Christie</disclaimer> I don't know where you got that "she was a well known bully of a supervisor and a source of stress for everyone under her" but that doesn't match anything I've heard about Christie. Look at this guy comment history on reddit ( https://www.reddit.com/user/aoiyama https://www.reddit.com/user/aoiyama), and maybe you'll change your mind.

Yes, how dare he say that an employee being abusive towards another employee is unacceptable. How very dare he.

by untog 11y ago

Yes, how dare he say that an employee being abusive towards another employee is unacceptable. How very dare he.

phaed 11y ago

> Employee: When she and the rest of her blue-haired nose-pierced asshole feminists are gone, the tech industry will breathe a sigh of relief > CEO: "When I talk about crossing the line from criticism to hate speech, I'm talking about when you start saying 'someone's kind doesn't belong here, and we'll all be happy when they're gone.'" > CEO: So if and when we identify who this person is, if they are an employee, they will be fired. And regardless, either way, they are not welcome to continue to participate in the Mozilla project. It is not who we are. Notice how he says when someone says "someone's kind doesn't belong here, and we'll all be happy when they're gone." is hate speech. Yet in the next sentence he says the very thing about the anonymous employee's kind. The only difference here is that she is a radical feminist, and the employee simply expressed his relief at her kind leaving, as she was a permanently offended well known bully of a supervisor and a source of stress for everyone under her. It is funny how people are not allowed to openly have a negative opinion of another person if they are a "protected" class or just not a white male. When you stand up for the bully simply because they are feminist, you know something is wrong. Either way this all left a bad taste in my mouth. I won't be supporting this organization any longer.

JoshTriplett 11y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance If you're tolerant of everything, including intolerance, you end up supporting intolerance. Or, in short, it's perfectly fine to kick people out for being hateful. There's no inconsistency or hypocrisy in that position.
- cpeterso 11y ago
  People are getting hung up on pedantic definitions of "hate speech". If we say "hostile work environment" instead, then the anonymous poster's behavior clearly crosses the line. The response is not unique to Mozilla. Big companies like Google have probably encountered similar situations. Mozilla is just more open about it.
foiboitoi 11y ago
Can't you use the browser without supporting them? I don't like the hypocrisy either but I love the browser (mostly). I do wish the engineers got back into management positions instead of these clueless politicians.
- TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
  Engineers don't necessarily share your political leanings.
  - foiboitoi 11y ago
    I don't care about their political leaning. Politics doesn't belong in the work environment, especially for management. That includes every "political leaning". Not just the ones we don't like.
    - TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
      No, you do care about political leanings. There's always going to be office politics. What you perceive as "politics" is politics you dislike.
- geofft 11y ago
  You know, it was not that long ago that being a hacker was, itself, a political position: you had thoughts on the power structures of the world and its borders, about US arms-control laws and their relationship to strong cryptography, about whether computer code should be subject to copyright or patent protection, about the FBI and J. Edgar Hoover, about voting technology and algorithms, about computer crime laws, etc. Then, slowly, the hackers became engineers. The hackers' way of thinking, in many ways, became society's way of thinking, and it was easy enough not to express contrary political opinions. At which point it became easy not to express any at all. I am an engineer, and what's a "manifesto"? Damn kids, dragging politics into our professional industry... they're all alike. http://phrack.org/issues/7/3.html http://phrack.org/issues/7/3.html
  - 11y ago
fabrice_d 11y ago
<disclaimer>I'm a Mozilla employee, though I never worked directly with Christie</disclaimer> I don't know where you got that "she was a well known bully of a supervisor and a source of stress for everyone under her" but that doesn't match anything I've heard about Christie. Look at this guy comment history on reddit ( https://www.reddit.com/user/aoiyama https://www.reddit.com/user/aoiyama), and maybe you'll change your mind.