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Naive. The NSA already has access to the complete pipe, so they have 100% of what Google has as source material, then they can also issue requests to Google for

Naive. The NSA already has access to the complete pipe, so they have 100% of what Google has as source material, then they can also issue requests to Google for anything Google has-- they have far more than Google does. The NSA can also refer your information to foreign governments for more analysis, and vice versa. You are already tied to stupid things you said online. They have categorized this information and will sit on it for an indefinite amount of time. There are groups such as JTRIG who will use the stupid things you have said to turn you against people you may be aligned with, if they think it is necessary. Should you ever run for public office or become an inconvenience, you are already in their pocket. It's already "full fascist", you just haven't toed the line of their rules yet.

rayiner 11y ago
There's two very different things. A government that suppresses fringe elements versus one that oppresses the majority. NSA spying programs enable the former, but the majority is rational in not caring about that. Current NSA programs are irrelevant to the latter, because if the government went full fascist and tried to oppress the majority, it wouldn't take them long at all to build their spying apparatus from scratch by just occupying the headquarters of a few key internet and telecom companies.
- cryoshon 11y ago
  Fringe elements, you say? Such as... the young community organizer Barack Obama when he was running for senator as a nobody? If you recall, he was actually spied on by the NSA then, and likely before that as well. This is a problem, and the majority of people should understand that an attack on a fringe can effect them. Someone could blackmailed the president, or acted as a filter by allowing him to pass with certain conditions. Sounds like that is something to be rationally concerned about. The NSA programs chill speech of the majority, anyway. You always hear people faux-fretting about "being on a list" for what they say. It's a joke when they say it, but it's not a joke in reality. People are reacting to being constantly surveilled, and it's putting a cramp on a lot of discussions.
  - tptacek 11y ago
    What evidence is there that Barack Obama was spied on by the NSA?
    - tedunangst 11y ago
      He made some campaign promises I liked, but then he didn't follow through.
- SilasX 11y ago
  At risk of being extremely cliche ... It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of the socialists, because I'm not a socialist. It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of unions, because I'm not in a union. It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of fringe elements, because I'm not in a fringe element. But now they're surveilling me, and there's no one left to be irrational for me.

rayiner 11y ago

There's two very different things. A government that suppresses fringe elements versus one that oppresses the majority. NSA spying programs enable the former, but the majority is rational in not caring about that. Current NSA programs are irrelevant to the latter, because if the government went full fascist and tried to oppress the majority, it wouldn't take them long at all to build their spying apparatus from scratch by just occupying the headquarters of a few key internet and telecom companies.

cryoshon 11y ago
Fringe elements, you say? Such as... the young community organizer Barack Obama when he was running for senator as a nobody? If you recall, he was actually spied on by the NSA then, and likely before that as well. This is a problem, and the majority of people should understand that an attack on a fringe can effect them. Someone could blackmailed the president, or acted as a filter by allowing him to pass with certain conditions. Sounds like that is something to be rationally concerned about. The NSA programs chill speech of the majority, anyway. You always hear people faux-fretting about "being on a list" for what they say. It's a joke when they say it, but it's not a joke in reality. People are reacting to being constantly surveilled, and it's putting a cramp on a lot of discussions.
- tptacek 11y ago
  What evidence is there that Barack Obama was spied on by the NSA?
  - tedunangst 11y ago
    He made some campaign promises I liked, but then he didn't follow through.
SilasX 11y ago
At risk of being extremely cliche ... It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of the socialists, because I'm not a socialist. It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of unions, because I'm not in a union. It's not rational for me to care about surveillance of fringe elements, because I'm not in a fringe element. But now they're surveilling me, and there's no one left to be irrational for me.