2 ms·

> The evidence shows that people don't value reusable bags highly enough to not throw them out without a second thought. > due to my own personal preferences

by jogjayr 11y ago

> The evidence shows that people don't value reusable bags highly enough to not throw them out without a second thought. > due to my own personal preferences I'm going ignore the snarky tone and address the underlying idea: it's not just my own personal preferences. Clogged drainage systems (see Mumbai, India), visual pollution, injury to wildlife, increased taxpayer costs for trash and recyling; all are due to plastic bags. These are things that affect more than just me: they affect you too, they affect everyone. Plastic bags; their use and disposal aren't things that happen in isolation. Plastic is (effectively) forever. It will remain here long after you or I and our descendants are gone, choking the life out of some lake or pond.

burntsushi 11y ago
It's not snark. I'm very serious: you're omitting key details in your claims. Your prose suggests something as a fact, when in actuality, it's just your own personal valuation. It suits your claim to state things as if they were facts because it grants you authority. I'm calling you out on it. > These are things that affect more than just me You're moving the goal post. I don't disagree that the existence of plastic bags doesn't affect me or others. I'm contesting that their valuation level is some known fact that your prose suggests you're privy to. > to not throw them out without a second thought. Everyone I know (including myself) saves their plastic bags for reuse. I've been using the same plastic bag to bring my lunch to work since last November!
- jogjayr 11y ago
  > Your prose suggests something as a fact, when in actuality, it's just your own personal valuation I guess I assumed when people throw something out, they don't value it sufficiently highly. That's obviously why you see all those gold watches and diamond rings in the trash every day. </sarcasm> (I'm obviously not suggesting reusable bags are worth the same as a gold watch) Perhaps I should have phrased it as "The evidence suggests" instead of "shows". Maybe the definitiveness of my statement is what has rubbed you the wrong way. I don't know. There could be other reasons why people throw out reusable bags too: lack of storage space, lack of knowledge that they're reusable, not enough time to think about it/need to clean up in a hurry. > Everyone I know (including myself) saves their plastic bags for reuse. I've been using the same plastic bag to bring my lunch to work since last November! I personally think that's very admirable and applaud you for it (totally serious here). I wish more people did the same as you. Not everyone does it and in some circles, storing plastic bags from the store in a drawer marks you out as some sort of frugal weirdo.
  - burntsushi 11y ago
    > I guess I assumed when people throw something out, they don't value it sufficiently highly. When people throw something out, they are valuing the thing as disposable trash more than the thing staying around. This isn't to say that this valuation is "right" or "wrong," which is context that your comment is adding. Specifically, the context is, "the valuation is wrong because it doesn't achieve some other goal that I care about." The labeling of the valuation as wrong and implying it is generally known is what I'm objecting to. > Not everyone does it and in some circles, storing plastic bags from the store in a drawer marks you out as some sort of frugal weirdo. Weird. It's totally normal where I come from (Massachusetts), to the point of you can walk into someone's house and ask, "Where do you keep your plastic bags?" I don't think it's particularly admirable IMO. It's just convenient. :-)
    - jogjayr 11y ago
      > The labeling of the valuation as wrong and implying it is generally known is what I'm objecting to. I was saying that the valuation is not high enough to keep people from throwing out reusable bags (ie what you said: "disposable trash"). I didn't use the word "wrong" in any of my comments and I don't think I implied it either. What I (thought I) was implying is that the low perceived value of reusable bags was hurting the city's goal (note: not "my goal", which I also never said, though yeah I support it) of reducing the use of plastic. Clearly you're taking issue with what you assumed was the subtext of my comment. I can't help that. The most I can do is clarify.

by jogjayr 11y ago

burntsushi 11y ago

It's not snark. I'm very serious: you're omitting key details in your claims. Your prose suggests something as a fact, when in actuality, it's just your own personal valuation. It suits your claim to state things as if they were facts because it grants you authority. I'm calling you out on it. > These are things that affect more than just me You're moving the goal post. I don't disagree that the existence of plastic bags doesn't affect me or others. I'm contesting that their valuation level is some known fact that your prose suggests you're privy to. > to not throw them out without a second thought. Everyone I know (including myself) saves their plastic bags for reuse. I've been using the same plastic bag to bring my lunch to work since last November!

jogjayr 11y ago
> Your prose suggests something as a fact, when in actuality, it's just your own personal valuation I guess I assumed when people throw something out, they don't value it sufficiently highly. That's obviously why you see all those gold watches and diamond rings in the trash every day. </sarcasm> (I'm obviously not suggesting reusable bags are worth the same as a gold watch) Perhaps I should have phrased it as "The evidence suggests" instead of "shows". Maybe the definitiveness of my statement is what has rubbed you the wrong way. I don't know. There could be other reasons why people throw out reusable bags too: lack of storage space, lack of knowledge that they're reusable, not enough time to think about it/need to clean up in a hurry. > Everyone I know (including myself) saves their plastic bags for reuse. I've been using the same plastic bag to bring my lunch to work since last November! I personally think that's very admirable and applaud you for it (totally serious here). I wish more people did the same as you. Not everyone does it and in some circles, storing plastic bags from the store in a drawer marks you out as some sort of frugal weirdo.
- burntsushi 11y ago
  > I guess I assumed when people throw something out, they don't value it sufficiently highly. When people throw something out, they are valuing the thing as disposable trash more than the thing staying around. This isn't to say that this valuation is "right" or "wrong," which is context that your comment is adding. Specifically, the context is, "the valuation is wrong because it doesn't achieve some other goal that I care about." The labeling of the valuation as wrong and implying it is generally known is what I'm objecting to. > Not everyone does it and in some circles, storing plastic bags from the store in a drawer marks you out as some sort of frugal weirdo. Weird. It's totally normal where I come from (Massachusetts), to the point of you can walk into someone's house and ask, "Where do you keep your plastic bags?" I don't think it's particularly admirable IMO. It's just convenient. :-)
  - jogjayr 11y ago
    > The labeling of the valuation as wrong and implying it is generally known is what I'm objecting to. I was saying that the valuation is not high enough to keep people from throwing out reusable bags (ie what you said: "disposable trash"). I didn't use the word "wrong" in any of my comments and I don't think I implied it either. What I (thought I) was implying is that the low perceived value of reusable bags was hurting the city's goal (note: not "my goal", which I also never said, though yeah I support it) of reducing the use of plastic. Clearly you're taking issue with what you assumed was the subtext of my comment. I can't help that. The most I can do is clarify.