7 ms·

This is an overkill I believe. Are Android devices banned from torrent sites? Chromebooks? Windows 10 is a cloud-based operating system, as is Android and Chrom

This is an overkill I believe. Are Android devices banned from torrent sites? Chromebooks? Windows 10 is a cloud-based operating system, as is Android and ChromeOS -- most of the code runs locally, but it heavily relies on cloud functionality. It is extremely naive to think that if MS tells you in the EULA that many services in the OS work based on the user behavior suddenly opens up new doors for spying. If MS wanted to spy on you, they could have done that already (they might or might not, I don't know, but it's certainly not the EULA that prevents them from doing that). /snarky comment: I guess most people on the torrent sites already give full permissions to the torchlight app on their phone.

mtgx 11y ago
It's not overkill when a company scans every single file you have in your PC, keeps those logs on its servers, and then eventually can and likely will share that information with others, from law enforcement to MPAA or even advertising companies. Microsoft has already admitted in its "privacy" policy that it can and will do such thing: > “We will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), --- when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary to ---.” [1] I mean - are you kidding me? Like "whenever we'll feel like it"? That's so reassuring that you respect your customers's privacy, Microsoft...Really solid privacy policy right there. [1] - http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/ http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privac...
- Amezarak 11y ago
  You left out the circumstances under which they will share your data. > comply with applicable law or respond to valid legal process, including from law enforcement or other government agencies; > protect our customers, for example to prevent spam or attempts to defraud users of the services, or to help prevent the loss of life or serious injury of anyone; > operate and maintain the security of our services, including to prevent or stop an attack on our computer systems or networks; or > protect the rights or property of Microsoft, including enforcing the terms governing the use of the services - however, if we receive information indicating that someone is using our services to traffic in stolen intellectual or physical property of Microsoft, we will not inspect a customer's private content ourselves, but we may refer the matter to law enforcement. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/default.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/default.asp... Additionally, the privacy policy section you and I are quoting applies to many Microsoft services, including, for example, OneDrive. Otherwise, the "private folder" data they're talking about could only be whatever bits and scraps telemetry and Windows Defender picks up, based on my reading. That seems perfectly reasonable and also confirms they won't be sending any of your data to the MPAA.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - aikah 11y ago
    > That seems perfectly reasonable No that's not , and what is shocking is that you find it "perfectly reasonable".
    - Amezarak 11y ago
      That's literally a bog-standard privacy policy clause. You can find the essentially same four points on everything from Ubuntu to Wikimedia. Can you be more specific about which part of it you find particularly unreasonable? Can you explain how the claims that the privacy policy allows MS to share data with the MPAA are founded?
      - AlexandrB 11y ago
        Normally these kinds of terms appear on web services where the scope of disclosure is contained to the information you upload to the service (e.g. repos you upload to Github or posts you make to Reddit). Windows 10 is fundamentally different because the scope becomes everything the OS can suck up including everything on the hard drive and keystrokes from the keyboard. You no longer have the option not to disclose something because anything that shows up on the PC may be fair game. Privacy is all about controlling who gets to see what information. Windows 10, being an OS, removes your ability to control what is shared in any meaningful way with its privacy policy.
        _lce0 11y ago
        > [...] becomes everything the OS can suck up including everything on the hard drive and keystrokes from the keyboard. Not just on the machine. It can scan the whole local network, understanding about LAN, devices, services, all of which could be hard to reach from WAN.
      - bonaldi 11y ago
        > Can you explain how the claims that the privacy policy allows MS to share data with the MPAA are founded? The MPAA could be a Microsoft "customer" that needs protection from piracy. The MPAA could run a service with Microsoft that needs protection from being "defrauded". There are holes in the policy large enough to drive a fleet of buses through.
belorn 11y ago
Privacy issues is all about scale. When groups of people can be mapped, it allows for discrimination and prosecution and that thought scares people into submission. Android and ChromeOS users are small minorities, while if you monitor all Windows users you more or less can map out the whole community, and that is a very scary thought for a lot of people.
- sz4kerto 11y ago
  > Privacy issues is all about scale I absolutely agree, but I don't see why Android users would be a minority -- I don't know the latest numbers but I guess there are more Android users already than Windows (10) users.
  - rmk2 11y ago
    How many of those Android users use their Android devices for torrenting?
  - bad_user 11y ago
    I'm pretty sure that people won't use their 3G / 4G mobile plan to download movies, music or the latest Linux ISOs from torrent sites on their smartphone with 16 / 32 GB of total storage.
    - KJasper 11y ago
      But they might just use their wifi connection ;)

mtgx 11y ago

It's not overkill when a company scans every single file you have in your PC, keeps those logs on its servers, and then eventually can and likely will share that information with others, from law enforcement to MPAA or even advertising companies. Microsoft has already admitted in its "privacy" policy that it can and will do such thing: > “We will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), --- when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary to ---.” [1] I mean - are you kidding me? Like "whenever we'll feel like it"? That's so reassuring that you respect your customers's privacy, Microsoft...Really solid privacy policy right there. [1] - http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/ http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privac...

Amezarak 11y ago
You left out the circumstances under which they will share your data. > comply with applicable law or respond to valid legal process, including from law enforcement or other government agencies; > protect our customers, for example to prevent spam or attempts to defraud users of the services, or to help prevent the loss of life or serious injury of anyone; > operate and maintain the security of our services, including to prevent or stop an attack on our computer systems or networks; or > protect the rights or property of Microsoft, including enforcing the terms governing the use of the services - however, if we receive information indicating that someone is using our services to traffic in stolen intellectual or physical property of Microsoft, we will not inspect a customer's private content ourselves, but we may refer the matter to law enforcement. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/default.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement/default.asp... Additionally, the privacy policy section you and I are quoting applies to many Microsoft services, including, for example, OneDrive. Otherwise, the "private folder" data they're talking about could only be whatever bits and scraps telemetry and Windows Defender picks up, based on my reading. That seems perfectly reasonable and also confirms they won't be sending any of your data to the MPAA.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- aikah 11y ago
  > That seems perfectly reasonable No that's not , and what is shocking is that you find it "perfectly reasonable".
  - Amezarak 11y ago
    That's literally a bog-standard privacy policy clause. You can find the essentially same four points on everything from Ubuntu to Wikimedia. Can you be more specific about which part of it you find particularly unreasonable? Can you explain how the claims that the privacy policy allows MS to share data with the MPAA are founded?
    - AlexandrB 11y ago
      Normally these kinds of terms appear on web services where the scope of disclosure is contained to the information you upload to the service (e.g. repos you upload to Github or posts you make to Reddit). Windows 10 is fundamentally different because the scope becomes everything the OS can suck up including everything on the hard drive and keystrokes from the keyboard. You no longer have the option not to disclose something because anything that shows up on the PC may be fair game. Privacy is all about controlling who gets to see what information. Windows 10, being an OS, removes your ability to control what is shared in any meaningful way with its privacy policy.
      - _lce0 11y ago
        > [...] becomes everything the OS can suck up including everything on the hard drive and keystrokes from the keyboard. Not just on the machine. It can scan the whole local network, understanding about LAN, devices, services, all of which could be hard to reach from WAN.
    - bonaldi 11y ago
      > Can you explain how the claims that the privacy policy allows MS to share data with the MPAA are founded? The MPAA could be a Microsoft "customer" that needs protection from piracy. The MPAA could run a service with Microsoft that needs protection from being "defrauded". There are holes in the policy large enough to drive a fleet of buses through.

belorn 11y ago

Privacy issues is all about scale. When groups of people can be mapped, it allows for discrimination and prosecution and that thought scares people into submission. Android and ChromeOS users are small minorities, while if you monitor all Windows users you more or less can map out the whole community, and that is a very scary thought for a lot of people.

sz4kerto 11y ago
> Privacy issues is all about scale I absolutely agree, but I don't see why Android users would be a minority -- I don't know the latest numbers but I guess there are more Android users already than Windows (10) users.
- rmk2 11y ago
  How many of those Android users use their Android devices for torrenting?
- bad_user 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure that people won't use their 3G / 4G mobile plan to download movies, music or the latest Linux ISOs from torrent sites on their smartphone with 16 / 32 GB of total storage.
  - KJasper 11y ago
    But they might just use their wifi connection ;)