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When was the myth born anyway? II. world war ended the depression and the job market became shortaged of workers - I'm sure those of that generation profited. B

by fsloth 11y ago

When was the myth born anyway? II. world war ended the depression and the job market became shortaged of workers - I'm sure those of that generation profited. Before that there was the campaign in the 1800:s to colonize the vacant fertile lands and farmers could get all the land they could farm dirt cheaply. But other than those two episodes - was there actually that much socio-economic mobility compared to other areas? In the mid 1800:s the americans were massively more literate than e.g. english (something like 80% compared to 50%?) so I can belive the comparable opportunities were much better in the US than in the UK but I'm short of statistics...

notahacker 11y ago
> In the mid 1800:s the americans were massively more literate than e.g. english (something like 80% compared to 50%?) If you compare the US figure for 1870 with the UK figure for 1820, perhaps, but in an era where both nations are noted to have seen significant rises in literacy that seems a tad unfair... In 1870 the figures were 80% and 76% respectively[1], hardly a "massive" difference and I'm not aware of any evidence or even arguments to the effect that US levels of literacy rose earlier or faster. The US certainly was exceptional in the mid 1800s in still having opportunities to stake out unclaimed fertile land, perhaps a more attractive route to prosperity than labouring in a British mill but then again until the 1860a it was also unusual in having a significant proportion of its population having no social mobility whatsoever on account of being slaves... [1]http://ourworldindata.org/data/education-knowledge/literacy/ http://ourworldindata.org/data/education-knowledge/literacy/
rst 11y ago
Post World War II, you had a bunch of other things leading to compression of the income distribution, from very high top marginal tax rates (90% through 1960; 70% through 1980) to low cost education (subsidized for just about everyone through better support than currently for good state schools -- and even more for returning troops in particular, a substantial fraction of all college-age men, through the GI bill). And of course, there were much stronger labor unions, present in most large workplaces. Anyone who thinks the '50s were a good time because they came before "big government" has managed to forget about the New Deal, the GI Bill, and a National Labor Relations Board that still had teeth. Among other things...
dredmorbius 11y ago
1940s is about right: https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=American+Dream&case_insensitive=on&year_start=1800&year_end=2000&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t4%3B%2CAmerican%20Dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%2Cs0%3B%3BAmerican%20Dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%3BAmerican%20dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%3BAMERICAN%20DREAM%3B%2Cc0 https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=American+Dream... Earlier instances would have been Manifest Destiny and the concept of progress, which emerged in the mid 19th century.

by fsloth 11y ago

notahacker 11y ago

> In the mid 1800:s the americans were massively more literate than e.g. english (something like 80% compared to 50%?) If you compare the US figure for 1870 with the UK figure for 1820, perhaps, but in an era where both nations are noted to have seen significant rises in literacy that seems a tad unfair... In 1870 the figures were 80% and 76% respectively[1], hardly a "massive" difference and I'm not aware of any evidence or even arguments to the effect that US levels of literacy rose earlier or faster. The US certainly was exceptional in the mid 1800s in still having opportunities to stake out unclaimed fertile land, perhaps a more attractive route to prosperity than labouring in a British mill but then again until the 1860a it was also unusual in having a significant proportion of its population having no social mobility whatsoever on account of being slaves... [1]http://ourworldindata.org/data/education-knowledge/literacy/ http://ourworldindata.org/data/education-knowledge/literacy/

rst 11y ago

Post World War II, you had a bunch of other things leading to compression of the income distribution, from very high top marginal tax rates (90% through 1960; 70% through 1980) to low cost education (subsidized for just about everyone through better support than currently for good state schools -- and even more for returning troops in particular, a substantial fraction of all college-age men, through the GI bill). And of course, there were much stronger labor unions, present in most large workplaces. Anyone who thinks the '50s were a good time because they came before "big government" has managed to forget about the New Deal, the GI Bill, and a National Labor Relations Board that still had teeth. Among other things...

dredmorbius 11y ago

1940s is about right: https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=American+Dream&case_insensitive=on&year_start=1800&year_end=2000&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t4%3B%2CAmerican%20Dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%2Cs0%3B%3BAmerican%20Dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%3BAmerican%20dream%3B%2Cc0%3B%3BAMERICAN%20DREAM%3B%2Cc0 https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=American+Dream... Earlier instances would have been Manifest Destiny and the concept of progress, which emerged in the mid 19th century.