5 ms·

As a minority[0]: I hate the idea of Jopwell. Fewer things have, in my opinion, done more harm for the professional perception of a minority person as the affir

by mildbow 11y ago

As a minority[0]: I hate the idea of Jopwell. Fewer things have, in my opinion, done more harm for the professional perception of a minority person as the affirmative action debacle[1]. Anything that says "hire more minorities, it's a good thing!!" automatically gets a black mark from me. [0] I don't presume to speak for us all :) [1] Edit: removed anecdote coz I don't want to spend the next hour talking about affirmative action.

gkoberger 11y ago
This isn't directly about hiring, however (as a white person) it shifted my perceptions significantly: https://www.reddit.com/comments/3du1qm/ https://www.reddit.com/comments/3du1qm/ In a few years, I want Jopwell to not exist anymore. Not that I'm rooting for them to fail, but rather that I hope every job site is equally diverse. But for now, we need to be intentional about this. Most companies hire from within their networks. So, this problem will solve itself eventually, as minorities start bringing their networks of potential hires to companies and the companies start naturally hiring from that new pool. However, it's a chicken-and-egg problem that needs a kick start.
- brador 11y ago
  I agree it's a problem, but there must be a better solution than simply excluding white males. Better education for all has been previously mentioned as the ideal solution, and it's the one I stand behind and support.
- aianus 11y ago
  Where have you worked where it was easier to get hired as a white man? Everyone in tech is already tripping over themselves trying to hire women and minorities. This 'company' is blatantly discriminatory and unnecessary and taints the success of their hires by making it appear they took a shortcut into their positions via their race/sex .
  - geofft 11y ago
    Anecdotally, judging from my friends in both categories, it's easier to get hired and promoted (implicit disclaimer: in the US tech scene) as a competent white man than as an equally-competent woman or racial/ethnic minority, if you are job-hunting. One of the side effects of entrenched racism and sexism is that competent women and minorities tend to be underemployed more than competent white men, and so as the biases are being broken down, you'll see way more women and minorities (compared to the ratios in the general population) being hired or promoted to the right place compared to white men. Out of people who are competent to be senior developers, way more white men than women or minorities already have a good job fit, and in turn, way fewer of them are on the job market or easily poachable. So the market, as a whole, can be biased in favor of hiring and promoting women and minorities without it being any easier for the individual developer who happens to be a woman or minority.
    - mildbow 11y ago
      The market as a whole is getting purpotedly pushed to hire minorities. Apparently. Is it working(in the tech sector)? Or, are they just making the white guys resentful and so making it harder in the long run? Not sure. But I don't think it's helping.
vfdfv 11y ago
If you don't mind me asking, what minority group do you belong too?
- mildbow 11y ago
  Hmm. One that prefers to not have to hold up a specific minority flag :) Think for a second: why does it matter what specific minority I am? Am I black? A woman? A black woman? Or one of those that doesn't get anywhere close to the media attention these do? Doesn't matter. Hire me for how I do the job. That's how prejudices are broken. Not by re-affirming prejudices by giving me handicap points.
  - vfdfv 11y ago
    Ok, I was not asking to try and undermine your point. Just curious...
    - mildbow 11y ago
      No problem: I wasn't trying to insinuate anything like that. My first inclination was to tell you, but then this is the internet: I could easily be Donald Trump or Barack Obama :) So, that made me consider why it would even matter, given the source isn't really trustworthy. But really, it probably matters because it gives people a reference point/image in their heads which makes thinking about such things a little easier. But, I'd rather not have readers think reflexively and instead think about how they might react. Not sure if that made sense :) tldr: I wasn't trying to insinuate anything underhanded in your comment :) I just thought that it might lead people to think a little more if my exact minority wasn't disclosed, rather than (however subconsciously) pattern matching me into a bucket.

by mildbow 11y ago

gkoberger 11y ago

This isn't directly about hiring, however (as a white person) it shifted my perceptions significantly: https://www.reddit.com/comments/3du1qm/ https://www.reddit.com/comments/3du1qm/ In a few years, I want Jopwell to not exist anymore. Not that I'm rooting for them to fail, but rather that I hope every job site is equally diverse. But for now, we need to be intentional about this. Most companies hire from within their networks. So, this problem will solve itself eventually, as minorities start bringing their networks of potential hires to companies and the companies start naturally hiring from that new pool. However, it's a chicken-and-egg problem that needs a kick start.

brador 11y ago
I agree it's a problem, but there must be a better solution than simply excluding white males. Better education for all has been previously mentioned as the ideal solution, and it's the one I stand behind and support.
aianus 11y ago
Where have you worked where it was easier to get hired as a white man? Everyone in tech is already tripping over themselves trying to hire women and minorities. This 'company' is blatantly discriminatory and unnecessary and taints the success of their hires by making it appear they took a shortcut into their positions via their race/sex .
- geofft 11y ago
  Anecdotally, judging from my friends in both categories, it's easier to get hired and promoted (implicit disclaimer: in the US tech scene) as a competent white man than as an equally-competent woman or racial/ethnic minority, if you are job-hunting. One of the side effects of entrenched racism and sexism is that competent women and minorities tend to be underemployed more than competent white men, and so as the biases are being broken down, you'll see way more women and minorities (compared to the ratios in the general population) being hired or promoted to the right place compared to white men. Out of people who are competent to be senior developers, way more white men than women or minorities already have a good job fit, and in turn, way fewer of them are on the job market or easily poachable. So the market, as a whole, can be biased in favor of hiring and promoting women and minorities without it being any easier for the individual developer who happens to be a woman or minority.
  - mildbow 11y ago
    The market as a whole is getting purpotedly pushed to hire minorities. Apparently. Is it working(in the tech sector)? Or, are they just making the white guys resentful and so making it harder in the long run? Not sure. But I don't think it's helping.

vfdfv 11y ago

If you don't mind me asking, what minority group do you belong too?

mildbow 11y ago
Hmm. One that prefers to not have to hold up a specific minority flag :) Think for a second: why does it matter what specific minority I am? Am I black? A woman? A black woman? Or one of those that doesn't get anywhere close to the media attention these do? Doesn't matter. Hire me for how I do the job. That's how prejudices are broken. Not by re-affirming prejudices by giving me handicap points.
- vfdfv 11y ago
  Ok, I was not asking to try and undermine your point. Just curious...
  - mildbow 11y ago
    No problem: I wasn't trying to insinuate anything like that. My first inclination was to tell you, but then this is the internet: I could easily be Donald Trump or Barack Obama :) So, that made me consider why it would even matter, given the source isn't really trustworthy. But really, it probably matters because it gives people a reference point/image in their heads which makes thinking about such things a little easier. But, I'd rather not have readers think reflexively and instead think about how they might react. Not sure if that made sense :) tldr: I wasn't trying to insinuate anything underhanded in your comment :) I just thought that it might lead people to think a little more if my exact minority wasn't disclosed, rather than (however subconsciously) pattern matching me into a bucket.