3 ms·

Far better is to not use Windows 10 and tell Microsoft why.

sparaker 11y ago
Couldn't agree more.
userbinator 11y ago
I wonder if Windows 7 support might last even longer than XP... no doubt there will be plenty of anger when MS decides to end support for 7/8 like they did with XP, but the best way to delay that is to vehemently refuse to "upgrade". ...and I am writing this on a machine running (a much customised version of) XP, which remains completely silent on the network and never produces any traffic unaccounted for.
- scholia 11y ago
  > when MS decides to end support for 7/8 Microsoft doesn't suddenly decide to end support for something: it has a well-established, pre-published software life-cycle where operating systems are supported for 10 years. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-GB/windows/lifecycle http://windows.microsoft.com/en-GB/windows/lifecycle There's always a chance that a date will be extended, but it wouldn't be a good plan to bet on it. Otherwise, I feel deeply sorry for you. Nobody should have to use inferior systems like Windows XP in this day and age. Presumably some badly-programmed bit of corporate junkware prevented you from upgraded to Windows 7 in 2009 .. ;-)
  - whoopdedo 11y ago
    XP is a solid enough system for limited use cases. Keep it behind a firewall and don't ever touch a browser, it will run forever without a glitch. I wouldn't call it "inferior". There may be things it can't do but if you're not going to use those features, so what? Upgrading a system just for the sake of upgrading is a waste of money. It's not just software tying a machine to XP but the hardware. A particular card may not have a 7 compatible driver. A penny-pinching executive will look at the very long number that is the cost of upgrading and decide to stay on XP and just replace parts (hard drive, monitor, etc.) as they break. Which may not be the smartest thing in the long run. I can see 7 lasting longer than XP as it's the last OS built primarily for traditional Win32 (Desktop) applications. 8 and 10 are transitioning to an OS for managed code and virtualization. If you have a legacy application you'll get the best experience on 7 (or XP, or Server 200X). All of the improvements to Windows are meant to make C# based programs work better. There isn't much to gain by upgrading an older codebase to the new OS. Of course people whose primary business is creating software think nothing of upgrading. To everyone else, writing new software is an expense. If the software you have does everything you need it to do, you're not going to rewrite it unless there is something to gain.
    - scholia 11y ago
      > stay on XP and just replace parts (hard drive, monitor, etc.) as they break. Which may not be the smartest thing in the long run. Aye, there's the rub. Based on enterprise-class calculations (staff time etc), the cost of keeping an old XP PC running is dramatically higher than replacing it. You can get a tiny desktop with 4GB and a 1TB drive for less than $300, and cut your electricity bill as well. In accounting terms, you may also save money by reducing reboots and fast start-up times, esp with UEFI. Whether Gartner averages apply in a specific case is, of course, an entirely different matter. And, of course, if you've got a hardware lock-in that's no help at all ;-) I agree with your final paras. We can see where Microsoft is heading. Where the world will actually be in 2020-25 is another matter....
      - whoopdedo 11y ago
        > Based on enterprise-class calculations (staff time etc), the cost of keeping an old XP PC running is dramatically higher than replacing it. You can get a tiny desktop with 4GB and a 1TB drive for less than $300, and cut your electricity bill as well. Have you seen how extremely short-sighted and quarterly report oriented some executives can be. You say "only" $300 but I regularly replace $30 hard drives (that I charge $80 for) and they thank me for it because I'm "saving" them $200.
        scholia 11y ago
        Sad but true ;-)
anta40 11y ago
Two days ago I just upgraded a laptop to Win 10, and for the sake of space saving (about 24 GB), I removed the "windows.old" http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/2066-windows-old-folder-delete-windows-10-a.html http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/2066-windows-old-folder-d... Now I regret cannot revert back to 7, without formatting. :(
ak39 11y ago
Any suggestions as to how? (Serious question)
- kozukumi 11y ago
  How not to use Windows 10? Well if you need to use Windows then stick with 7 or 8.1 (and disable installation of the recent telemetry updates pushed with Windows Update recently). If you don't need Windows but want support options then OS X is a fantastic platform too. Or if you are comfortable using an enterprise class OS but are ok with looking after yourself in terms of support then you have many excellent options with Linux such as Ubuntu and its spin-offs as well as Debian or Fedora both of which I have superb experiences with on modern desktops and laptops.
  - ak39 11y ago
    Meant, how do we all tell Microsoft about this? Are there public petitions etc?
    - kozukumi 11y ago
      You can raise this at https://windows.uservoice.com/forums/265757-windows-feature-suggestions https://windows.uservoice.com/forums/265757-windows-feature-...

Couldn't agree more.

I wonder if Windows 7 support might last even longer than XP... no doubt there will be plenty of anger when MS decides to end support for 7/8 like they did with XP, but the best way to delay that is to vehemently refuse to "upgrade". ...and I am writing this on a machine running (a much customised version of) XP, which remains completely silent on the network and never produces any traffic unaccounted for.

scholia 11y ago
> when MS decides to end support for 7/8 Microsoft doesn't suddenly decide to end support for something: it has a well-established, pre-published software life-cycle where operating systems are supported for 10 years. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-GB/windows/lifecycle http://windows.microsoft.com/en-GB/windows/lifecycle There's always a chance that a date will be extended, but it wouldn't be a good plan to bet on it. Otherwise, I feel deeply sorry for you. Nobody should have to use inferior systems like Windows XP in this day and age. Presumably some badly-programmed bit of corporate junkware prevented you from upgraded to Windows 7 in 2009 .. ;-)
- whoopdedo 11y ago
  XP is a solid enough system for limited use cases. Keep it behind a firewall and don't ever touch a browser, it will run forever without a glitch. I wouldn't call it "inferior". There may be things it can't do but if you're not going to use those features, so what? Upgrading a system just for the sake of upgrading is a waste of money. It's not just software tying a machine to XP but the hardware. A particular card may not have a 7 compatible driver. A penny-pinching executive will look at the very long number that is the cost of upgrading and decide to stay on XP and just replace parts (hard drive, monitor, etc.) as they break. Which may not be the smartest thing in the long run. I can see 7 lasting longer than XP as it's the last OS built primarily for traditional Win32 (Desktop) applications. 8 and 10 are transitioning to an OS for managed code and virtualization. If you have a legacy application you'll get the best experience on 7 (or XP, or Server 200X). All of the improvements to Windows are meant to make C# based programs work better. There isn't much to gain by upgrading an older codebase to the new OS. Of course people whose primary business is creating software think nothing of upgrading. To everyone else, writing new software is an expense. If the software you have does everything you need it to do, you're not going to rewrite it unless there is something to gain.
  - scholia 11y ago
    > stay on XP and just replace parts (hard drive, monitor, etc.) as they break. Which may not be the smartest thing in the long run. Aye, there's the rub. Based on enterprise-class calculations (staff time etc), the cost of keeping an old XP PC running is dramatically higher than replacing it. You can get a tiny desktop with 4GB and a 1TB drive for less than $300, and cut your electricity bill as well. In accounting terms, you may also save money by reducing reboots and fast start-up times, esp with UEFI. Whether Gartner averages apply in a specific case is, of course, an entirely different matter. And, of course, if you've got a hardware lock-in that's no help at all ;-) I agree with your final paras. We can see where Microsoft is heading. Where the world will actually be in 2020-25 is another matter....
    - whoopdedo 11y ago
      > Based on enterprise-class calculations (staff time etc), the cost of keeping an old XP PC running is dramatically higher than replacing it. You can get a tiny desktop with 4GB and a 1TB drive for less than $300, and cut your electricity bill as well. Have you seen how extremely short-sighted and quarterly report oriented some executives can be. You say "only" $300 but I regularly replace $30 hard drives (that I charge $80 for) and they thank me for it because I'm "saving" them $200.
      - scholia 11y ago
        Sad but true ;-)

anta40 11y ago

Two days ago I just upgraded a laptop to Win 10, and for the sake of space saving (about 24 GB), I removed the "windows.old" http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/2066-windows-old-folder-delete-windows-10-a.html http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/2066-windows-old-folder-d... Now I regret cannot revert back to 7, without formatting. :(

ak39 11y ago

Any suggestions as to how? (Serious question)

kozukumi 11y ago
How not to use Windows 10? Well if you need to use Windows then stick with 7 or 8.1 (and disable installation of the recent telemetry updates pushed with Windows Update recently). If you don't need Windows but want support options then OS X is a fantastic platform too. Or if you are comfortable using an enterprise class OS but are ok with looking after yourself in terms of support then you have many excellent options with Linux such as Ubuntu and its spin-offs as well as Debian or Fedora both of which I have superb experiences with on modern desktops and laptops.
- ak39 11y ago
  Meant, how do we all tell Microsoft about this? Are there public petitions etc?
  - kozukumi 11y ago
    You can raise this at https://windows.uservoice.com/forums/265757-windows-feature-suggestions https://windows.uservoice.com/forums/265757-windows-feature-...