4 ms·

they clearly don't care about their business customers, since this kind of childish behavior is a strict no-go for most companies with at least slightly decent

they clearly don't care about their business customers, since this kind of childish behavior is a strict no-go for most companies with at least slightly decent IT. Fair enough, they actually create big holes in the market that startups can eventually fill in. Albeit it won't be easy (replacing Active directory, Exchange and Office suites), rewards are worth it. With that, Microsoft as desktop and server solution provider is a history. Still not getting why they want to copy Google's revenue stream, when they have solid base in vastly different areas...

Silhouette 11y ago
I'm sure Microsoft care very much about their business customers, which is why this seems such an odd strategic move. As you say, why try to copy a company like Google's business model when they have their own well-established one? I'm half-wondering whether the plan has always been to prioritise the consumer market with Windows 10, and they're taking a reasonable punt on the fact that most businesses won't upgrade for a considerable time anyway, giving them enough opportunity to push out updates that address those businesses' concerns based on the early feedback before it really makes much difference. If that is the case then it's still possible that they have misjudged their market and they'll never fully recover from the negative initial reaction they've been receiving in recent weeks, but the strategy itself would be reasonably logical.
- scholia 11y ago
  Agreed. Windows 7 is still a current Microsoft product and I don't think Microsoft is expecting the bulk of enterprises to move until 2020, if not later. And since Windows 10 is to a large extent a move into remote PC management, Microsoft obviously wants to manage them with as much info as possible. Telemetry is the quid pro quo for free upgrades for the life of the device. The handful of geeks (somewhat less than a billion users) who are capable of managing their own systems obviously don't like this. However... > the negative initial reaction they've been receiving in recent weeks Public interest has been phenomenal, the reviews have been overwhelmingly positive, and most people seem to be very happy with it.
  - Silhouette 11y ago
    Telemetry is the quid pro quo for free upgrades for the life of the device. This is where I start to challenge what Microsoft should (as a matter of law and/or regulation) be allowed to get away with. As I've stated in other posts in this discussion, I think there is a reasonable expectation of support for a significant period for this kind of software product given that the only reason those updates are actually necessary is that the original product someone paid for was defective. We don't know how to write perfect software yet, but I don't think software companies should be allowed to ship defective software and then change the deal retrospectively in exchange for putting right what was their own mistake in the first place. Public interest has been phenomenal, the reviews have been overwhelmingly positive, and most people seem to be very happy with it. I wouldn't know. Among people I actually know personally in real life, whether professionally or friends and family, geeky or not, I'm aware of literally no-one who has actually installed Windows 10 other than for testing purposes. On the other hand, I do know plenty of people, again both professionally and personally and both geeks and not, who seem quite convinced that they don't want it for now in light of things like forced updates, privacy concerns, hesitation after being disappointed by the Windows 8 touch-biased UI, hearing about paying to hide ads just to play a game, and other negative aspects. Moreover, so far no-one I've talked to seems to have found any good, concrete reason to upgrade, other than the not-really reasons like "it's free" and "it's the new version". The occasional gamer mentions DirectX 12 and the occasional web developer mentions Edge as something they might need to test with, but the general reaction seems to be a resounding "meh" in the circles I move in. YMMV, of course. I'm also curious about where these positive reviews are, because the Internet I've been reading for the last few weeks has been one disaster story after another as far as Windows 10 coverage is concerned. In light of my previous point, I assume the Internet all those other people have been reading has looked similar. But again, YMMV.
    - scholia 11y ago
      I don't understand your opening para. Either way, I don't think defective software has anything to do with it. Microsoft keeps writing new versions for all sorts of reasons that have nothing to do with defects. Some are to add useful functionality, or ease of use, or to keep up with a changing world. Some are essentially changes in fashion. A quick google.... Windows 10 review: Why the new Start menu, Edge browser, new apps and Cortana make Windows 10 the best Windows yet http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/review/operating-systems-software/windows-10-review-best-3574736/ http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/review/operating-systems-software... Windows 10 review: The OS upgrade we've all been waiting for http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/134797-windows-10-review-the-os-upgrade-we-ve-all-been-waiting-for http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/134797-windows-10-review-t... Windows 10 review http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/software/operating-systems/windows-10-1267364/review http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/software/operating-s... Microsoft Windows 10 review 5 stars http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-systems/1403703/microsoft-windows-10-review http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-systems/14... Are you a Windows 8 user? Still using Windows 7? Either way, you'll love Windows 10. http://money.cnn.com/2015/02/22/technology/windows-10-review/ http://money.cnn.com/2015/02/22/technology/windows-10-review...

Silhouette 11y ago

I'm sure Microsoft care very much about their business customers, which is why this seems such an odd strategic move. As you say, why try to copy a company like Google's business model when they have their own well-established one? I'm half-wondering whether the plan has always been to prioritise the consumer market with Windows 10, and they're taking a reasonable punt on the fact that most businesses won't upgrade for a considerable time anyway, giving them enough opportunity to push out updates that address those businesses' concerns based on the early feedback before it really makes much difference. If that is the case then it's still possible that they have misjudged their market and they'll never fully recover from the negative initial reaction they've been receiving in recent weeks, but the strategy itself would be reasonably logical.

scholia 11y ago
Agreed. Windows 7 is still a current Microsoft product and I don't think Microsoft is expecting the bulk of enterprises to move until 2020, if not later. And since Windows 10 is to a large extent a move into remote PC management, Microsoft obviously wants to manage them with as much info as possible. Telemetry is the quid pro quo for free upgrades for the life of the device. The handful of geeks (somewhat less than a billion users) who are capable of managing their own systems obviously don't like this. However... > the negative initial reaction they've been receiving in recent weeks Public interest has been phenomenal, the reviews have been overwhelmingly positive, and most people seem to be very happy with it.
- Silhouette 11y ago
  Telemetry is the quid pro quo for free upgrades for the life of the device. This is where I start to challenge what Microsoft should (as a matter of law and/or regulation) be allowed to get away with. As I've stated in other posts in this discussion, I think there is a reasonable expectation of support for a significant period for this kind of software product given that the only reason those updates are actually necessary is that the original product someone paid for was defective. We don't know how to write perfect software yet, but I don't think software companies should be allowed to ship defective software and then change the deal retrospectively in exchange for putting right what was their own mistake in the first place. Public interest has been phenomenal, the reviews have been overwhelmingly positive, and most people seem to be very happy with it. I wouldn't know. Among people I actually know personally in real life, whether professionally or friends and family, geeky or not, I'm aware of literally no-one who has actually installed Windows 10 other than for testing purposes. On the other hand, I do know plenty of people, again both professionally and personally and both geeks and not, who seem quite convinced that they don't want it for now in light of things like forced updates, privacy concerns, hesitation after being disappointed by the Windows 8 touch-biased UI, hearing about paying to hide ads just to play a game, and other negative aspects. Moreover, so far no-one I've talked to seems to have found any good, concrete reason to upgrade, other than the not-really reasons like "it's free" and "it's the new version". The occasional gamer mentions DirectX 12 and the occasional web developer mentions Edge as something they might need to test with, but the general reaction seems to be a resounding "meh" in the circles I move in. YMMV, of course. I'm also curious about where these positive reviews are, because the Internet I've been reading for the last few weeks has been one disaster story after another as far as Windows 10 coverage is concerned. In light of my previous point, I assume the Internet all those other people have been reading has looked similar. But again, YMMV.
  - scholia 11y ago
    I don't understand your opening para. Either way, I don't think defective software has anything to do with it. Microsoft keeps writing new versions for all sorts of reasons that have nothing to do with defects. Some are to add useful functionality, or ease of use, or to keep up with a changing world. Some are essentially changes in fashion. A quick google.... Windows 10 review: Why the new Start menu, Edge browser, new apps and Cortana make Windows 10 the best Windows yet http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/review/operating-systems-software/windows-10-review-best-3574736/ http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/review/operating-systems-software... Windows 10 review: The OS upgrade we've all been waiting for http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/134797-windows-10-review-the-os-upgrade-we-ve-all-been-waiting-for http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/134797-windows-10-review-t... Windows 10 review http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/software/operating-systems/windows-10-1267364/review http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/software/operating-s... Microsoft Windows 10 review 5 stars http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-systems/1403703/microsoft-windows-10-review http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-systems/14... Are you a Windows 8 user? Still using Windows 7? Either way, you'll love Windows 10. http://money.cnn.com/2015/02/22/technology/windows-10-review/ http://money.cnn.com/2015/02/22/technology/windows-10-review...