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I feel like an open code of conduct is unnecessary. Really - the only thing you need to remember is - be nice to each other and be patient with those supplying

by nadams 11y ago

I feel like an open code of conduct is unnecessary. Really - the only thing you need to remember is - be nice to each other and be patient with those supplying advice and those who are asking for advice. (I have screenshots of discussions that violate this simple fundamental rule). I have flagged 40+ comments (that were accepted and acted upon) on stackoverflow alone of people just being stupid jerks. The SVN people did a great presentation about how to protect your project from poisonous people [1]. Their story goes is that someone came on the SVN mailing list ranting about how SVN sucks and doesn't have the features he wanted - according to the talk the SVN community was polite and the guy just went away. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q52kFL8zVoM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q52kFL8zVoM

jameskilton 11y ago
It shouldn't be necessary, but it is. We live in an age where if an action is not explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, because if it's not explicitly unacceptable, it's obviously acceptable. In short, if you don't say I can't abuse people, it's ok for me to abuse people. Oh, and these people will also happily throw around the "First Amendment" as justification, which makes me incredibly sad for the future of our nation. Solving that behavior though is incredibly difficult.
- deleted 11y ago
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- tomp 11y ago
  > We live in an age where if an action is not explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, because if it's not explicitly unacceptable, it's obviously acceptable. I don't think this is a good argument, because you might as well say We live in an age where if an action is explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, to protest the very idea that it was made explicitly unacceptable.
- curun1r 11y ago
  The reason they're unnecessary is that codes of conduct aren't legally enforceable and the resulting actions from violating them can be taken by the community regardless of whether they have a code of conduct. I agree with Bo Burnham when he said, "Who needs a thousand metaphors to realize you shouldn't be a dick?" [1] (or, in this case, a thousand prohibited behaviors) If someone does act in a way that is unacceptable, the community should, politely, explain to them that that sort of behavior isn't allowed and why it's not allowed, since often times people are communicating in a foreign language or are coming from a culture that has different norms. If the behavior persists, you take whatever action you would have taken had you had a code of conduct. Basically, there's no practical need for legal-level detail in a code of conduct, just use, "don't be a jerk." [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA (audio NSFW)
skarap 11y ago
> Really - the only thing you need to remember is - be nice to each other and be patient with those supplying advice and those who are asking for advice. Or even simpler - don't be an ass/jerk. I guess it's just hard to define...
chippy 11y ago
Is it just me, or does my reading this CoC say that not being nice is okay (and accepted and required) when dealing with people deemed not nice? This is what troubles me - I was brought up to be nice and behave well to others. We are more alike than different. To say "we should behave different to others who are different" and "we can behave as bad to others because they are different" is wrong and only leads to conflict and harm. Of course I could have read it wrong and am reading too much into it! BE KIND

by nadams 11y ago

jameskilton 11y ago

It shouldn't be necessary, but it is. We live in an age where if an action is not explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, because if it's not explicitly unacceptable, it's obviously acceptable. In short, if you don't say I can't abuse people, it's ok for me to abuse people. Oh, and these people will also happily throw around the "First Amendment" as justification, which makes me incredibly sad for the future of our nation. Solving that behavior though is incredibly difficult.

deleted 11y ago
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tomp 11y ago
> We live in an age where if an action is not explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, because if it's not explicitly unacceptable, it's obviously acceptable. I don't think this is a good argument, because you might as well say We live in an age where if an action is explicitly called out as unacceptable, a significant number of people will perform said action, to protest the very idea that it was made explicitly unacceptable.
curun1r 11y ago
The reason they're unnecessary is that codes of conduct aren't legally enforceable and the resulting actions from violating them can be taken by the community regardless of whether they have a code of conduct. I agree with Bo Burnham when he said, "Who needs a thousand metaphors to realize you shouldn't be a dick?" [1] (or, in this case, a thousand prohibited behaviors) If someone does act in a way that is unacceptable, the community should, politely, explain to them that that sort of behavior isn't allowed and why it's not allowed, since often times people are communicating in a foreign language or are coming from a culture that has different norms. If the behavior persists, you take whatever action you would have taken had you had a code of conduct. Basically, there's no practical need for legal-level detail in a code of conduct, just use, "don't be a jerk." [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA (audio NSFW)

skarap 11y ago

> Really - the only thing you need to remember is - be nice to each other and be patient with those supplying advice and those who are asking for advice. Or even simpler - don't be an ass/jerk. I guess it's just hard to define...

chippy 11y ago

Is it just me, or does my reading this CoC say that not being nice is okay (and accepted and required) when dealing with people deemed not nice? This is what troubles me - I was brought up to be nice and behave well to others. We are more alike than different. To say "we should behave different to others who are different" and "we can behave as bad to others because they are different" is wrong and only leads to conflict and harm. Of course I could have read it wrong and am reading too much into it! BE KIND