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I bet if you exposed another mammal like a monkey or a cat to that recharging tentacle, it would be frightened by it too. We are wired to be afraid of snakes an

I bet if you exposed another mammal like a monkey or a cat to that recharging tentacle, it would be frightened by it too. We are wired to be afraid of snakes and snaky things. It's one of the most common phobias. Sci-fi horror merely tapped into that fear.

eric_h 11y ago
> We are wired to be afraid of snakes and snaky things Are we really wired for it, though? I've personally never had that fear. Perhaps it's a little more nurture than nature? </anecdata>
- jonchang 11y ago
  "Experiment 1 results indicated that observer rhesus monkeys acquired a fear of snakes through watching videotapes of model monkeys behaving fearfully with snakes. In Experiment 2, observers watched edited videotapes that showed models reacting either fearfully to toy snakes and nonfearfully to artificial flowers (SN+/FL-) or vice versa (FL+/SN-). SN+/FL- observers acquired a fear of snakes but not of flowers; FL+/SN- observers did not acquire a fear of either stimulus. In Experiment 3, monkeys solved complex appetitive discriminative (PAN) problems at comparable rates regardless of whether the discriminative stimuli were the videotaped snake or the flower stimuli used in Experiment 2. Thus, monkeys appear to selectively associate snakes with fear." Experiment 1 shows that monkeys become afraid of snakes through watching videos of other monkeys being afraid of snakes. Experiment 2 shows that monkeys don't acquire a fear of flowers if shown a video of other monkeys being afraid of flowers. Experiment 3 shows that monkeys can still be conditioned in other tasks using videos of either flowers or snakes. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2230660 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2230660
  - nothis 11y ago
    So, is it obvious that monkeys aren't afraid of snakes if they never see other monkeys act afraid before? Because that's what I'd test first. Further, if there's a learned fear of snakes, that might not be coincidence, even if it's not genetic.
    - trevyn 11y ago
      Yep. From the actual paper referenced above: "Although considerable controversy has existed over the extent to which this fear of snakes is “innate” as opposed to based on learning, current evidence suggests that learning is necessary for the fear to manifest itself, at least for some primate species in which wild-reared but not laboratory-reared monkeys show a fear of snakes (see Mineka & Cook, 1988, for a review). For example, Mineka and Cook demonstrated that laboratory-reared rhesus monkeys who were initially unafraid of snakes rapidly acquired a fear of snakes after watching wild-reared model monkeys exhibit a strong fear of snakes (Cook, Mineka, Wolkenstein, & Laitsch, 1985; Mineka, Davidson, Cook, & Keir, 1984). The naive laboratory reared observers initially reached rapidly for food placed adjacent to a series of stimuli, including a real snake, toy snakes, and neutral objects."
      - tlarkworthy 11y ago
        My dog has instinctively done many high level things, peeing on tall things, sexing anything, responding to scolding despite I have never been violent to him, shaking water off with a weird reflex, pooing away from his home etc. It's like those behaviours are already preprogrammed. Being scared of certain classes of animals is no more.complex, I think humans probably have tons of preprogrammed behaviours we later add a narrative to. Perhaps belief in unseen agents is one of them.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- tim333 11y ago
  While its not very hacker news to post funny cat videos there's one here of one reacting in what looks like an anti snake way to a cucumber. I doubt the reaction was a learnt fear of cucumbers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62Ov_ptXsE8&feature=youtu.be&t=5s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62Ov_ptXsE8&feature=youtu.be...
- steveax 11y ago
  More anecdata... I was never afraid of snakes as a child (much to the dismay of my mother) nor am I now, but the times I've heard the rattle of a rattlesnake caused me to react in a way that was undeniably involuntary. Seemed pretty primal.
- aggie 11y ago
  'Wired for it' is a problematic term to use, as it is often interpreted to mean the outcome is deterministic. Humans are wired for noticing snakes. There are neurological mechanisms [1] that have evolved in humans to prioritize visual detection of snakes [2] and other common threat-related stimuli. I don't know what the science says about this perceptual mechanism being inherently linked to a fear response, but it would make sense given the hypothesized selection pressure that gave rise to it (i.e., not only noticing, but avoiding, the snake before it bites me raises the chances my genes will be passed on) 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_detection_(nervous_system) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_detection_(nervous_sys... 2 - http://childstudycenter.rutgers.edu/Publications_files/LoBue%20%26%20DeLoache,%202011_1.pdf http://childstudycenter.rutgers.edu/Publications_files/LoBue...
mhb 11y ago
Kids and adults are OK with stuffed lions and tigers. How does that fit in with the wiring theory?
- jlebar 11y ago
  It just suggests that we've evolved fears of some, but not all, things which are dangerous to us? An analogy might be, many people are afraid of heights, and fewer people are afraid of water. That's despite the fact that water is also dangerous. But none of this proves or disproves the notion that fear of heights may be "hardcoded".
- CydeWeys 11y ago
  Stuffed toys are exactly that, toys. They aren't representative of real lions and tigers in many ways, including most relevantly that they are cute, not ferocious, and are usually much smaller. If you had a lifelike stuffed tiger and you posed it in contexts where it wasn't immediately obvious that it wasn't real, I bet you'd get some amazing startle reactions. It sure works with dinosaurs, even though dinosaurs haven't existed for millions of years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSup2gj2Gn4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSup2gj2Gn4
  - true_religion 11y ago
    Yeah but that's the same startle reaction you'd get from any large object traveling towards. I bet if you just moved a steel beam at those speeds out at someone and had it track their position like the "dino" seemed to then they'd be startled too.
- Retric 11y ago
  That's size dependent plenty of kids fear life sized stuffed lions. Though this may go away with exposure.
- KJasper 11y ago
  The look like soft little puppies. Everybody loves and nurtures puppies.
jahnu 11y ago
Make it the arm of one of those bloody Minions and everyone will suddenly love it.

eric_h 11y ago

> We are wired to be afraid of snakes and snaky things Are we really wired for it, though? I've personally never had that fear. Perhaps it's a little more nurture than nature? </anecdata>

jonchang 11y ago
"Experiment 1 results indicated that observer rhesus monkeys acquired a fear of snakes through watching videotapes of model monkeys behaving fearfully with snakes. In Experiment 2, observers watched edited videotapes that showed models reacting either fearfully to toy snakes and nonfearfully to artificial flowers (SN+/FL-) or vice versa (FL+/SN-). SN+/FL- observers acquired a fear of snakes but not of flowers; FL+/SN- observers did not acquire a fear of either stimulus. In Experiment 3, monkeys solved complex appetitive discriminative (PAN) problems at comparable rates regardless of whether the discriminative stimuli were the videotaped snake or the flower stimuli used in Experiment 2. Thus, monkeys appear to selectively associate snakes with fear." Experiment 1 shows that monkeys become afraid of snakes through watching videos of other monkeys being afraid of snakes. Experiment 2 shows that monkeys don't acquire a fear of flowers if shown a video of other monkeys being afraid of flowers. Experiment 3 shows that monkeys can still be conditioned in other tasks using videos of either flowers or snakes. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2230660 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2230660
- nothis 11y ago
  So, is it obvious that monkeys aren't afraid of snakes if they never see other monkeys act afraid before? Because that's what I'd test first. Further, if there's a learned fear of snakes, that might not be coincidence, even if it's not genetic.
  - trevyn 11y ago
    Yep. From the actual paper referenced above: "Although considerable controversy has existed over the extent to which this fear of snakes is “innate” as opposed to based on learning, current evidence suggests that learning is necessary for the fear to manifest itself, at least for some primate species in which wild-reared but not laboratory-reared monkeys show a fear of snakes (see Mineka & Cook, 1988, for a review). For example, Mineka and Cook demonstrated that laboratory-reared rhesus monkeys who were initially unafraid of snakes rapidly acquired a fear of snakes after watching wild-reared model monkeys exhibit a strong fear of snakes (Cook, Mineka, Wolkenstein, & Laitsch, 1985; Mineka, Davidson, Cook, & Keir, 1984). The naive laboratory reared observers initially reached rapidly for food placed adjacent to a series of stimuli, including a real snake, toy snakes, and neutral objects."
    - tlarkworthy 11y ago
      My dog has instinctively done many high level things, peeing on tall things, sexing anything, responding to scolding despite I have never been violent to him, shaking water off with a weird reflex, pooing away from his home etc. It's like those behaviours are already preprogrammed. Being scared of certain classes of animals is no more.complex, I think humans probably have tons of preprogrammed behaviours we later add a narrative to. Perhaps belief in unseen agents is one of them.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
tim333 11y ago
While its not very hacker news to post funny cat videos there's one here of one reacting in what looks like an anti snake way to a cucumber. I doubt the reaction was a learnt fear of cucumbers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62Ov_ptXsE8&feature=youtu.be&t=5s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62Ov_ptXsE8&feature=youtu.be...
steveax 11y ago
More anecdata... I was never afraid of snakes as a child (much to the dismay of my mother) nor am I now, but the times I've heard the rattle of a rattlesnake caused me to react in a way that was undeniably involuntary. Seemed pretty primal.
aggie 11y ago
'Wired for it' is a problematic term to use, as it is often interpreted to mean the outcome is deterministic. Humans are wired for noticing snakes. There are neurological mechanisms [1] that have evolved in humans to prioritize visual detection of snakes [2] and other common threat-related stimuli. I don't know what the science says about this perceptual mechanism being inherently linked to a fear response, but it would make sense given the hypothesized selection pressure that gave rise to it (i.e., not only noticing, but avoiding, the snake before it bites me raises the chances my genes will be passed on) 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_detection_(nervous_system) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_detection_(nervous_sys... 2 - http://childstudycenter.rutgers.edu/Publications_files/LoBue%20%26%20DeLoache,%202011_1.pdf http://childstudycenter.rutgers.edu/Publications_files/LoBue...

mhb 11y ago

Kids and adults are OK with stuffed lions and tigers. How does that fit in with the wiring theory?

jlebar 11y ago
It just suggests that we've evolved fears of some, but not all, things which are dangerous to us? An analogy might be, many people are afraid of heights, and fewer people are afraid of water. That's despite the fact that water is also dangerous. But none of this proves or disproves the notion that fear of heights may be "hardcoded".
CydeWeys 11y ago
Stuffed toys are exactly that, toys. They aren't representative of real lions and tigers in many ways, including most relevantly that they are cute, not ferocious, and are usually much smaller. If you had a lifelike stuffed tiger and you posed it in contexts where it wasn't immediately obvious that it wasn't real, I bet you'd get some amazing startle reactions. It sure works with dinosaurs, even though dinosaurs haven't existed for millions of years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSup2gj2Gn4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSup2gj2Gn4
- true_religion 11y ago
  Yeah but that's the same startle reaction you'd get from any large object traveling towards. I bet if you just moved a steel beam at those speeds out at someone and had it track their position like the "dino" seemed to then they'd be startled too.
Retric 11y ago
That's size dependent plenty of kids fear life sized stuffed lions. Though this may go away with exposure.
KJasper 11y ago
The look like soft little puppies. Everybody loves and nurtures puppies.

jahnu 11y ago

Make it the arm of one of those bloody Minions and everyone will suddenly love it.