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So since some of the Greek fighters - meaning those who allied with the British against the Nazis, had communist ideals you assume that all they wanted was a vi

So since some of the Greek fighters - meaning those who allied with the British against the Nazis, had communist ideals you assume that all they wanted was a violent take over and establishing communism. And based on that assumption you justify the British for (a) arming Nazi collaborators and (b) opening fire against civilians in a peaceful demonstration. Well done!

mafribe 11y ago
Stalin was the General Secretary of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union's from 1922 until his death in 1953. In the years following Lenin's death in 1924, he became leader of the Soviet Union and the ComIntern. One cannot have been a communist in Europe in these times without being in an active supporter of Stalin. The ComIntern and essentially all European communist parties were under strict control of Moscow/Stalin. Those who opposed Stalin typically faced a violent end. Of course after Stalin's death and the concommitant weakening of communist power, most communists active during Stalin's times lied about their involvement.
- greenonion 11y ago
  You assume that all members of EAM/ELAS were communists. They were not. Also, there really was a window for them to take over: after the Nazis left and before the Allied forces arrived they were practically the only armed force in Greece. However they chose to wait. Mark Mazower's "Inside Hitler's Greece: The Experience of Occupation 1941-44" is an excellent book on the subject.
bobcostas55 11y ago
The communist party participated in the Greek government after Greece was liberated. The reason they quit? They disagreed with the disarmament of their military wing. Another thing that deserves mention is that the civil war actually started years before the Nazis left. The communists had been attacking not only the Nazis, but also right-wing resistance groups (EDES, PAO, EKKA)! The Brits actually brokered a ceasefire in early 1944, which the communists broke 2 months later by murdering resistance leader Psarros (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimitrios_Psarros https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimitrios_Psarros). There is no assuming involved; they didn't simply "want" a violent take over, they actually tried to do it and lost.
- greenonion 11y ago
  I think you are oversimplifying the events. I'm not suggesting there was nothing wrong with EAM. However, the article is about the British involvement that lead to the December '44 events. They freed and armed the Greeks who collaborated with the Nazi regime and they disarmed (or tried to disarm) only ELAS members. Of course Greek citizens would protest against that. And it was policemen armed by the British who opened fire against a peaceful crowd. I really can't see how you can justify this.
  - bobcostas55 11y ago
    >They freed and armed the Greeks who collaborated with the Nazi regime This is not really the case. Two "groups" were to be left armed (and transformed into a national army): the 3rd Greek Mountain Brigade and the Sacred Band. Both groups were formed by the Greek government in exile, and were under the control of the Greek government. Both groups fought in battles against the Nazis. There is no question of collaboration among them. As for the cops I'm sure there were collaborationists in their ranks, and obviously firing on the crowd was both wrong and a massive mistake. But this is no justification for anything the communists did.

mafribe 11y ago

Stalin was the General Secretary of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union's from 1922 until his death in 1953. In the years following Lenin's death in 1924, he became leader of the Soviet Union and the ComIntern. One cannot have been a communist in Europe in these times without being in an active supporter of Stalin. The ComIntern and essentially all European communist parties were under strict control of Moscow/Stalin. Those who opposed Stalin typically faced a violent end. Of course after Stalin's death and the concommitant weakening of communist power, most communists active during Stalin's times lied about their involvement.

greenonion 11y ago
You assume that all members of EAM/ELAS were communists. They were not. Also, there really was a window for them to take over: after the Nazis left and before the Allied forces arrived they were practically the only armed force in Greece. However they chose to wait. Mark Mazower's "Inside Hitler's Greece: The Experience of Occupation 1941-44" is an excellent book on the subject.

bobcostas55 11y ago

The communist party participated in the Greek government after Greece was liberated. The reason they quit? They disagreed with the disarmament of their military wing. Another thing that deserves mention is that the civil war actually started years before the Nazis left. The communists had been attacking not only the Nazis, but also right-wing resistance groups (EDES, PAO, EKKA)! The Brits actually brokered a ceasefire in early 1944, which the communists broke 2 months later by murdering resistance leader Psarros (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimitrios_Psarros https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimitrios_Psarros). There is no assuming involved; they didn't simply "want" a violent take over, they actually tried to do it and lost.

greenonion 11y ago
I think you are oversimplifying the events. I'm not suggesting there was nothing wrong with EAM. However, the article is about the British involvement that lead to the December '44 events. They freed and armed the Greeks who collaborated with the Nazi regime and they disarmed (or tried to disarm) only ELAS members. Of course Greek citizens would protest against that. And it was policemen armed by the British who opened fire against a peaceful crowd. I really can't see how you can justify this.
- bobcostas55 11y ago
  >They freed and armed the Greeks who collaborated with the Nazi regime This is not really the case. Two "groups" were to be left armed (and transformed into a national army): the 3rd Greek Mountain Brigade and the Sacred Band. Both groups were formed by the Greek government in exile, and were under the control of the Greek government. Both groups fought in battles against the Nazis. There is no question of collaboration among them. As for the cops I'm sure there were collaborationists in their ranks, and obviously firing on the crowd was both wrong and a massive mistake. But this is no justification for anything the communists did.