7 ms·

The Great Canadian Vowel Shift

68 points by slvv 11y ago

mirimir 11y ago
Interesting juxtaposition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
hockeybias 11y ago
I'm going to miss 'oot' and the rest. RIP
- xeper 11y ago
  "Soar-y" for sorry has always been my favorite. I've always associated that pronunciation with obnoxious child-actors since so many of the shows I grew up on were peopled almost entirely with Canadian actors/voice actors.
bentcorner 11y ago
> The English version of “baguette” stops rhyming with “vague-ette,” Coming from central Canada, "bag" always rhymes with "vague". I get funny looks sometimes when "lag" comes up in conversation here in the Pacific NW.
- ChrisGranger 11y ago
  By central Canada, do you mean Ontario? I've lived in Manitoba for decades and I don't know anyone who pronounces "bag" that way.
  - jonnathanson 11y ago
    I have a lot of relatives in the Midwestern U.S. (specifically Minnesota), and you encounter that pronunciation in that region. I have no idea if it spills over into Manitoba or Ontario, but if it does, the location seems right for it.
  - bentcorner 11y ago
    Raised in Winnipeg from a very early age. My wife who is also from Winnipeg speaks the same way.
  - anonbanker 11y ago
    Manitobans are the worst offfenders on the "bag"/"bayg" meter. If anything, it's the trademark of their accent. It isn't until I point it out do they hear it. anything that Americans (californians especially) say with the short A sound that ends with a hard consonant is liable to be mangled by a manitoban. If you aren't hearing it, it's because your accent is getting in the way (the one you probably swear you don't have). Ontario residents mangle their A sounds a little different. when you have an "ar" combination in a word, they pronounce it like "air", but as if you're simultaneously having a mild stroke. "Marnie had an Enlarged Heart" is always fun to hear one say.
- cfallin 11y ago
  Interesting, I thought that was a PNW (OR/WA/BC) thing (I've heard it described as the "Northwest vowel shift")? I say "bag" and "lag" rhyming with "vague" or "bagel" too, and I grew up in Oregon.
sandworm101 11y ago
The accents in north america are split east-west, not north-south. I'm from Vancouver but whenever I am in the eastern US they think I'm from california because I don't sound have the ontario/maritime accent they recognize as "canadian". "aboot" doesn’t exist in the west. Never has.
- kafkaesque 11y ago
  I'm in LA and every time someone finds out I'm Canadian, they say, "But you don't have an accent" or "You don't sound Canadian", and on the rare occasion, people refer to my Vancouver accent as "fake Canadian accent". I just half-smile or say "I don't know", instead of explaining how provincial their "typical Canadian accent" sounds to Vancouverites.
  - ekanes 11y ago
    > I just half-smile or say "I don't know" Can confirm, kafkaesque must be Canadian. My most Canadian moment was apologizing while jumping out of someone's way while they were barreling down the sidewalk on a skateboard.
  - sandworm101 11y ago
    I've been told that my accent isn't so much a sound, but a mode of speech. You can spot the Canadians in LA because they are the ones using complete sentences. There is a certain neutrality to the western-canadian accent, much like that of Minnesota. Take the word Going or anything else ending with ing. In much of the US it is pronounced "goin", dropping the g. In the UK it has become "going-g" ... they add an extra g sound. Right in the middle are the canadians and minnesotans who pronounce the word as written. Canadians, watch this vid to see the similarity with minnesota: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-BCxjYoOl0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-BCxjYoOl0 (I know this guy)
    - a3n 11y ago
      > There is a certain neutrality to the western-canadian accent, much like that of Minnesota. ??!? I don't think any American who isn't from the middle Northern tier can watch Fargo without at least noticing the accent, or cracking a mild smile. The accent was practically a character in the movie. However, TBH, I don't know if I know any Minnesotans, and I've never been there.
vt240 11y ago
It's a real life Pontypool ;-)
- hmhrex 11y ago
  That movie was great. Yay Canadian arts!
txru 11y ago
There are many more linguistically-oriented articles than usual today. I like it. Additionally, praat is really interesting software from the University of Amsterdam that allows you to analyze speech recordings and see what the vowels and consonants actually are. http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/ http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/
mijustin 11y ago
As a Western Canadian (who works with a lot of folks in California, Oregon and Colorado) one thing that gets pointed out all the time is my pronunciation of: - JavaScript - Americano - Pasta
- afhill 11y ago
  Yes! Pasta was one of the first words I learned to say differently when I moved from Edmonton to the US.
- refurb 11y ago
  Yup. Canadians often pronounce "a" as "ah" vs. "awh". A great is example of the Mazda brand. It's mahz-dah in Canada, but moz-duh in the US. Even the commercials pronounce it differently in each country.
afhill 11y ago
Hmm, I left Western Canada 15 years ago to move to Denver. I thought I had grown out of the accent, but now it seems the accent is catching up with me? I studied linguistics in school and was fascinated by the linguistic shifts in Germanic languages long ago. But it seems a shame for it to be happening now as pronunciation becomes homogenized.
microcolonel 11y ago
I spoke all of the examples at the beginning of the article, and I don't sound like any of the "new" examples; furthermore my mother was from the U.S., so I should sound more like them if anything. I've also lived on both coasts(as well as nearer the center), and honestly I don't remember anyone speaking like this. I've never actually heard "aboot" either. I don't actually see any references, so I'm not sure what "linguists" they're talking to.
Mankhool 11y ago
What a great thread - from one Canuck to all of you - "How's it goin' eh?"
- rdsnsca 11y ago
  In Nova Scotia the only people you hear saying eh are from Ontario, mostly from the Toronto area it seems.
bdchauvette 11y ago
For anyone who's curious about the stereotypical 'oot' and 'aboot' vowels, Wikipedia has a nice overview[1] of the phenomenon (Canadian Raising). [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_raising https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_raising
CurtMonash 11y ago
"These changes in the mouth are happening under our noses." :) Great line!

68 points by slvv 11y ago

Interesting juxtaposition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

hockeybias 11y ago

I'm going to miss 'oot' and the rest. RIP

xeper 11y ago
"Soar-y" for sorry has always been my favorite. I've always associated that pronunciation with obnoxious child-actors since so many of the shows I grew up on were peopled almost entirely with Canadian actors/voice actors.

bentcorner 11y ago

> The English version of “baguette” stops rhyming with “vague-ette,” Coming from central Canada, "bag" always rhymes with "vague". I get funny looks sometimes when "lag" comes up in conversation here in the Pacific NW.

ChrisGranger 11y ago
By central Canada, do you mean Ontario? I've lived in Manitoba for decades and I don't know anyone who pronounces "bag" that way.
- jonnathanson 11y ago
  I have a lot of relatives in the Midwestern U.S. (specifically Minnesota), and you encounter that pronunciation in that region. I have no idea if it spills over into Manitoba or Ontario, but if it does, the location seems right for it.
- bentcorner 11y ago
  Raised in Winnipeg from a very early age. My wife who is also from Winnipeg speaks the same way.
- anonbanker 11y ago
  Manitobans are the worst offfenders on the "bag"/"bayg" meter. If anything, it's the trademark of their accent. It isn't until I point it out do they hear it. anything that Americans (californians especially) say with the short A sound that ends with a hard consonant is liable to be mangled by a manitoban. If you aren't hearing it, it's because your accent is getting in the way (the one you probably swear you don't have). Ontario residents mangle their A sounds a little different. when you have an "ar" combination in a word, they pronounce it like "air", but as if you're simultaneously having a mild stroke. "Marnie had an Enlarged Heart" is always fun to hear one say.
cfallin 11y ago
Interesting, I thought that was a PNW (OR/WA/BC) thing (I've heard it described as the "Northwest vowel shift")? I say "bag" and "lag" rhyming with "vague" or "bagel" too, and I grew up in Oregon.

sandworm101 11y ago

The accents in north america are split east-west, not north-south. I'm from Vancouver but whenever I am in the eastern US they think I'm from california because I don't sound have the ontario/maritime accent they recognize as "canadian". "aboot" doesn’t exist in the west. Never has.

kafkaesque 11y ago
I'm in LA and every time someone finds out I'm Canadian, they say, "But you don't have an accent" or "You don't sound Canadian", and on the rare occasion, people refer to my Vancouver accent as "fake Canadian accent". I just half-smile or say "I don't know", instead of explaining how provincial their "typical Canadian accent" sounds to Vancouverites.
- ekanes 11y ago
  > I just half-smile or say "I don't know" Can confirm, kafkaesque must be Canadian. My most Canadian moment was apologizing while jumping out of someone's way while they were barreling down the sidewalk on a skateboard.
- sandworm101 11y ago
  I've been told that my accent isn't so much a sound, but a mode of speech. You can spot the Canadians in LA because they are the ones using complete sentences. There is a certain neutrality to the western-canadian accent, much like that of Minnesota. Take the word Going or anything else ending with ing. In much of the US it is pronounced "goin", dropping the g. In the UK it has become "going-g" ... they add an extra g sound. Right in the middle are the canadians and minnesotans who pronounce the word as written. Canadians, watch this vid to see the similarity with minnesota: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-BCxjYoOl0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-BCxjYoOl0 (I know this guy)
  - a3n 11y ago
    > There is a certain neutrality to the western-canadian accent, much like that of Minnesota. ??!? I don't think any American who isn't from the middle Northern tier can watch Fargo without at least noticing the accent, or cracking a mild smile. The accent was practically a character in the movie. However, TBH, I don't know if I know any Minnesotans, and I've never been there.

vt240 11y ago

It's a real life Pontypool ;-)

hmhrex 11y ago
That movie was great. Yay Canadian arts!

txru 11y ago

There are many more linguistically-oriented articles than usual today. I like it. Additionally, praat is really interesting software from the University of Amsterdam that allows you to analyze speech recordings and see what the vowels and consonants actually are. http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/ http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/

mijustin 11y ago

As a Western Canadian (who works with a lot of folks in California, Oregon and Colorado) one thing that gets pointed out all the time is my pronunciation of: - JavaScript - Americano - Pasta

afhill 11y ago
Yes! Pasta was one of the first words I learned to say differently when I moved from Edmonton to the US.
refurb 11y ago
Yup. Canadians often pronounce "a" as "ah" vs. "awh". A great is example of the Mazda brand. It's mahz-dah in Canada, but moz-duh in the US. Even the commercials pronounce it differently in each country.

afhill 11y ago

Hmm, I left Western Canada 15 years ago to move to Denver. I thought I had grown out of the accent, but now it seems the accent is catching up with me? I studied linguistics in school and was fascinated by the linguistic shifts in Germanic languages long ago. But it seems a shame for it to be happening now as pronunciation becomes homogenized.

microcolonel 11y ago

I spoke all of the examples at the beginning of the article, and I don't sound like any of the "new" examples; furthermore my mother was from the U.S., so I should sound more like them if anything. I've also lived on both coasts(as well as nearer the center), and honestly I don't remember anyone speaking like this. I've never actually heard "aboot" either. I don't actually see any references, so I'm not sure what "linguists" they're talking to.

Mankhool 11y ago

What a great thread - from one Canuck to all of you - "How's it goin' eh?"

rdsnsca 11y ago
In Nova Scotia the only people you hear saying eh are from Ontario, mostly from the Toronto area it seems.

bdchauvette 11y ago

For anyone who's curious about the stereotypical 'oot' and 'aboot' vowels, Wikipedia has a nice overview[1] of the phenomenon (Canadian Raising). [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_raising https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_raising

CurtMonash 11y ago

"These changes in the mouth are happening under our noses." :) Great line!