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Interesting, I think this idea should be explored more. Does anyone else think the "MBA Degree" market is rip for disruption? We've been seeing a huge flux of M

by esturk 11y ago

Interesting, I think this idea should be explored more. Does anyone else think the "MBA Degree" market is rip for disruption? We've been seeing a huge flux of MBA graduates that gets hired for mainly their network or connection. This seems almost opposite to the whole meritocracy culture in the tech industry. So given a manager/employee could do effectively what a MBA can do, why would a company hire a MBA degree instead?

eru 11y ago
What's wrong with hiring for network and connections? (If they actually do contribute to the bottom line of the company.)
- Jare 11y ago
  They are finite. Hire for the ability to create valuable networks and connections, not for the few contacts that someone got in exceptional circumstances (like studying an MBA).
illuminek 11y ago
Well I am an MBA(IT)[+ Mechanical Engg.], and right now I am managing some 15+ people engg team. I can very confidently say that being an MBA has helped me a lot. It gave me an insight in being a leader and made my job of managing a engineering team easy. However I started my career as developer and have spent 7+ years in developing complex systems. The one difference I could always notice was leadership/initiative distinction between me and other developers and I used to think why these guys are not able to manage their time and guide their juniors. Simply they were not able to think beyond code(I am not generalising but the pattern I noticed with obvious exceptions).
- eitally 11y ago
  Counterpoint: I'm not an MBA but I have a BA in history and a MEng in Industrial, and I spent the first 5 years of my career as a programmer before moving into management. I steadily moved up and am reporting to the CIO and managing 115+ folks. As my old boss said, you can learn the key skills of an MBA on your own, but you can't learn emotional intelligence or how to lead without practical experience. I'm not saying your MBA hasn't helped you. I'm just saying it's not a magic bullet (unless a company requires an MBA to get in the door). For most situations, just having a basic understanding of accounting & finance is enough, and for the times it isn't, knowing how to organize and lead a large multidisciplinary project is. That part's tougher and all the theoretical knowledge & case study readings in the world will only get you so far.
  - illuminek 11y ago
    Agreed. MBA just helped me a bit, but I guess most of my career is a result of coding & sitting with fellow programmers spending nights and learning vudu tricks.
choppaface 11y ago
MBAs can be particularly useful at extracting value from an existing product / solution, fielding complicated legal / accounting issues, ensuring communication within large companies has high (or at least respectable) signal-to-noise, executing M&A / partnerships, working with outside partners or services... There are well-defined scenarios where an MBA has some value. Agree with you that managing developers is typically not one of these scenarios, but I don't believe b-schools typically frame MBA programs as a means to teach management of people but rather management of well-known business problems. A good proportion of managers get promoted due to necessity rather than merit (as mentioned a the beginning of the OP). This issue is more conspicuous now that employees of fast-growing companies are more open about this issue and have time to blog about it (as growth has become somewhat more efficient). Would love to see the space of engineering management get "disrupted" by high-quality, community-reviewed, and freely available publications. Might not 'kill MBAs' but will help people decide if they even need an MBA.
- msravi 11y ago
  > MBAs can be particularly useful at extracting value from an existing product / solution, fielding complicated legal / accounting issues, ensuring communication within large companies has high (or at least respectable) signal-to-noise, executing M&A / partnerships, working with outside partners or services... As can engineers. Aside from the presumption that MBAs want to and are hired to do this kind of stuff, and will put in 100% of their time doing it, there's no exceptional value that the MBA education in itself brings, IMHO. Most of this is stuff that a reasonably smart person would be expected to pick up on the job. The MBA does not learn enough finance/accountancy to do a CFO/accountant's job, nor does he learn enough to do a lawyer's job...
pbreit 11y ago
Things like YC and startups in general are already disrupting the MBA market. Far better use of time and money to just go start/operate a business.

by esturk 11y ago

eru 11y ago

What's wrong with hiring for network and connections? (If they actually do contribute to the bottom line of the company.)

Jare 11y ago
They are finite. Hire for the ability to create valuable networks and connections, not for the few contacts that someone got in exceptional circumstances (like studying an MBA).

illuminek 11y ago

Well I am an MBA(IT)[+ Mechanical Engg.], and right now I am managing some 15+ people engg team. I can very confidently say that being an MBA has helped me a lot. It gave me an insight in being a leader and made my job of managing a engineering team easy. However I started my career as developer and have spent 7+ years in developing complex systems. The one difference I could always notice was leadership/initiative distinction between me and other developers and I used to think why these guys are not able to manage their time and guide their juniors. Simply they were not able to think beyond code(I am not generalising but the pattern I noticed with obvious exceptions).

eitally 11y ago
Counterpoint: I'm not an MBA but I have a BA in history and a MEng in Industrial, and I spent the first 5 years of my career as a programmer before moving into management. I steadily moved up and am reporting to the CIO and managing 115+ folks. As my old boss said, you can learn the key skills of an MBA on your own, but you can't learn emotional intelligence or how to lead without practical experience. I'm not saying your MBA hasn't helped you. I'm just saying it's not a magic bullet (unless a company requires an MBA to get in the door). For most situations, just having a basic understanding of accounting & finance is enough, and for the times it isn't, knowing how to organize and lead a large multidisciplinary project is. That part's tougher and all the theoretical knowledge & case study readings in the world will only get you so far.
- illuminek 11y ago
  Agreed. MBA just helped me a bit, but I guess most of my career is a result of coding & sitting with fellow programmers spending nights and learning vudu tricks.

choppaface 11y ago

MBAs can be particularly useful at extracting value from an existing product / solution, fielding complicated legal / accounting issues, ensuring communication within large companies has high (or at least respectable) signal-to-noise, executing M&A / partnerships, working with outside partners or services... There are well-defined scenarios where an MBA has some value. Agree with you that managing developers is typically not one of these scenarios, but I don't believe b-schools typically frame MBA programs as a means to teach management of people but rather management of well-known business problems. A good proportion of managers get promoted due to necessity rather than merit (as mentioned a the beginning of the OP). This issue is more conspicuous now that employees of fast-growing companies are more open about this issue and have time to blog about it (as growth has become somewhat more efficient). Would love to see the space of engineering management get "disrupted" by high-quality, community-reviewed, and freely available publications. Might not 'kill MBAs' but will help people decide if they even need an MBA.

msravi 11y ago
> MBAs can be particularly useful at extracting value from an existing product / solution, fielding complicated legal / accounting issues, ensuring communication within large companies has high (or at least respectable) signal-to-noise, executing M&A / partnerships, working with outside partners or services... As can engineers. Aside from the presumption that MBAs want to and are hired to do this kind of stuff, and will put in 100% of their time doing it, there's no exceptional value that the MBA education in itself brings, IMHO. Most of this is stuff that a reasonably smart person would be expected to pick up on the job. The MBA does not learn enough finance/accountancy to do a CFO/accountant's job, nor does he learn enough to do a lawyer's job...

pbreit 11y ago

Things like YC and startups in general are already disrupting the MBA market. Far better use of time and money to just go start/operate a business.